The Vatican and Irish reform schools...

[Mr. Lennon]

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Zeppelin2282

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Zeppelin2282

Originally posted by: Mursilis
Humans are fallible after all. Shocking.

Therefore the Bible is fallible. Fallible men wrote it.

Your logic fails. A fallible man also wrote the Pythagorean theorem (a^2+b^2=c^2), but no one's proven that one wrong, at least to my knowledge.

The Pythagorean theorem can be tested by anybody, and the results are always consistent. You can't say the same for the bible.

That wasn't the structure of your original argument. You argued the Bible was fallible because it came from fallible men. I merely demonstrated your lack of logic by citing an infallible theorom which came from fallible men.

Your argument fails because you assume that the bible is infallible.

 

[n yusef]

This has been going on for centuries. Hasn't anyone read de Sade?

 

[JEDIYoda]

Originally posted by: kage69
Disgusting news from the Emerald Isle. Were I a betting man I'd wage that a similar history has taken place in Poland.<-- why the comment concerning Poland you douche bag?? That was not necessary!! I bet you have never been to Poland....you have no clue yet you chose to be a fucking smart ass and assume that just because Poland is predominately Caqtholic that this is also happenning in nPoland!@!@....

 

[Red Irish]

Originally posted by: JEDIYoda
Originally posted by: kage69
Disgusting news from the Emerald Isle. Were I a betting man I'd wage that a similar history has taken place in Poland.<-- why the comment concerning Poland you douche bag?? That was not necessary!! I bet you have never been to Poland....you have no clue yet you chose to be a fucking smart ass and assume that just because Poland is predominately Caqtholic that this is also happenning in nPoland!@!@....

You may be right, there was no need to mention Poland; however, I think your rage in misdirected, or rather, I think you should concentrate on the primary targets:

The Catholic Church condoned systematic child abuse in the institutions it ran in Ireland

Seriously people, the focus here isn't Pythagoras, Poland or the Bible.

 

[Mursilis]

Originally posted by: Zeppelin2282

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Zeppelin2282

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Zeppelin2282

Originally posted by: Mursilis
Humans are fallible after all. Shocking.

Therefore the Bible is fallible. Fallible men wrote it.

Your logic fails. A fallible man also wrote the Pythagorean theorem (a^2+b^2=c^2), but no one's proven that one wrong, at least to my knowledge.

The Pythagorean theorem can be tested by anybody, and the results are always consistent. You can't say the same for the bible.

That wasn't the structure of your original argument. You argued the Bible was fallible because it came from fallible men. I merely demonstrated your lack of logic by citing an infallible theorom which came from fallible men.

Your argument fails because you assume that the bible is infallible.

And where did I say that? You really can't think, can you?

 

[StageLeft]

There is a good reason why nuns have a bad rap, I think. I remember in England they were feared, I certainly remember some nasty attention from one or two in particular. Nothing Godly tinkles my memory about them.

 

[seemingly random]

Originally posted by: Red Irish

Originally posted by: JEDIYoda
-sloppy rage-

You may be right, there was no need to mention Poland; however, I think your rage in misdirected, or rather, I think you should concentrate on the primary targets:

The Catholic Church condoned systematic child abuse in the institutions it ran in Ireland

Seriously people, the focus here isn't Pythagoras, Poland or the Bible.

It stuns me that with the obvious guilt admitted by every level including rome, that people still defend catholicism. The church has purportedly paid > $1 billion for various suits and hush money. Apparently, defenders must support the right of the priests to do whatever they want in spite of a country's laws - not to speak of the warped morality and trust betrayal. There is nothing to be done until the faithful are outraged enough to rise up.

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Zeppelin2282

Originally posted by: Mursilis
Humans are fallible after all. Shocking.

Therefore the Bible is fallible. Fallible men wrote it.

Your logic fails. A fallible man also wrote the Pythagorean theorem (a^2+b^2=c^2), but no one's proven that one wrong, at least to my knowledge.

the Pythagorean theorem existed prior to humanity; we did not create it, we only understood it. What a fail argument.

 

[Fear No Evil]

Its truly amazing to me the level of disgust people show toward the Catholic Church for something like this, but when someone DARES to point our that Islam may be responsible for the terrorists it creates.. they are labeled as bigots.

If we held Islam to 10% of the same level as we do Catholics this world would be a seriously better place. And don't get me wrong I am not saying what was done here was OK, I am saying we should apply that standard to all religious groups, and we don't.

