Thinking Upgrade, Have Chosen 775, recommendations?

[Gillbot]

This is not meant to start a war!

I'm thinking with the upgrade options for 939 dwindling, it's time to consider AM2 or 775. Either will be a major upgrade since i'll have to get new ram so i'm trying to decide which path....

I've been impressed with the offerings I've seen from Intel lately and i've been leaning that way I just don't know where to start. I haven't touched an Intel chip since my PIII 733! I'd like to start with something in the Celeron range to get a feel for the system them move to dual core as $ permits. The downside is the cost. From what i've seen, all components are more costly with Intel, though they seem to last a bit longer than their AMD counterparts.

The AMD offerings seem to be fluttering lately. While they still are plenty powerful, their upgrade path seems to be all over the place. They do have the price advantage at the moment though so I can't rule them out. It's much cheaper to get a board and chip for AM2 over 775 but is it worthwhile?

Thoughts?

 

[Cerb]

Considering upgrading, or high performance in general, pass on AMD for now. I am, for the same reason.

In terms of value, AM2 is great. Get some DDR2 800, MSI's Quadro board (it's not new and shiny, but I like it), a 4200+ or better...nice non-gaming internals for a bit under $200. But, the performance tops off too low; and Intel's E6550 and higher prices are excellent.

 

[Gillbot]

Yeah, everything i've been reading lately about AM2 is swaying my opinion over to Intel but the value can't be ignored for the short term.

 

[Regalk]

E2160 1MB GAP35DS3L = $180
X2 4000+ 1MB Brisbane/Biostar T570SLI = $150-$160

if you look hard enough the difference decreases so not much difference at this time. Also to say that the Intel platform lasts longer than the other would not be true - all depends on the user. Either platforms gets out of date in less than a year these days

 

[Gillbot]

Originally posted by: Regalk
E2160 1MB GAP35DS3L = $180
X2 4000+ 1MB Brisbane/Biostar T570SLI = $150-$160

if you look hard enough the difference decreases so not much difference at this time. Also to say that the Intel platform lasts longer than the other would not be true - all depends on the user. Either platforms gets out of date in less than a year these days

True, but it seems the Intel platform has the better future path. Though that may all change depending on what AMD has up their sleeves.

 

[Cerb]

Originally posted by: Regalk
E2160 1MB GAP35DS3L = $180
X2 4000+ 1MB Brisbane/Biostar T570SLI = $150-$160

if you look hard enough the difference decreases so not much difference at this time. Also to say that the Intel platform lasts longer than the other would not be true - all depends on the user. Either platforms gets out of date in less than a year these days

Add $35 for a video card, or $28 for Gigabyte's G33M board (w/ a 4x PCi-e 16x slot).

Asus M2A-VM + X2 4200+: $144.31 to my door.

Add a gaming card, and start raising the CPU choice to the C2D performance range, though, and difference in terms of absolute dollars is about the same. The % difference becomes less, and P35 boards with FW and eSATA are easy to find, and the AMD boards with such features creep into Intel board prices. If you've got any overclocking on your mind, AMD will once again lose to Intel.

Yes, Phenom could change things, but all Intel will have to do to stop that is cut their prices, which they have shown they are not too proud to do.

 

[Gillbot]

I already have the parts from my current system so I'm semi set. I was just thinking of migrating from 939 to something more current such as AM2 or 775 so I have a better future path as parts come available. The problem is, I just don't know where to start!

I have my current 7900GS which is good enough for what I want it to do plus my DVD Burner and HDD will carry over. But with the socket change, i'll have to get all new ram and that's where the costs start adding up. New mobo, new proc, new ram.....

EDIT> I guess I'm more looking for suggestions on what would be a good starter setup with VERY LOW initial cost that could be upgraded later. Even if I start with a celeron or sempron in AM2/775, I could later move up to dual core. Just a CHEAP foot in the door setup would work.

 

[Cerb]

Intel

...but, it seems like a waste, since you could probably get a better mobo for the same money later; and I doubt there will be any meaningful difference going with a Celeron now (not knowing your rig, it may even be slower).

 

[Gillbot]

I'm currently running a 939 x2 3800+ in a Biostar 6100-M9 mobo with a 7500LE vid card in my HTPC. My main rig is a T-Force 6100-939 with a 4200+ x2 and a 7900GS vid card.

I was thinking of replacing the HTPC with a 775/Celeron combo or something low end AM2 until I got to play with it a bit and see how I liked it. That way it's cheap to upgrade and if I don't like it, nearly anything can play a movie into my TV so I'm not out anything.

 

[darbius]

I am also in the market to put together a computer so I've been reading up on it and I would be really really hard-pressed to recommend AM2 over 775. So yeah, Intel.

 

[KIAman]

I would recommend the 775 path as well over AM2. Nothing against AMD but the price/performance ratio favors Intel slightly and when overclock is considered, it favors Intel by a wide margin.

