Thoughts on my gaming pc build?

[Xerin7]

Purpose: Gaming (including multithread support for Witcher 3, Civ, etc.)
Budget: $3k
Location: U.S.
Overclock: Moderate

http://pcpartpicker.com/p/6D8WmG

Please let me know your thoughts on this build. A few questions:

1) Will my current power supply be sufficient (SeaSonic M12II 620W)

2) Should I pay a little more for faster RAM?

3) Should I consider M.2 for SSD? I'm already maxed out on space for my current HD/SSD so am leaning toward the 960GB Crucial, but I would consider something faster and smaller if it gives better gaming performance

4) I've heard bad things about the sound implementation on the SLI Plus. Do I need a separate sound card? Also, any concerns about running in SLI since the slots are apparently closer together than on the more expensive boards?

5) Do I need a separate cooler for my CPU for a mild overclock? For some reason PCPartPicker says the cpu doesn't come with a stock cooler but I don't believe that's correct

6) Any reason to go with Windows 8.1 Pro instead of 8.1?

Thanks for your help

 

[Seba]

6) Any reason to go with Windows 8.1 Pro instead of 8.1?

Not for me.

But do no get the OEM version of Windows 8.1. Buy the Retail/FPP version instead (because this Retail version is transferable to another PC and the price difference is minor in case of Windows 8.1).

 

[mfenn]

1) Will my current power supply be sufficient (SeaSonic M12II 620W)

It'll be a little thin for dual-GPU and an overclocked Socket 2011-3 processor. The Seasonic-built XFX Core 850W for $94 AR would be good.

2) Should I pay a little more for faster RAM?

No, in fact you're already paying too much for the RAM you've picked out. Right now we're at the bleeding-edge, most expensive point in the DDR4 price curve, get something no-frills, but quality to hold you over. This plain-Jane Crucial DDR4 2133 kit costs $209.

3) Should I consider M.2 for SSD? I'm already maxed out on space for my current HD/SSD so am leaning toward the 960GB Crucial, but I would consider something faster and smaller if it gives better gaming performance

The thing to always keep in mind about M.2 is that it's a physical form factor and nothing more. The currently-available and bootable M.2 SSDs are normal SATA drives in a different shape. Regarding the drive you picked out, the M500 will work fine, but it is a little slow compared to newer drives like the Samsung 840 EVO 1TB for $450.

4) I've heard bad things about the sound implementation on the SLI Plus. Do I need a separate sound card? Also, any concerns about running in SLI since the slots are apparently closer together than on the more expensive boards?

I haven't see anything in particular regarding the sound on that board. Link?

Regarding spacing, you don't have to use the two slots that are closest to each other. In fact, the SLI bridge that MSI provides is meant to go between the 1st and 3rd x16 slots.

5) Do I need a separate cooler for my CPU for a mild overclock? For some reason PCPartPicker says the cpu doesn't come with a stock cooler but I don't believe that's correct

PCPP is correct, Socket 2011(-3) CPUs do not come with coolers. It says so right on the Newegg page (Cooling device not included - Processor Only). A Hyper 212 EVO is fine for stock or a mild overclock.

6) Any reason to go with Windows 8.1 Pro instead of 8.1?

Probably not, here's a table with the differences. You only need to go for Pro if it has a feature that you need and isn't in the normal version. I agree with Seba though, given OEM and non-OEM pricing for Windows 8(.1), there is no real reason to accept the restrictions imposed by the OEM license.

Overall, my comment on your build is, "do you really need to go for Socket 2011"? You're paying a large premium in terms of expensive motherboards and RAM for a processor that's ~25% faster than an i7 4790K in the the most perfectly-threaded applications (which games are not and will not be any time soon).

 

[Xerin7]

Seba, good point on the retail version of 8.1. I wish 9.0 was out already, but don't want to wait for it.

Thanks Mfenn as always. Every time I do a new build you're there to set me straight lol.

I updated my build to include the XFX Core 850W. Will this power supply be future proof or am I better off getting a more expensive power supply? It's cheaper in the long run if I can transfer my power supply to my new rig in 3 years rather than having to get a new one each time.

I also updated my memory to your recommendation. 4x4 is better than 2x8 right?

I didn't realize the current M.2 drives don't take advantage of the M.2 x 4 capability of the new X99 boards. Much better deal on the Samsung SSD, I updated my list to include that instead of the Crucial.

