This is why this admin is viewed as supporting racists.

[MomentsofSanity]

I have no words at this point. Read the edits they made

https://www.cnn.com/2018/06/29/politics/veprek-state-dept-un-racism/index.html

A Trump administration appointee to the State Department tore into standard UN documents that condemn racism as a threat to democracy.

The deputy assistant secretary for refugees and migration, a foreign service officer promoted by the White House to an unusually senior position for his rank, disputed the idea that leaders have a "duty" to condemn hate speech and incitement, and repeatedly rejected use of the words nationalism, populism, and xenophobia.

 

[UglyCasanova]

The concept of "hate speech" is a threat to democracy. The expectation of our political leaders to police speech is a threat to our democracy.

 

[hal2kilo]

I have no words at this point. Read the edits they made

https://www.cnn.com/2018/06/29/politics/veprek-state-dept-un-racism/index.html

You forgot "and fascists".

 

[UNCjigga]

The concept of "hate speech" is a threat to democracy. The expectation of our political leaders to police speech is a threat to our democracy.

Do you agree that racists are just another minority, then, and that their views and beliefs need to be tolerated for the sake of being a tolerant society? That's essentially what this asshole is arguing.

 

[UglyCasanova]

I'm curious how everyone on here would feel if the Republicans started policing what could or couldn't be said like is being advocated. There are plenty of posters on here who single out white people based on nothing other than the color of their skin and justify any number of foul things said about them because of privilege and such. What if Republicans said enough of that, it's hate speech against whites. Is that a path you want to go down? A politician making the call on what is or isn't allowed speech?

You mentioned "fascists", what if they start policing "socialists" or "communists" or any other "-ists". Is that a road we want to go down? Politicians policing nebulous terms, that sounds like that could turn bad really quickly doesn't it?

 

[UglyCasanova]

Do you agree that racists are just another minority, then, and that their views and beliefs need to be tolerated for the sake of being a tolerant society? That's essentially what this asshole is arguing.

No it's not, he says the government shouldn't be in the business of policing speech and ideas. And telling politicians "you didn't condemn this -ist so you must support it!" is a dysfunctional path to follow.

 

[UNCjigga]

No it's not, he says the government shouldn't be in the business of policing speech and ideas.

"Our public figures can't be obliged to police every intolerant thought out their [sic] at the risk of being condemned for intolerance themselves."
That is some textbook white nationalism.

 

[MrPickins]

No it's not, he says the government shouldn't be in the business of policing speech and ideas.

condemning != policing

Our leaders (hell, everyone) should condemn hateful speech, even if it's legal.

 

[mikeymikec]

nvm

 

[UglyCasanova]

condemning != policing

Our leaders (hell, everyone) should condemn hateful speech, even if it's legal.

The idea of hate is a nebulous thing and rest assured politicians will find ways to use it to their advantage.

 

[UNCjigga]

https://forward.com/culture/404371/...s-in-this-homeland-security-document-or-just/

I saw this posted on some liberal blog yesterday and thought it was Alex Jones-level ridiculous.

But now...only slightly less ridiculous. I can understand why someone would believe DHS is dog whistling white nationalists, given everything else going on with this administration. I mean, who the hell says 'fewer than 13 of 88 claims' rather than 'fewer than 15 of 100 claims'??

 

[WelshBloke]

The concept of "hate speech" is a threat to democracy. The expectation of our political leaders to police speech is a threat to our democracy.

Why?

 

[UglyCasanova]

Why?

Because the free expression of thoughts and ideas is one of the cornerstones of democracy. When you start expecting the politicians to condemn (a flavor of policing) something as nebulous as "hate speech" they can easily use that to their political advantage and at the same time undermine political opposition. The public is onboard because by golly who likes "hate". There's plenty of scenarios where this spins from utopia to distopia rather quickly and we won't even realize it's happening.

 

[MomentsofSanity]

Because the free expression of thoughts and ideas is one of the cornerstones of democracy. When you start expecting the politicians to condemn (a flavor of policing) something as nebulous as "hate speech" they can easily use that to their political advantage and at the same time undermine political opposition. The public is onboard because by golly who likes "hate". There's plenty of scenarios where this spins from utopia to distopia rather quickly and we won't even realize it's happening.

