The worldwide rising tide of The new left -Anarchy in the USA-

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: Steeplerot

Originally posted by: Genx87

Please send me your computer and all your assets then, thief.

I was answering about anarchism :roll:
But I will play along, sure.

You already have a computer, so why should I?

Because you are a thief and we cant have any theives in our midsts. If you want to use a computer you will have access to the peoples republic computer systems shortly where you can wait in line with everybody else.

Maybe if you are lucky, you will be able to find your newly confiscated for the people computer system as it churns away helping the people.

Who and what is this "we" or "republic" there is no state in a collectivism. you fail at this game. (You couldn't even come up with a serious rebuttal? Give me a break)

What defines the collective then? How shall it be organized? If a member of the collective decides not to abide by these many rules of the collective (a "thief" for example), how shall those rules be enforced and appropriate punishment determined? If a decision needs to be made by the collective (and of course, decisions need to be made every day), will each and every member of the collective be given a vote on each and every decision, and will we wait for the unanimous agreement of hundreds of millions of people, or will they elect representatives on their behalf? If representative, then how is that system of representation not a state? How is the system of distribution to be determined and controlled? Who will decide what the collective needs and what will be the most efficient way to meet those needs? And how will they decide it? What about management and administration? Say a person doesn't want to work their fair share, who will determine what their fair share is and what their punishment will be for not contributing it? On the flip side, what about someone whose needs outweighs their abilities, how will such a determination be appropriately reached, and how will the collective ensure that those needs are met?

Wow... you call me a dumbass and an ideologue... :roll: your ideology is so far removed from logic and reality, it's hard not to point and laugh despite how sorry I feel for you and your delusions.
Here's a clue for you... communism didn't work. It was attempted and it failed miserably. And not for the reasons you posted above, but for its inability to answer the questions I posted here (and that's just the tip of the iceberg). Because of its failure to organize coherently, communism always devolves into a ruthless cult-of-personality totalitarian state, the result of which is inevitability a disaster on every conceivable human and environmental level.
I know that (among your many delusions) you've deluded yourself into believe that I (and many others) oppose communism on selfish or ideological reasons. In my case, that is simply not so. I oppose communism because it is as far removed from the common good as any socio-political system possibly could be.

 

[Red Dawn]

I see those Anarchists all the time in Boston. They are usually sitting around banging plastic buckets with drumsticks.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
I see those Anarchists all the time in Boston. They are usually sitting around banging plastic buckets with drumsticks.

or on 16th st in Denver.

 

[Steeplerot]

Originally posted by: Vic


Wow... you call me a dumbass and an ideologue... your ideology is so far removed from logic and reality, it's hard not to point and laugh despite how sorry I feel for you and your delusions.

Hey look it's Vichead, I said a few times now if this was asking me or about A-S.

How many damn times have I said I think utopian fantasys are just that?

Which is why I do not subscribe to libertarianism.

Aren't you supposed to have me on ignore yet? You only said so last night.

And to think I actually was researching the answer to 2 good questions I was curious about myself until I saw this pile of typical steaming pile of Vic sh1t that followed.

Go have a wank or something you nut.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot

Originally posted by: Vic


Wow... you call me a dumbass and an ideologue...

FU Vichead I said a few times now if this was asking me or about A-S.

How many damn times have I said I think utopian fantasys are just that?

Which is why I do not subscribe to libertarianism.

Aren't you supposed to have me on ignore yet? You only said so last night.

And to think I actually was researching th answer to 2 good questions I was curious about myself until I saw this pile of typical Vic sh1t that followed.

Don't just hurl meaningless personal insults and attacks like usual. ANSWER THE QUESTIONS. Or, if they're too hard for you (and they obviously must be), just answer this single question: How does a system organize without having a system of organization? Figure that one out, and you just might realize why your beloved anarcho-communism is the most irrational utopian fantasy of all (I won't hold my breath though).

edit to your usual edit:

Go have a wank or something you nut.

Wow, how mature. One more question: if we were to let humanity do what it wants, organize and collectivize as it wished, what would be the result?

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
I see those Anarchists all the time in Boston. They are usually sitting around banging plastic buckets with drumsticks.

or on 16th st in Denver.

Or at Pioneer Courthouse Square in Portland.