 

[Regalk]

Oh I do agree with all the comments above; Intel platform is the way to go. Price differential not that big if you are thinking low budget systems such as AM2 1MB vs E21XX 1MB. Future upgrade path definitely Intel.
For starters you can get a good Motherboard like the Abit IP35-E or any reasonable Asus MB and an E2140 to tide you over until say the Quad comes down some more.
I just bought an E2160/GA P35DS3L and for the heck of it a 2nd AM2 system is on the way (1 already in my sig; couldn't resist these cheap prices). The way I look at it so what if Intel is all powerful for $160 who cares.

 

[Gillbot]

Originally posted by: Regalk
Oh I do agree with all the comments above; Intel platform is the way to go. Price differential not that big if you are thinking low budget systems such as AM2 1MB vs E21XX 1MB. Future upgrade path definitely Intel.
For starters you can get a good Motherboard like the Abit IP35-E or any reasonable Asus MB and an E2140 to tide you over until say the Quad comes down some more.
I just bought an E2160/GA P35DS3L and for the heck of it a 2nd AM2 system is on the way (1 already in my sig; couldn't resist these cheap prices). The way I look at it so what if Intel is all powerful for $160 who cares.

EXCELLENT info, thanks!!

What would be a compareable chip to my current s939 x2 4200+ on the intel line?

 

[Gillbot]

Originally posted by: Gillbot
What would be a compareable chip to my current s939 x2 4200+ on the intel line?

any ideas?

 

[shadowwlf]

this doesn't support hyperthreading but it is a good chip and for a reasonable price.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16819116237

I have a 3.2 Ghz version and have been satisified with it. the 3.2 will run about $250 - $300 while this one is under $100 and is fairly decent and would be comparible if not a little better IMHO.

 

[musicetime101]

Hey I think shadowwlf's suggestion is good .

 

[Gillbot]

excellent!

intel's new naming scheme has me confused!

 

[Denithor]

I CANNOT believe you guys are recommending Netburst processors to anyone these days. Especially for an HTPC. That's just insane. The C2D processors simply destroy the old P4 processors in video encoding, etc, and run much much cooler.

Instead of that, get these:
e2180 (1MB cache @ 2.0GHz) for $90
Foxconn G965 mATX motherboard for $50 after MIR
A-Data 2 x 1GB DDR2-800 memory sticks for $35 after MIR

Total shipped cost after rebates: $175

If you don't need a mATX motherboard, get the Abit IP35-E for $84 after MIR. Much better board for overclocking and offers native support for Penryn 45nm processors (next generation Intel chips, coming soon).

Finally, if you do a lot of video encoding (in the supported formats) one of the GeForce 8400/8500/8600 or the Radeon HD2400/2600 video cards can really reduce the load on your cpu to allow much smoother viewing of HD video on your HDTV or LCD monitor.

***

EDIT: You could also consider bumping up to the e4500 (2MB cache @ 2.2GHz) for an additional $37. The extra cache and speed would help if you are really into video encoding and would also be better for gaming.

To then turn this rig into a gaming beast, all you would have to do is get the new GeForce 8800GT instead of the other cards listed above. This card provides the same video processing enhancements as well as superb gaming performance and can be found for $250-300 depending on the level of factory OC (and this price should drop considerably in the next few weeks as supply increases and ATI/AMD launches their new video card).

 

[spittledip]

Originally posted by: Cerb
Intel

...but, it seems like a waste, since you could probably get a better mobo for the same money later; and I doubt there will be any meaningful difference going with a Celeron now (not knowing your rig, it may even be slower).

Totally agree. No need to upgrade from your current platform at this time as the difference in real world performance would not be worth the money. I think It would be better for you to wait for another generation.. unless you have money to burn. if you have lots of money go for it.

 

[Gillbot]

Originally posted by: Denithor
I CANNOT believe you guys are recommending Netburst processors to anyone these days. Especially for an HTPC.

I think i'm going to use this as my main rig and not my HTPC.

 

[shadowwlf]

I have to agree with Denithor about the choice of memory it is decent and very cheap. But that is all.

Here would be a decent setup that would kill the one Denithor reccomended:
Pentium D 920 (2MB cache @ 2.8 Ghz) for $100
ASRock ConRoe 1333 (capable for future upgrades) motherboard for $53 (even though memory standard 667)
A-Data 2 x 1 GB DDR2-800 memory for $35 after MIR

Total shipped cost of $192
Total more investment of $17

Faster Processor!!!
Motherboard with ability for future upgrades (Big +++++) !!!!!
and the ability to stomp the other processor = Priceless

Also I picked up an openbox motherboard from newegg for $59 because of a goofup on their site normal price was $105 MSI P6N SLI-FI so keep in mind there are even better motherboards out there that you can find dirt cheap.

 

[heyheybooboo]

Originally posted by: Gillbot

Originally posted by: Denithor
I CANNOT believe you guys are recommending Netburst processors to anyone these days. Especially for an HTPC.