I haven't see anything in particular regarding the sound on that board. Link?

http://us.hardware.info/reviews/560...review-new-boards-for-haswell-e-sound-quality

Regardless of the above, it shows that MSI has chosen for the lesser quality codec on the X9SS SLI Plus, the ALC 892... We think the X99 SLI plus is a perfect entry board, but we would have preferred a audio solution based on the ALC1150. If you prioritize sound implementation and a headphone amplifier, we recommend the ASRock, if not the MSI X99 SLI Plus is the best affordable X99 board.

On the GPU spacing:

http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/2014/09/09/x99-motherboard-group-test-asrock-asus-e/5

If you're thinking about dropping in several graphics cards, though, MSI hasn't taken the Gigabyte and Asus approach of spacing the high-speed slots for better cooling. You're limited to the top two slots for two-card setups, not really offering enough clearance for air-cooled systems, plus you'll be covering both 1x PCI-E slots too.

Is this incorrect then? Probably not a big deal for me either way, since I won't be doing heavy overclocking.

Overall, my comment on your build is, "do you really need to go for Socket 2011"? You're paying a large premium in terms of expensive motherboards and RAM for a processor that's ~25% faster than an i7 4790K in the the most perfectly-threaded applications (which games are not and will not be any time soon).

I considered both options, but decided on Haswell-E because I will be playing games that utilize n-threads (Civ V: Beyond Earth, Witcher 3) and hopefully more will come out in the next 3 years or so before my next build.

 

[mistersprinkles]

1) Will my current power supply be sufficient (SeaSonic M12II 620W)

ABSOLUTELY NOT. AIM FOR 850W>>

2) Should I pay a little more for faster RAM?

NOT A TERRIBLE IDEA

3) Should I consider M.2 for SSD? I'm already maxed out on space for my current HD/SSD so am leaning toward the 960GB Crucial, but I would consider something faster and smaller if it gives better gaming performance

THIS SOUNDS LIKE A GAMING RIG. DON'T BOTHER. SATA III IS FINE

4) I've heard bad things about the sound implementation on the SLI Plus. Do I need a separate sound card? Also, any concerns about running in SLI since the slots are apparently closer together than on the more expensive boards?

I DONT LIKE THE BOARD YOU CHOSE. LOOK AT ASUS' X99-A

5) Do I need a separate cooler for my CPU for a mild overclock? For some reason PCPartPicker says the cpu doesn't come with a stock cooler but I don't believe that's correct

YES. SOCKET 2011 CHIPS DO NOT INCLUDE A STOCK COOLER. IT IS AN ENTHUSIAST PART. YOU ARE EXPECTED TO BUY A PREMIUM COOLER AND OVERCLOCK THE CHIP.

6) Any reason to go with Windows 8.1 Pro instead of 8.1?

NOT FOR A GAMER

7) (I added this one as per your previous post) is 2x8 GB as good as 4x4GB?

NO. THIS IS X99. QUAD CHANNEL RAM. USE 4 or 8 IDENTICAL STICKS OF RAM.

HTH

 

[Xerin7]

Thanks mistersprinkles, what speed would you recommend for the RAM? The Asus X99-A looks like it has better sound implementation, what don't you like about the SLI Plus?

Also what cooler do you recommend for mild-moderate OC?

 

[mistersprinkles]

The cheapest RAM for X99 is the Micron 2133Mhz stuff. Personally I'd go with 2666, but it'll cost you. If you're trying to keep it under budget 2133 will be fine.

I like the looks of the ASUS board, and the better sound. Also I THINK (not sure) that the chokes in the power section on the ASUS board are higher end.

For cooling I'd get the Corsair H100i or H110, depending on whether you can fit 240 or 280mm rads in your case.

 

[mfenn]

I updated my build to include the XFX Core 850W. Will this power supply be future proof or am I better off getting a more expensive power supply? It's cheaper in the long run if I can transfer my power supply to my new rig in 3 years rather than having to get a new one each time.

More expensive does not necessarily mean better. As you can tell from the Maxwell coverage, Nvidia is going for a mobile-first approach to GPU development, just like Intel is with CPU development. I don't expect power requirements to increase over the course of the next several years, if anything they are moving in the other direction.

I also updated my memory to your recommendation. 4x4 is better than 2x8 right?

For Haswell-E, yes you want at least 4 DIMMs to take advantage of the quad-channel memory architecture. In response to some of the other advice given here, I'll reiterate that you shouldn't pay a premium for fast RAM in general, especially not first run DDR4, where the premium is even higher.

http://us.hardware.info/reviews/560...review-new-boards-for-haswell-e-sound-quality

That boils down to "yes, they used ALC892 instead of ALC1150." There is no actual issue with the sound implementation, it's just using a less expensive codec.

On the GPU spacing:

http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/2014/09/09/x99-motherboard-group-test-asrock-asus-e/5

Is this incorrect then? Probably not a big deal for me either way, since I won't be doing heavy overclocking.

No, they're right about that. I misread the PCIe slot labels.

I considered both options, but decided on Haswell-E because I will be playing games that utilize n-threads (Civ V: Beyond Earth, Witcher 3) and hopefully more will come out in the next 3 years or so before my next build.

This is a pipe dream to be honest. Just because a game can use multiple threads does not mean that it is well-threaded. In other words, tasks are not farmed out to each thread evenly, meaning that one or two cores do the majority of the work. You want those main cores to be as fast as possible, because they are the bottleneck. If you could get a 6-core processor that is as fast as a quad core for the same or maybe a little more money, then that is fine. As it is, you are straight up reducing your single-thread performance, which is still the most important thing for games. Perfectly threading a heterogeneous workload like a game engine is extremely hard, so you should not spend extra money banking on the fact that this will occur any time soon.

 

[Cerb]

http://us.hardware.info/reviews/560...review-new-boards-for-haswell-e-sound-quality

90+dB crosstalk on single-ended audio is extremely rare, not doing dual mono (separate left and right DACs) with far superior equipment to what goes into any motherboard, or only measuring bass. MSI's may very well be worse, but don't trust loop-back RMAA results to mean much. They're always better than the results by someone actually testing with a scope, or genuine audio analyzer.

Your video card is going to have a far greater effect on your audio quality than the codec the mobo maker has chosen. You won't hear a 15dB noise floor difference. You may hear bad PCB audio routing, and magnetically "loud" video card or CPU voltage regulation.

The MSI might not be the best board to get, but don't be hung up on onboard audio differences. The ASRock X99 Extreme4 looks like a good alternative, though.

TBH, though, given your needs, I think you'd be just as well served by a LGA1150 Haswell i7.

 

[Xerin7]

Thanks all, I have updated my motherboard to the Asus X99-A. I will keep an eye on RAM costs and decide whether to go for faster RAM when I pull the trigger.

I'm in a holding pattern right now because I want to get everything at the same time, and the ROG Swift monitor still is out of stock everywhere. Hopefully some time this week!

 

[Xerin7]

For cooling I'd get the Corsair H100i or H110, depending on whether you can fit 240 or 280mm rads in your case.

I'm confused. I just measured the height clearance on my Lian Li PC-777a (20th anniversary edition) case and I have maybe 170mm to work with. I've always thought it was a spacious case. I'm probably missing something obvious, but how are people fitting 240-280mm height coolers into their rigs?

 

[mfenn]

I'm confused. I just measured the height clearance on my Lian Li PC-777a (20th anniversary edition) case and I have maybe 170mm to work with. I've always thought it was a spacious case. I'm probably missing something obvious, but how are people fitting 240-280mm height coolers into their rigs?

Mistersprinkles is referring to the dimension planar to the fans. You might call it height or length depending on how you have the cooler oriented. 240mm is two 120mm fans next to each other and 280 is two 140mm fans next to each other.

In a typical top-mount configuration, the 240-280mm is going to be parallel to the GPU, but mounted to the top of the case. The "thickness" (protrusion down towards the CPU socket) is much less.

That being said, the PC-777A is an, ahem, unique design and I don't see where you'd get any dual-fan radiator into it. The typical mount looks like the top of the Corsair 500R.

 

[Xerin7]

Thanks mfenn, what would you recommend for my case then?

 

[mfenn]

Thanks mfenn, what would you recommend for my case then?

I'm not really a fan of the water CLC's, especially not in a case like yours that doesn't have room for a 240mm+ one. I'd go for a normal 120mm tower cooler like the Noctua NH-U12S for $70.

 

[Xerin7]

NH-U12S it is. It should fit nicely in my case, easy to install, provide decent cooling, and not be overly loud. Thanks again for your help.