 

[Steeplerot]

Vic, you are too stupid to even repeat myself again for, but here we go, read it again it is not "my" anything I am discussing a philosophy and I sure as hell am not answering your questions when you come in throwing insults and making demands like some spoiled child jumping to conclusions before you even calm down enough to read.

I would suggest Prozac, but Thorazine would be a better choice to medicate your crazy ass.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
Vic, you are too stupid to even repeat myself again for, but here we go, read it again it is not "my" anything I am discussing a philosophy and I sure as hell am not answering your questions when you come in throwing insults and making demands like some spoiled child jumping to conclusions before you even calm down enough to read.

I would suggest Prozac, but Thorazine would be a better choice to medicate your crazy ass.

Uh huh... someone break your mirror, rot?


Uh BTW, I don't think you should be so insulting of people with mental illnesses. Those are legitimate diseases for those who suffer from them, and your little rant here shows a shocking lack of compassion for their suffering.

 

[Steeplerot]

Originally posted by: Vic


Uh huh... someone break your mirror, rot?

Well, at least you went from flaming nutjob to preschool rebuttal, thats progress.

 

[Steeplerot]

Originally posted by: Vic
Those are legitimate diseases for those who suffer from them, and your little rant here shows a shocking lack of compassion for their suffering.

I can respect that, but don't put your sh1t on me, I do not follow you around threads and flame you.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot

Originally posted by: Vic


Uh huh... someone break your mirror, rot?

Well, at least you went from flaming nutjob to preschool rebuttal, thats progress.

Well... in case you hadn't noticed, the only person in this thread throwing the immature tantrum of personal attacks since I arrived is... YOU.

I asked legitimate questions and made a legitimate argument. Would you care to address them, or are you going to keep ranting and distracting? It doesn't serve your purposes, it just makes you look bad.

Answer the question: how does your beloved collective organize itself?

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot

Originally posted by: Vic
Those are legitimate diseases for those who suffer from them, and your little rant here shows a shocking lack of compassion for their suffering.

I can respect that, but don't put your sh1t on me, I do not follow you around threads and flame you.

Wake up, ideologue. I didn't flame you. I put your utopist ideology under the microscope, asked some serious questions, and you flipped out at the heresy of it all.

State forbid! :Q:roll:

 

[Schadenfroh]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
The Political faction of the EMO's

:laugh:

so true

 

[Steeplerot]

There is no answer as I do not subscribe to utopian fantasys, regardless of you repeating yourself, and it was you who started flaming in your second post you made in here to me (which the first one I never even got a chance to respond to and was actually looking up) but then you couldn't resist that second one rant + flame like usual.

You are a troll. Don't expect me to answer crap if you cannot even be civil until you can get what you want without throwing a fit like a child.

Originally posted by: Vic

I didn't flame you.


"Wow... you call me a dumbass and an ideologue... your ideology is so far removed from logic and reality, it's hard not to point and laugh despite how sorry I feel for you and your delusions. "

you are calling me a dumbass here by insinuation, also that I am "removed from reality" (yet reality is I never said I subscribe to this and you just jumped to a conclusions without reading -as usual) and that you point and laugh at "my delusions" which is funny, because the whole "my" part is nothing but a delusion in...yep your own mind. Screw you Vic, once again lying after you got caught.

YOU entered the thread, and YOU started flamingbaiting in your second post, I had yet to respond to you.

 

[Vic]

Anarcho-communism is kind of the Tetragrammaton of political ideologies. Thou shalt not speak the State's Name.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
There is no answer as I do not subscribe to utopian fantasys, regardless of you repeating yourself, and it was you who started flaming in your second post you made in here to me (which the first one I never even got a chance to respond to and was actually looking up) but then you couldn't resist that second one rant + flame like usual.

You are a troll. Don't expect me to answer crap if you cannot even be civil until you can get what you want without throwing a fit like a child.

This is not a verbal conversation, rot. Anyone and everyone who cares to can look back through the posts and see who wasn't civil and who threw the childish tantrum.

There's nothing for you to look up. Anarcho-communism is the ultimate in utopist fantasies. In a "perfect" world (supposedly), humans might self-organize into such a system (which is the only way such a system could exist without the forced organization of a State). In the real world, humans don't and never will (except on very isolated local levels, like families and very tiny communities, and even then those have authoritarian structures).