 

[Mursilis]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Zeppelin2282

Originally posted by: Mursilis
Humans are fallible after all. Shocking.

Therefore the Bible is fallible. Fallible men wrote it.

Your logic fails. A fallible man also wrote the Pythagorean theorem (a^2+b^2=c^2), but no one's proven that one wrong, at least to my knowledge.

the Pythagorean theorem existed prior to humanity; we did not create it, we only understood it. What a fail argument.

No, the argument was only with the flawed notion that fallible human could not create or discover anything infallible. Your username continues to be truth in advertising.

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: Zeppelin2282

Originally posted by: Mursilis
Humans are fallible after all. Shocking.

Therefore the Bible is fallible. Fallible men wrote it.

Your logic fails. A fallible man also wrote the Pythagorean theorem (a^2+b^2=c^2), but no one's proven that one wrong, at least to my knowledge.

the Pythagorean theorem existed prior to humanity; we did not create it, we only understood it. What a fail argument.

No, the argument was only with the flawed notion that fallible human could not create or discover anything infallible. Your username continues to be truth in advertising.

lol. grow up.

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Its truly amazing to me the level of disgust people show toward the Catholic Church for something like this, but when someone DARES to point our that Islam may be responsible for the terrorists it creates.. they are labeled as bigots.

If we held Islam to 10% of the same level as we do Catholics this world would be a seriously better place. And don't get me wrong I am not saying what was done here was OK, I am saying we should apply that standard to all religious groups, and we don't.

There are many flavors of Islam just like there are of Christianity. The content of this thread deals specifically with the Catholic Church and it's conduct. I certainly do not lump the whole of Christianity in with them nor would I consider the entirety of Islam to be terrorist producers.

Christan religions as a whole do get a lot more checks against them these days as the more often than not are based in developed nations that are now far less tolerant of abuses. The terrible shit that goes down in most heavily Muslim nations is a direct result of their lack of development/education and historical social practices that most of us would consider barbaric.

 

[Mursilis]

Originally posted by: K1052
Christan religions as a whole do get a lot more checks against them these days as the more often than not are based in developed nations that are now far less tolerant of abuses.

That, and most Christians haven't made a recent habit out of threatening to kill their critics. Some fundamentalists have taken issue with the Harry Potter books, but I don't think J.K. Rowlings is afraid to come to Alabama. Whether she'd want to is a whole different story.

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: K1052
Christan religions as a whole do get a lot more checks against them these days as the more often than not are based in developed nations that are now far less tolerant of abuses.

That, and most Christians haven't made a recent habit out of threatening to kill their critics. Some fundamentalists have taken issue with the Harry Potter books, but I don't think J.K. Rowlings is afraid to come to Alabama. Whether she'd want to is a whole different story.

The Enlightnment really took the wind out of their persecution sails.

 

[Mani]

This is why I always chuckle when I see religious people judging other religions.

 

[Mr. Lennon]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Its truly amazing to me the level of disgust people show toward the Catholic Church for something like this, but when someone DARES to point our that Islam may be responsible for the terrorists it creates.. they are labeled as bigots.

If we held Islam to 10% of the same level as we do Catholics this world would be a seriously better place. And don't get me wrong I am not saying what was done here was OK, I am saying we should apply that standard to all religious groups, and we don't.

I think Fox news does a great job of spreading Islam hate on a daily basis. Most religious nuts still thinks Obama is a Muslim for crying out loud.

 

[Fear No Evil]

Originally posted by: Zeppelin2282

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Its truly amazing to me the level of disgust people show toward the Catholic Church for something like this, but when someone DARES to point our that Islam may be responsible for the terrorists it creates.. they are labeled as bigots.

If we held Islam to 10% of the same level as we do Catholics this world would be a seriously better place. And don't get me wrong I am not saying what was done here was OK, I am saying we should apply that standard to all religious groups, and we don't.

I think Fox news does a great job of spreading Islam hate on a daily basis. Most religious nuts still thinks Obama is a Muslim for crying out loud.

Well he did bow to the Saudi King..

 

[1prophet]

A much, much bigger problem due to the size of the schools but thanks to the Teachers Unions you never hear about many of them.

But it's much more fun to bash Catholics than look into the cesspool that is public schools and the much greater volume of abuse cases that are swept under the rug.

Accused of sexual abuse, but back in the classroom

L.A. Unified has failed to follow up on complaints once police or prosecutors dropped criminal actions, leaving students vulnerable to molesters.
By Jason Song

May 10, 2009

The 13-year-old on the witness stand looked to be an ordinary adolescent, her diffident smile unveiling a set of braces. Her attorney began gently, with questions about her favorite band and trips to the mall.