Is there any degree of out right racism and incitement to violence towards minorities you feel should be unacceptable?

 

[Ausm]

Stevie Wonder could see why this regime is racist...

 

[UglyCasanova]

Is there any degree of out right racism and incitement to violence towards minorities you feel should be unacceptable?

So we've moved from hate speech to inciting violence and we're still on page one.

edit nm the article references also. If someone is legitimately inciting violence I'd imagine there are measures that can be taken already assuming it poses a real and present threat? Very slippery slope to give politicians though. Political opposition's speech is "inciting violence", silence them.

 

[MomentsofSanity]

So we've moved from hate speech to inciting violence and we're still on page one.

You didn’t read what was in my OP did you? This isn’t just about speech.

I’ll post it again so you don’t have to be troubled reading the whole article.

The language referring to hate speech and incitement is crossed out, as is the section about leaders who engage in hate speech.

Now. The question still stands. Or are you saying you’re ok with any amount of hateful speech directed at minorities by people of power? You really didn’t answer any part of the question.

 

[jackstar7]

UC bringing out a lot of concern here.

You've got so much fear, Cass. You make me sad.

 

[UglyCasanova]

Trump says political opposition talking about white priveledge is hate speech & racism because you are singling out people simply because of the color of their skin. That is inviting hostility and violence towards them. Shut it down.

Republicans decide that rhetoric against them is getting out of hand and inciting violence. Shut it down.


It easily goes in directions that I'm assuming you wouldn't agree with.

 

[MomentsofSanity]

Trump says political opposition talking about white priveledge is hate speech & racism because you are singling out people simply because of the color of their skin. That is inviting hostility and violence towards them. Shut it down.

It easily goes in directions that I'm assuming you wouldn't agree with.

And that’s bullshit. It’s a deflection by people who don’t understand what racism actually is. Tip for you. Saying people are better off when they make up the majority and aren’t marginalized due to the color of their skin isn’t racism.

But I’ll go back to the original question I asked you. Is there any degree of hate speech directed towards minorities by people in power that you think would be unacceptable?

 

[UglyCasanova]

And that’s bullshit. It’s a deflection by people who don’t understand what racism actually is. Tip for you. Saying people are better off when they make up the majority and aren’t marginalized due to the color of their skin isn’t racism.

But I’ll go back to the original question I asked you. Is there any degree of hate speech directed towards minorities by people in power that you think would be unacceptable?

Define "hate speech" and I might be able to answer.

 

[WelshBloke]

Because the free expression of thoughts and ideas is one of the cornerstones of democracy.

Nope. The cornerstone of democracy is giving everyone a voice, and to do that you have to protect some people from other people.

 

[UglyCasanova]

Nope. The cornerstone of democracy is giving everyone a voice, and to do that you have to protect some people from other people.

Interesting concept. At which point in "protecting some people from other people" are you no longer "giving everyone a voice".

 

[jackstar7]

Trump says political opposition talking about white priveledge is hate speech & racism because you are singling out people simply because of the color of their skin. That is inviting hostility and violence towards them. Shut it down.

Republicans decide that rhetoric against them is getting out of hand and inciting violence. Shut it down.

It easily goes in directions that I'm assuming you wouldn't agree with.

You've shown your concern. We get it.

You would have us tolerate intolerance and we are telling you to shove it.

 

[Phenzyn]

UC bringing out a lot of concern here.

You've got so much fear, Cass. You make me sad.

The dude is a total flippin moron

Reading his posts in this thread, people can't be this stupid.

He is an obvious racist that is using the right wing talking points and "whataboutism" that they use to try to deflect their obvious racism.

"But what about the racist people that are all like ......white privileged is hate speech & racism because you are singling out people simply because of the color of their skin."

What a joke. Again, you give these idiots an actual definition of racism:

prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on the belief that one's own race is superior.
​

And they will still try to act like "but but the BLM are racist because they are insinuating that WL DON'T M, by saying BLM" They just don't get that it means BLM ALSO.

And now we have to define "hate speech" for these idiots? Hate speech would never need to be explained to you if you aren't a) a child or b) a racist. Thanks for proving you're a racist bigot @UglyCasanova

I just can't deal with this idiocy today.