 

[LegendKiller]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
There is no answer as I do not subscribe to utopian fantasys, regardless of you repeating yourself, and it was you who started flaming in your second post you made in here to me (which the first one I never even got a chance to respond to and was actually looking up) but then you couldn't resist that second one rant + flame like usual.

You are a troll. Don't expect me to answer crap if you cannot even be civil until you can get what you want without throwing a fit like a child.

You do subscribe to utopian fantasys. Your anarchist collective cannot work. A structure must be put in place or will exist anyway, no matter how you cut it. A collective is an organized body, which depend on each other to survive. Regardless of how you cut it, there is a structure there. Furthermore, somebody has to be there to enforce that structure, since without that everybody would die.

Whather you'd like to think so or not, you have to live in an environment of rules and constructs. You also live in a world where the human psyche strives for not only survival, but improvement. Of course there are the disaffected who are polar opposites of the power mongers, but the vast majority of people lie on the rest of the spectrum. They are those who get along just fine in the system. The only people making life hell are the ones on the end, perhaps they (you) should just shut up and enjoy your disaffected lifestyle and stop defacing my property in your selfish imposition of values.

 

[Steeplerot]

Read the damn posts -I was discussing it, I do not subscribe to anarchism in my own political view. for the forth time now

I dig the history part as all ww2 era stuff, but I think it is utopian thus impossible in practice.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
Read the damn posts -I was discussing it, I do not subscribe to anarchism in my own political view. for the forth time now

I dig the history part as all ww2 era stuff, but I think it is utopian thus impossible in practice.

FFS, rot, why do you constantly lie like this on an internet forum? This is not a verbal discussion.

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
To this day anarchism is looked upon as a bad word, it scares the living crap out of the folks who make a living profiting off the workers labor.

 

[Steeplerot]

And it does, for good reason.

Would a factory owner would like to see their factory taken over by workers or people walk out with their goods for nothing?

Do you disagree?

I didn't think so. You are still a troll up to your same crap, nice try.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
And it does, for good reason. Do you disagree?

Anarchism scares everybody. Workers aren't too happy about the prospect of it either, as it would remove from them (as from everybody) all guarantees of security and stability. That's why government is often referred to as that "necessary evil." Tell us, in an anarchy, who will keep the rich and powerful from abusing the poor and weak?

My point though is that you had not once in this thread refuted anarchism as your own political view, much less 4 times.

sigh... edit to your usual edit:

Would a factory owner would like to see their factory taken over by workers or people walk out with their goods for nothing?

Who is the factory owner? Scrooge McDuck? This ain't the 1880's anymore, rot. Today, factories are collectivized under the corporatist system. There is no "factory owner" in the singular sense.
If the workers take over the factory, don't they then become the owners? Is that theft too?
If people walk out with their goods for nothing, how will the factory keep producing goods? Magic?

I didn't think so. You are still a troll up to your same crap, nice try.

I see that you continue to avoid to my questions and still resort to personal attacks. I wonder why?...

 

[Steeplerot]

"I do not subscribe to anarchism in my own political view" you are either trolling or dense, my hunch is the latter, as usual.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
"I do not subscribe to anarchism in my own political view" you are either trolling or dense, my hunch is the latter, as usual.

Uh huh... for supposedly the fourth time now even though that was the first time you said such so in this thread. Right. Got it.

:roll:

 

[Moonbeam]

As a person who was made to feel profoundly worthless and then have that feeling deeply buried in my unconscious such that I have now no idea what it is that is driving me insane, I find, owing to my perhaps modest but none the less real intelligence, an urge to think away my fears and frustrations and feelings of impotence. This anarco thingi is just the ticket for me as a left leaning frustrated soul. I can join and satisfy my intellect with all sorts of fancy political theory and games, my loneliness and isolation with a sense of belonging to a group that is actually doing something, and all the while pretend I am in control and know where I am going. Yes this is just the ticket for me to escape personal responsibility for my own insanity. I can work to cure yours. I will make you sick like me and we will then all be very happy.

 

[Steeplerot]

Originally posted by: Vic

I see that you continue to avoid to my questions and still resort to personal attacks. I wonder why?...

I do not answer the questions of someone who comes in and flames like a child jumping to conclusions you should know better then make after how many discussions we have have had with me denouncing libertarianism and anarchist utopian fantasy, marxism I know of denouncing many many times, you are either purposefully forgetting and being dishonest or you need to lay off the weed, your short term memory sucks.