I was just wondering how many people on here are still doing RC5? I wonder how much further till it is over.
Thoughts on RC5
- Thread starter awal
- Start date
ViRGE
Elite Member, Moderator Emeritus
- Oct 9, 1999
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I'm still doing it of course, but for the most part, I'm in the minority. The RC5 team is mostly stagnent, as we've lost people and are keeping where we are by adding power. That's ok though, since we'll definately have defeated RC5 by the end of the year.
At this point in the RC5 race do you think it is possible that someone has found the right block but not returned. I used to keep blocks for a week before flushing.... It just seems odd that we have readched this far and have not found it.
_o/!
After I reach 20k eccp, I'm going to switch everything I have to rc5 for the final push to get it over with. Almost 3 years with rc5 now :Q
After I reach 20k eccp, I'm going to switch everything I have to rc5 for the final push to get it over with. Almost 3 years with rc5 now :Q
I have switched back to RC5. Assuming we still have to find the correct key, now would be a good time to have as much team power on the job so that we get it and show the DPC, et al, that TA is the best.
Personally I dont see the need for RC5 any more. Taking 3 years to do it hasn't helped much to disprove its ability, and considering the fact that there are stronger forms of encryption out there I dont see a random bunch of people trying brute force attempts having much success at getting through some encryption. Of course, there are always the few that will have special hardware and techniques.
Maybe in a couple of years when computing power has gone up another step, it would be interesting to break out a new RC5 challenge, but for the immediate future it wouldn't surprise me if there was no follow on RC5-68 contest.
Personally I dont see the need for RC5 any more. Taking 3 years to do it hasn't helped much to disprove its ability, and considering the fact that there are stronger forms of encryption out there I dont see a random bunch of people trying brute force attempts having much success at getting through some encryption. Of course, there are always the few that will have special hardware and techniques.
Maybe in a couple of years when computing power has gone up another step, it would be interesting to break out a new RC5 challenge, but for the immediate future it wouldn't surprise me if there was no follow on RC5-68 contest.
mechBgon
Super Moderator<br>Elite Member
- Oct 31, 1999
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Another aspect of the RC5-64 project is that the first words of the message are known, which is how the correct key can be identified: it will give the known words published by RSA Labs.
Imagine if the first words of the message were not known, which would be the case if someone were trying to crack a real-world RC5-encrypted message. If that were the case, someone would have to manually check any keys that produced intelligible English messages (or whatever language). Granted, some kind of hacked spell-checking program could weed out the gibberish, but a simple cipher added to scramble the correct message into apparent gibberish, prior to encryption, would compound the procedure into oblivion.
A cryptographer I ain't. I'm sure there's more to it than I realize. At any rate, it will be interesting to see who finds the correct key and what projects will follow. One of these days they need to get around to announcing the proven 24-mark OGR too.
Imagine if the first words of the message were not known, which would be the case if someone were trying to crack a real-world RC5-encrypted message. If that were the case, someone would have to manually check any keys that produced intelligible English messages (or whatever language). Granted, some kind of hacked spell-checking program could weed out the gibberish, but a simple cipher added to scramble the correct message into apparent gibberish, prior to encryption, would compound the procedure into oblivion.
A cryptographer I ain't.
I'm sure there's more to it than I realize. At any rate, it will be interesting to see who finds the correct key and what projects will follow. One of these days they need to get around to announcing the proven 24-mark OGR too.
mechBgon
Super Moderator<br>Elite Member
- Oct 31, 1999
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OGR-24 still shows as an "active" project, with 125GNodes completed yesterday. The OGR-24 page doesn't say that they declared a 24-mark OGR, so it appears that they're still verifying it or something.
I was thinking about this the other day...
why place the key in the last 25%? wouldn't that mean if someone analyzed the key space from the end they would find it relatively fast?
wouldn't it make more sense for dnet to distribute the key space from the end and start equally, so worst case scenario the key would be found in the middle? it just seems like the whole approach to finding the key was wrong, especially for such a large data space.
why place the key in the last 25%? wouldn't that mean if someone analyzed the key space from the end they would find it relatively fast?
wouldn't it make more sense for dnet to distribute the key space from the end and start equally, so worst case scenario the key would be found in the middle? it just seems like the whole approach to finding the key was wrong, especially for such a large data space.