Then he brought up "Mr. Ricardo" and second grade. The girl buried her face in her hands and sobbed.

When her mother took the stand, she testified that the girl had not been the same since the day the teacher's aide put his hands on her. "I just believe this whole thing changed her life," the mother said. "I don't see her so confident around people. . . . I believe she has no interests."

A jury late last year ordered the Los Angeles Unified School District to pay nearly $1.6 million to the families of three girls molested by Ricardo Guevara, who is now serving 15 years in prison for lewd acts with a child.

But there was something the jury -- and the public -- was never told: This was the third set of accusations that Guevara had molested students. Twice before, when law enforcement officials had decided they lacked the evidence to win a criminal conviction, L.A. Unified officials had quietly put him back in the classroom.

Guevara's case fits a pattern, a Times investigation shows: Repeatedly, the district failed to follow up on sexual misconduct complaints against employees once police or prosecutors dropped criminal actions. Some ended up at new schools. In at least one instance -- involving Guevara -- the new principal had no idea of his history.

 

[Mursilis]

Originally posted by: 1prophet
A much, much bigger problem due to the size of the schools but thanks to the Teachers Unions you never hear about many of them.

But it's much more fun to bash Catholics than look into the cesspool that is public schools and the much greater volume of abuse cases that are swept under the rug.

Accused of sexual abuse, but back in the classroom

L.A. Unified has failed to follow up on complaints once police or prosecutors dropped criminal actions, leaving students vulnerable to molesters.
By Jason Song

May 10, 2009

The 13-year-old on the witness stand looked to be an ordinary adolescent, her diffident smile unveiling a set of braces. Her attorney began gently, with questions about her favorite band and trips to the mall.

Then he brought up "Mr. Ricardo" and second grade. The girl buried her face in her hands and sobbed.

When her mother took the stand, she testified that the girl had not been the same since the day the teacher's aide put his hands on her. "I just believe this whole thing changed her life," the mother said. "I don't see her so confident around people. . . . I believe she has no interests."

A jury late last year ordered the Los Angeles Unified School District to pay nearly $1.6 million to the families of three girls molested by Ricardo Guevara, who is now serving 15 years in prison for lewd acts with a child.

But there was something the jury -- and the public -- was never told: This was the third set of accusations that Guevara had molested students. Twice before, when law enforcement officials had decided they lacked the evidence to win a criminal conviction, L.A. Unified officials had quietly put him back in the classroom.

Guevara's case fits a pattern, a Times investigation shows: Repeatedly, the district failed to follow up on sexual misconduct complaints against employees once police or prosecutors dropped criminal actions. Some ended up at new schools. In at least one instance -- involving Guevara -- the new principal had no idea of his history.

We all know non-religious people don't commit sex crimes, especially involving children!

 

[seemingly random]

Originally posted by: Mursilis
...
We all know non-religious people don't commit sex crimes, especially involving children!

What a pitiful deflection.

What a disgusting defense.

This revelation has caused me to change my views. Priests shouldn't be condemned for screwing with boys because non-religious people have been found to do the same thing. We should quit picking on these poor misunderstood priests. They are bastions of morality and to be defended. They are still to be unquestionably trusted with your children.

Suckers...

 

[Mani]

delete

 

[Mr. Lennon]

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: 1prophet
A much, much bigger problem due to the size of the schools but thanks to the Teachers Unions you never hear about many of them.

But it's much more fun to bash Catholics than look into the cesspool that is public schools and the much greater volume of abuse cases that are swept under the rug.

Accused of sexual abuse, but back in the classroom

L.A. Unified has failed to follow up on complaints once police or prosecutors dropped criminal actions, leaving students vulnerable to molesters.
By Jason Song

May 10, 2009

The 13-year-old on the witness stand looked to be an ordinary adolescent, her diffident smile unveiling a set of braces. Her attorney began gently, with questions about her favorite band and trips to the mall.

Then he brought up "Mr. Ricardo" and second grade. The girl buried her face in her hands and sobbed.

When her mother took the stand, she testified that the girl had not been the same since the day the teacher's aide put his hands on her. "I just believe this whole thing changed her life," the mother said. "I don't see her so confident around people. . . . I believe she has no interests."

A jury late last year ordered the Los Angeles Unified School District to pay nearly $1.6 million to the families of three girls molested by Ricardo Guevara, who is now serving 15 years in prison for lewd acts with a child.