I think i'm going to use this as my main rig and not my HTPC.

I tend to look less at upgrade path and stick to price - Price - PRICE!

I like to stay at least one year behind thinking that what costs $200 today will be worth less than $100 in 12 months.

Quick! Look at your cpu utilization. I'm running an AVG scan, got the ATSC tuner going on the News Hour and I'm typing to you at 15-22% cpu utilization with a stock Opty 165 and MSI NF4 mobo. When I need to get serious I can crank a 40-50% OC and just be happy with what I got. I don't care if I have an 'upgrade path' or not.

In a few months AM2 will progress to HT3 and next year comes DDR3. Intel is easing into DDR3 and hopefully the new intel roadmap in 2008 will give us an idea when CSI might hit the desktop (2H 2009? Who knows?). That will retire current s775 mobos for those on the 'edge'.

PCIe2 has nothing for me, really. An intel quad would be nice but certainly not necessary. A 2.8GHz Agena or Phenom might be sweet after Christmas but I don't need it.

Vista? Puhhh-lezzzz-tuh! What a resource hawg. But that Aero and DX10 and the clock on the desktop is cool - doesn't mean a whole lot to what I want to do with my computer.

Everybody's different. Some folks use a computer as an extension of their ego. For some folks it's a hobby and for others it's a way of life. But in reality . . .

Technology now breeds obsolescence. So go frugal. In a year or two give your mobo/cpu to a kid and go frugal again.

And with the money you save you can buy a nice HD-DVD :shocked: for your htpc!

/rant . . . . And to answer your question try this mobo with this cpu or possibly this! or you could go with this cpu with this mobo or blow your wadd with this!

Good luck!

 

[Gillbot]

My HTPC is getting retired. It does nothing but play MP3's and DVD movies so it's an expense not needed. My main rig does number crunching for work in access databases and the occasional sup-com game. From what i've seen on other machines, the intel line destroys my current AMD system in the database work so that's the motivation for me to switch. Plus s939 is dead already so if I want a few more fps in sup-com, I have no upgrade options at this time.

I figured I might as well sell my 939 stuff while it's still worth a few $ and migrate to something that has at least a few months of life left in it hence the transition to 775.

 

[Denithor]

Originally posted by: shadowwlf
Here would be a decent setup that would kill the one Denithor reccomended:
Pentium D 920 (2MB cache @ 2.8 Ghz) for $100
ASRock ConRoe 1333 (capable for future upgrades) motherboard for $53 (even though memory standard 667)
A-Data 2 x 1 GB DDR2-800 memory for $35 after MIR

Faster Processor!!!
Motherboard with ability for future upgrades (Big +++++) !!!!!
and the ability to stomp the other processor = Priceless

Faster Processor? What planet are you living on? Look at this Oblivion benchmark from nearly 1.5 years ago when the C2D processors were first launched. Note how the e6300 (2MB cache @ 1.86GHz) absolutely crushes the Pentium D 965 Extreme Edition (the fastest P4 chip ever made, 4MB cache @ 3.73GHz, exactly TWICE the cache & speed of the e6300 and a heck-of-a-lot faster than that P-D 920 you recommend above). The damage is not quite as complete in video encoding however the e6300 still manages to match or beat the P-D 960 (4MB cache @ 3.6GHz) in all but one case and totally destroys the P-D 920.

On top of this performance the fact that it is common and easy to OC the C2D chips 25-50% (or more) and you have no comparison at all. This is the reason no one even bothers to benchmark against the old Netburst processors anymore.

If you are using this for your main rig, go with the Abit IP35-E motherboard I mentioned previously, this board has been able to push past 400MHz fsb easily for most users and has native support for the new Penryn 1333 processors about to launch, unlike the ASRock board shadowwlf referenced (which can only run 1333 in overclocked mode with the PCI-E slot also pushed up to 115MHz, which is often unstable). Also definitely go with the e4500 (this chip has the same cache as the e6300 and is faster as well) for the higher cache and faster stock speed.

Before video card, you are looking at a total of just under $250 after MIR for a really fast C2D system with plenty of OC and upgrade potential. If you get the e4500 you probably won't need an upgrade anything until late next year, at which point you can pick up a cheap Penryn quad-core or else do a full refresh to Nehalem (new cpu socket, DDR3 memory will force all new equipment).

If you're into gaming and your 7900gs is adequate, you're done at this point. Otherwise, get either the GeForce 8800gt ($250-300) or the upcoming Radeon 3850/3870 (??). If your system is more for video encoding or general use get a GeForce 8400/8500/8600 or a Radeon HD 2400/2600 ($50-100).

 

[DAPUNISHER]

I wouldn't go net burst at this point in history, for any reason, period. Also, without significant overclock, AM2 just won't offer much over you skt939 setup, it is Intel, or wait IMO.