I have some wild cattle still wandering around. I've moved to other projects for my domesticated cattle though.
Here's one gent who thinks the key was lost in a corrupted packet. :Q
I'm gonna be laughing my head off if they actually get to 100% with no key found!
I'm gonna be laughing my head off if they actually get to 100% with no key found!
I'm running it as a screen saver on my grandma's computer. It sends in results about once a week.
<< I was thinking about this the other day... why place the key in the last 25%? wouldn't that mean if someone analyzed the key space from the end they would find it relatively fast? wouldn't it make more sense for dnet to distribute the key space from the end and start equally, so worst case scenario the key would be found in the middle? it just seems like the whole approach to finding the key was wrong, especially for such a large data space. >>
They didnt 'place' it. As far as I know, its in a completely random spot in the key-space. Its a random number within the range of possible keys..
So for example, if the keyspace was.. 1,000 keys long.. the encryption key is randomly chosen to be any number within that 0-1,000 range..
<< I wonder how long it would take for network man to come in and trash rc5:disgust: >>
Just ignore him, he's doing something like seti afterall
Actually, it is not impossible for the correct packet/key to have been lost.
Due to the bueaty of competition and continual hardware releases, overclocking is now getting more and more common. Just think, out of those 1,000,000,000+ cycles per second on a logic circuit straining through heat and lack of voltage, all it takes is for one of the gates to not switch fast enough and thats it...... key gone.
Obviously the odds are stacked against such a thing, there are only a small percentage of overclocked or naturally unstable machines, and these are not always cracking RC5, and most times if RC5 goes wrong it will crash the machine.
Ultimately D.net probably wont care all that much if the key isn't found. Sure, pride will be lost, but over these past few years they are a non-profit organisation who have made fairly small gains. Contrast that with some of the cancer/genome research projects where I'm guessing money has been put into with the complete possibility that 1000's of computers across the world will not yield cures/answers and would hence appreciate accurate information.
Due to the bueaty of competition and continual hardware releases, overclocking is now getting more and more common. Just think, out of those 1,000,000,000+ cycles per second on a logic circuit straining through heat and lack of voltage, all it takes is for one of the gates to not switch fast enough and thats it...... key gone.
Obviously the odds are stacked against such a thing, there are only a small percentage of overclocked or naturally unstable machines, and these are not always cracking RC5, and most times if RC5 goes wrong it will crash the machine.
Ultimately D.net probably wont care all that much if the key isn't found. Sure, pride will be lost, but over these past few years they are a non-profit organisation who have made fairly small gains. Contrast that with some of the cancer/genome research projects where I'm guessing money has been put into with the complete possibility that 1000's of computers across the world will not yield cures/answers and would hence appreciate accurate information.
Come on bot & Postman... Do you really think networkman is purposly trashing rc5? Notice the " " at the end of his unedited post?
I think he brings up a valid point though. What if the key was somehow already searched and lost? What would the next step be?
" at the end of his unedited post?I think he brings up a valid point though. What if the key was somehow already searched and lost? What would the next step be?
Heh I had too in my post. I don't mind, we all have our favourite obsession .
And if the rc5-64 key is not found.. Oh well yet another reason to get drunk
too in my post. I don't mind, we all have our favourite obsession .And if the rc5-64 key is not found.. Oh well yet another reason to get drunk
wouldn't it make more sense for dnet to distribute the key space from the end and start equally, so worst case scenario the key would be found in the middle?
LOL, but it takes you twice as long to get there It' doesn't matter where you start, the key is randomly placed (although I've often wondered if they didn't put that sucker at the end just to spite)
LOL, but it takes you twice as long to get there
It' doesn't matter where you start, the key is randomly placed (although I've often wondered if they didn't put that sucker at the end just to spite)And if the rc5-64 key is not found.. Oh well yet another reason to get drunk
Speak for yourself. I'd condider it just another good reason to stay drunk
Speak for yourself. I'd condider it just another good reason to stay drunk
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