But there was something the jury -- and the public -- was never told: This was the third set of accusations that Guevara had molested students. Twice before, when law enforcement officials had decided they lacked the evidence to win a criminal conviction, L.A. Unified officials had quietly put him back in the classroom.

Guevara's case fits a pattern, a Times investigation shows: Repeatedly, the district failed to follow up on sexual misconduct complaints against employees once police or prosecutors dropped criminal actions. Some ended up at new schools. In at least one instance -- involving Guevara -- the new principal had no idea of his history.

We all know non-religious people don't commit sex crimes, especially involving children!

As said by seemingly random....such a fucking pitiful deflection. Non-religious people are not preaching every god damn Sunday to hundreds of people about MORALS and VALUES.

I dumped the Catholic church and religion all together when the priest molestation cases surfaced. I was already in the midst of questioning my faith...the molestation cases were the final straw. Absolutely amazes me that people still pack those churches every Sunday as if nothing happened. You should be fucking ashamed of yourself if you still support a religion that condones and tries to hide the sexual/physical abuse of children.

 

[kage69]

<-- why the comment concerning Poland you douche bag?? That was not necessary!! I bet you have never been to Poland....you have no clue yet you chose to be a fucking smart ass and assume that just because Poland is predominately Caqtholic that this is also happenning in nPoland!@!@....

First of all, save the insults for when you're standing in front of me tough guy. Not having a Polish customs stamp in my passport is irrelevant, but not as inappropriate as you trying to insinuate that I'm somehow bashing Poland. Were we to follow the context of your bitchin it would seem I should be equally disrespectful of Ireland over this debacle? Did you even read the rest of the OP? This is an anti-pedophile and anti-pedophile protection thread, NOT, I repeat NOT an anti-Polish thread.
Talk about taking something the wrong way.

My mention of Poland was in regards to it's connection to the church, very similar to that of Ireland's. Both are heavily catholic and (until relatively recently) quite agrarian. Schools and orphanages like the ones in the report are more common here than in other European countries. You can disagree with me, it's ok, but it helps to offer something in the way of supporting rational - as opposed to immediately calling someone a douchebag.

I hope that satisfies your misdirected indignation. For what it's worth, my family has a history of supporting and sponsoring families from Poland and Romania here in the States.

 

[marincounty]

Originally posted by: Mursilis

Originally posted by: 1prophet
A much, much bigger problem due to the size of the schools but thanks to the Teachers Unions you never hear about many of them.

But it's much more fun to bash Catholics than look into the cesspool that is public schools and the much greater volume of abuse cases that are swept under the rug.

Accused of sexual abuse, but back in the classroom

L.A. Unified has failed to follow up on complaints once police or prosecutors dropped criminal actions, leaving students vulnerable to molesters.
By Jason Song

May 10, 2009

The 13-year-old on the witness stand looked to be an ordinary adolescent, her diffident smile unveiling a set of braces. Her attorney began gently, with questions about her favorite band and trips to the mall.

Then he brought up "Mr. Ricardo" and second grade. The girl buried her face in her hands and sobbed.

When her mother took the stand, she testified that the girl had not been the same since the day the teacher's aide put his hands on her. "I just believe this whole thing changed her life," the mother said. "I don't see her so confident around people. . . . I believe she has no interests."

A jury late last year ordered the Los Angeles Unified School District to pay nearly $1.6 million to the families of three girls molested by Ricardo Guevara, who is now serving 15 years in prison for lewd acts with a child.

But there was something the jury -- and the public -- was never told: This was the third set of accusations that Guevara had molested students. Twice before, when law enforcement officials had decided they lacked the evidence to win a criminal conviction, L.A. Unified officials had quietly put him back in the classroom.

Guevara's case fits a pattern, a Times investigation shows: Repeatedly, the district failed to follow up on sexual misconduct complaints against employees once police or prosecutors dropped criminal actions. Some ended up at new schools. In at least one instance -- involving Guevara -- the new principal had no idea of his history.

We all know non-religious people don't commit sex crimes, especially involving children!

It's ironic that Richard Guevara, with his hispanic name, is probably- a CATHOLIC.

 

[kage69]

Its truly amazing to me the level of disgust people show toward the Catholic Church for something like this

Normally I'd find comments like this incredible, but then your type isn't really known for making intelligent or pertinent comments.

You find it amazing that people can be disgusted by the ongoing rape of children as well as the subsequent protection of those that commit it.

Yep, another stellar addition to your post history. :disgust: