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This picture is the epitome of why Trump people are so proud

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Stokely

Golden Member
Jun 5, 2017
1,078
1,089
136
Hey, I'll give him credit for discussing weighty matters with someone more knowledgeable than he in on the subject. Being able to defer to subject matter experts is the mark of a good leader.
 

Greenman

Lifer
Oct 15, 1999
17,621
2,773
126
Boyo - why even go there with all the attacks on everything Obama ever did.
Isn't that what everyone here calls "whataboutisim"?
For me personally, I didn't attack Obama every time he farted. I didn't like a lot of his politics, but I found his public persona to be very likable.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
27,545
13,285
136
Most Americans, I think, see a need for justice system reform. So anybody who can convey that message to the President & to Congress has my blessing.

A partisan GOP Congress wouldn't do anything about it because Obama wanted it. Maybe Trump can do better.
With that logic and KK lobbying Trump for criminal justice reform why isn't Dennis Rodman going to North Korea with Trump?

Dennis has probably spent more quality time with Kim then Pompeo.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
48,474
9,423
126
I sometimes wonder if he intentionally moved the Muslim prayer curtains into the Oval Office.
 

ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
33,706
12,482
146
Isn't that what everyone here calls "whataboutisim"?
For me personally, I didn't attack Obama every time he farted. I didn't like a lot of his politics, but I found his public persona to be very likable.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism?wprov=sfla1

*Shrug* it's certainly foolish to ignore how conservatives reacted to Obama for 8 years. Questioning why a reality TV star is going to the orange office to discuss criminal sentencing with another reality TV star is not as nefarious as you would like.
 

Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
14,663
1,887
126
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism?wprov=sfla1

*Shrug* it's certainly foolish to ignore how conservatives reacted to Obama for 8 years. Questioning why a reality TV star is going to the orange office to discuss criminal sentencing with another reality TV star is not as nefarious as you would like.
Some of us haven’t forgotten, we just admire that those who were most upset about how some conservatives behaved wrt Obama have now miraculously become the most successful at modeling the same behavior.
 

ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
33,706
12,482
146
Some of us haven’t forgotten, we just admire that those who were most upset about how some conservatives behaved wrt Obama have now miraculously become the most successful at modeling the same behavior.
Wrt to this thread, I thought I was clear with the reasoning in my post that you quoted.

WRT the topic just discussed, its not even close to equal, *shrug*
 

Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
14,663
1,887
126
Wrt to this thread, I thought I was clear with the reasoning in my post that you quoted.
Agreed

WRT the topic just discussed, its not even close to equal, *shrug*
I stopped coming to these forums during the Obama years because the quality of discourse rapidly declined. From where I am sitting, its rapidly approaching an equivalence.
 

Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
14,663
1,887
126
How, specifically?
During the Obama years, there was a seemingly endless deluge of threads with posters lamenting every inane thing Obama did, with a fair amount of circle jerking, confirmation bias and an overall decline in both the quality and civility of discourse.

That lack of civility peaked during the 2016 election.

That same dynamic is now in play but reversed, even if Trump is deserving of so many threads.

I think posters like you, @zinfamous, @fskimospy and @Jhhnn engage in a respectful and intellectually honest way, which is why I dare enter some of the circle jerks to engage. You are increasingly becoming the exception.
 

ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
33,706
12,482
146
During the Obama years, there was a seemingly endless deluge of threads with posters lamenting every inane thing Obama did, with a fair amount of circle jerking, confirmation bias and an overall decline in both the quality and civility of discourse.

That lack of civility peaked during the 2016 election.

That same dynamic is now in play but reversed, even if Trump is deserving of so many threads.

I think posters like you, @zinfamous, @fskimospy and @Jhhnn engage in a respectful and intellectually honest way, which is why I dare enter some of the circle jerks to engage. You are increasingly becoming the exception.
Ok, so is it just the civility that's approaching equality? Or the content of topics being discussed?
 

Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
14,663
1,887
126
Ok, so is it just the civility that's approaching equality? Or the content of topics being discussed?
Civility, definitely yes. Content, not in the sense of the topics themselves but the rejection of opinions that don’t buy into the narrative.
 

ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
33,706
12,482
146
Civility, definitely yes. Content, not in the sense of the topics themselves but the rejection of opinions that don’t buy into the narrative.
All of this is definitely debatable.

Civility: I certainly recall republicans complaining about having to watch what they say. Those uppity Democrats might be offended, and voted for exactly the opposite. So, let's say Democrats are becoming increasingly uncivil now, isn't that what we voted for? Is speaking your mind in any way you want only reserved for conservative republicans?

Opinions not within the narrative: The narrative, for both main parties, is what's combining that party together. So if you're not in agreement with one part, but still vote for that party, you should be mindful enough to understand that others won't agree with you.

Overall, what I see, is two parties going through some big changes. Hopefully we all come out better after, but that's just hope. My gut says it will get worse before it gets better.

I see republicans heavily projecting for 8 years, and what they cried about the Dems doing, much of which wasn't true, is now what they're actually doing. These GOP establishment saw social change happening decades ago, have successfully gained control of all main bodies of the government, and are doing their best to solidify conservatives professed (only professed, words are easy) values for a long time via judicial appointments. The generations below will still be impacted by these actions.

I see Democrats who are just dumbfounded at the lack of education that still afflicts out country. How easily people's minds choose the easy path, many of which are jumping on the tribalist bandwagon.

I see independents, very frustrated that people, after decades of being targets of political and financial gain for the ruling class, still easily manipulated into squabbling about the same wedge issues.
 

SNC

Platinum Member
Jan 14, 2001
2,166
200
106

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
27,545
13,285
136
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism?wprov=sfla1

*Shrug* it's certainly foolish to ignore how conservatives reacted to Obama for 8 years. Questioning why a reality TV star is going to the orange office to discuss criminal sentencing with another reality TV star is not as nefarious as you would like.
I don't think its nefarious at all. Was just highlighting why his voters should be proud albeit tongue in cheek.

I just think expecting serious policy discussions with Kim Kardashian is on a different level then Obama not wearing a flag pin of wearing a tan jacket in the Oval.
 

ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
33,706
12,482
146
I don't think its nefarious at all. Was just highlighting why his voters should be proud albeit tongue in cheek.

I just think expecting serious policy discussions with Kim Kardashian is on a different level then Obama not wearing a flag pin of wearing a tan jacket in the Oval.
I agree. It's not nefarious at all.
 
Feb 4, 2009
31,115
11,541
136
All of this is definitely debatable.

Civility: I certainly recall republicans complaining about having to watch what they say. Those uppity Democrats might be offended, and voted for exactly the opposite. So, let's say Democrats are becoming increasingly uncivil now, isn't that what we voted for? Is speaking your mind in any way you want only reserved for conservative republicans?

Opinions not within the narrative: The narrative, for both main parties, is what's combining that party together. So if you're not in agreement with one part, but still vote for that party, you should be mindful enough to understand that others won't agree with you.

Overall, what I see, is two parties going through some big changes. Hopefully we all come out better after, but that's just hope. My gut says it will get worse before it gets better.

I see republicans heavily projecting for 8 years, and what they cried about the Dems doing, much of which wasn't true, is now what they're actually doing. These GOP establishment saw social change happening decades ago, have successfully gained control of all main bodies of the government, and are doing their best to solidify conservatives professed (only professed, words are easy) values for a long time via judicial appointments. The generations below will still be impacted by these actions.

I see Democrats who are just dumbfounded at the lack of education that still afflicts out country. How easily people's minds choose the easy path, many of which are jumping on the tribalist bandwagon.

I see independents, very frustrated that people, after decades of being targets of political and financial gain for the ruling class, still easily manipulated into squabbling about the same wedge issues.
It’s starbuck, some how it will all circle around and be Hillary’s fault.
 

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