The Rise of Men Who Don’t Work, and What They Do Instead

[Svnla]

This is not good. Prime age working men are not working and the rate is growing.

In the late 1960s, almost all men between the ages of 25 and 54 went to work. Only about5 out of every 100 did not have a job in any given week. By 2000, this figure had more than doubled, to 11 out of every 100 men. This year, it’s 16. (People in the military, prison and institutions are excluded from these figures.)

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/12/u...EEAD&kwp_0=7199&kwp_1=119130&kwp_4=53938&_r=0

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Why would anyone find this surprising? Unemployment figures are nonsense and the jobs that replaced the better paying ones are still lower than some years ago. Loss of opportunity + loss of hope = nothing to do.

 

[Mai72]

Why would anyone find this surprising? Unemployment figures are nonsense and the jobs that replaced the better paying ones are still lower than some years ago. Loss of opportunity + loss of hope = nothing to do.

I have to wonder if technology has made us lazy and complacent. Take video games for example. Imagine telling your wife or parents that you're going to play video games instead of finding work. Well, that is whats happening today. Take a look at TwitchTv and you can find thousands of people who stream for at least 8 hours a day. In the past, you worked or starved. I remember my father working 16 hour days. When I went back to college I worked midnights and took classes in the morning. In the summer I held down two jobs.

I'm not saying that I was better. I'm not better than anyone else. It's just that you don't see young people today busting ass and doing what's necessary to get ahead. To achieve your goals you sometimes need to make sacrifices.

 

[Blanky]

This is made possible in part by generous social programs. Also just a general acceptance of it among certain lower class demographics.

This brief article fails to capture what a sizable number of young, unemployed men are doing. I found the shittiest zip code in my area back in the summer and drove there one lunch. Saw lots of guys who should have been at work (or on lunch break) standing around in their neighborhoods in the middle of the street, on porches, etc. So these guys aren't doing anything productive at all.

In the past, you worked or starved.

Exactly. Because generous social programs have made it such that it's not strictly necessary anymore. It's possible to just scrape by--badly, true--but scrape by nonetheless doing basically nothing at all and you can do this for years. Many are unemployed for years on end and not because they are disabled but because they just can't be bothered.

 

[PokerGuy]

Why actually work for what you need when you can get it handed to you??

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

I have to wonder if technology has made us lazy and complacent. Take video games for example. Imagine telling your wife or parents that you're going to play video games instead of finding work. Well, that is whats happening today. Take a look at TwitchTv and you can find thousands of people who stream for at least 8 hours a day. In the past, you worked or starved. I remember my father working 16 hour days. When I went back to college I worked midnights and took classes in the morning. In the summer I held down two jobs.

I'm not saying that I was better. I'm not better than anyone else. It's just that you don't see young people today busting ass and doing what's necessary to get ahead. To achieve your goals you sometimes need to make sacrifices.

What would your father have done of he couldn't find a job or jobs? What if Walmart was too full up with greeters? What job would he hold if there were none to be had?

 

[Brainonska511]

nevermind.

 

[Mai72]

What would your father have done of he couldn't find a job or jobs? What if Walmart was too full up with greeters? What job would he hold if there were none to be had?

True, my father was from another era. But, I still think my statement holds true. A lot of young people are allergic to work. There are many reasons for this, but the main reason is we've gotten complacent.

I know I'm generalizing but how many young people work 12-16 hour days so they can get ahead? My parents had a restaurant for many years and my mom would hire foreigners the majority of the time. The reason is they worked harder. Most of the American workers she had would always ask for days off. They were the first to complain. This wasn't always the case, but it happened quite frequently.

 

[marincounty]

True, my father was from another era. But, I still think my statement holds true. A lot of young people are allergic to work. There are many reasons for this, but the main reason is we've gotten complacent.

I know I'm generalizing but how many young people work 12-16 hour days so they can get ahead? My parents had a restaurant for many years and my mom would hire foreigners the majority of the time. The reason is they worked harder. Most of the American workers she had would always ask for days off. They were the first to complain. This wasn't always the case, but it happened quite frequently.

My god, a day off? Next thing you know they want benefits like health care.
Much easier to let millions of illegals come here and work hard for peanuts, screw Americans and all of their needs.

 

[5150Joker]

The person that mentioned twitch tv nailed it. There's a few twitch and YouTube streamers that have struck it rich and because of that, you have thousands of copy cats trying to emulate that instead of getting an education or working. Case in point, I know of two guys who were raised in white middle class families and both have kids. Yet neither one works, they just play video games all day long. I advised them to go to a trade school but they just made excuses. It's a generational problem and Mitt Romney was right when he said half of America is just looking for a handout.

 

[Sonikku]

In the past, you worked or starved.

If jobs are just as plentiful, have the same productivity expectations and pay the same relative to cost of living (usually enough to support a whole family off one job) like in the 60's then there's no reason people today shouldn't be just as employed. It's not as though companies are expecting people to fill the roles of what originally had two people a decade ago doing them and that now there is a shortfall of some kind for our expanding population. Must just all be lazy.

 

[Zorkorist]

This is made possible in part by generous social programs. Also just a general acceptance of it among certain lower class demographics.

This brief article fails to capture what a sizable number of young, unemployed men are doing. I found the shittiest zip code in my area back in the summer and drove there one lunch. Saw lots of guys who should have been at work (or on lunch break) standing around in their neighborhoods in the middle of the street, on porches, etc. So these guys aren't doing anything productive at all.Exactly. Because generous social programs have made it such that it's not strictly necessary anymore. It's possible to just scrape by--badly, true--but scrape by nonetheless doing basically nothing at all and you can do this for years. Many are unemployed for years on end and not because they are disabled but because they just can't be bothered.

Blanky is right. It is Social Programs and Government jobs (another form of Social Programs.)

Police men, Fire men, Military, etc., all get pensions after 20 years of "service."

Meanwhile the rest of us work on.

-John

 

[Mai72]

My god, a day off? Next thing you know they want benefits like health care.
Much easier to let millions of illegals come here and work hard for peanuts, screw Americans and all of their needs.

I should have made myself clear.

My parents had a restaurant that did the bulk of its business in the summer. The foreigners she hired were college students from Romania. My mom told me that they worked as many hours possible so they could send the money back home. When I was talking about time off I meant that the American workers would ask for days off on national summer holidays like Memorial Day, 4th of July, and Labor Day. These are national holidays, and the busiest days for businesses at the shore. It's nearly impossible to get a day off. I don't know why anyone would expect to get off on 4th of July unless it was a personal tragedy.

 

[Vic]

Why actually work for what you need when you can get it handed to you??

Why don't you try that then?

 

[Mai72]

The person that mentioned twitch tv nailed it. There's a few twitch and YouTube streamers that have struck it rich and because of that, you have thousands of copy cats trying to emulate that instead of getting an education or working. Case in point, I know of two guys who were raised in white middle class families and both have kids. Yet neither one works, they just play video games all day long. I advised them to go to a trade school but they just made excuses. It's a generational problem and Mitt Romney was right when he said half of America is just looking for a handout.

They are in for a world of hurt when the government tightens the belt. I know a guy on Twitch who streams for 8 hours a day while his wife works a full time job. He has like 12 viewers, and has told me that this is his dream job. lol, I hope he's successful but I just don't know. Imagine if you lived in the 1950's and sat on your ass and played games all day? You would have been thrown out of the house, and you would have been ridiculed. You would have been called a bum. Yes, I know that times change.

I know this is all anecdotal. Still, I wonder if we have forgotten our roots.

 

[1prophet]

My god, a day off? Next thing you know they want benefits like health care.
Much easier to let millions of illegals come here and work hard for peanuts, screw Americans and all of their needs.

That is all fine and dandy , but when you ask an American to open up their wallet and pay a little more in goods and services, they don't say no problem because it is going to an American and all of their needs,

Oh no, instead they think you as a business owner is trying to rip them off so they take their money to the guy hiring illegals who charges a lot less.

 

[Ns1]

What would your father have done of he couldn't find a job or jobs? What if Walmart was too full up with greeters? What job would he hold if there were none to be had?

I would do what the mexicans in my neighborhood do - work as a team and scavenge for recyclables like a MFer.

 

[Zorkorist]

That is all fine and dandy , but when you ask an American to open up their wallet and pay a little more in goods and services, they don't say no problem because it is going to an American and all of their needs,

Oh no, instead they think you as a business owner is trying to rip them off so they take their money to the guy hiring illegals who charges a lot less.

The Government, which taxes and regulates everyone to hell and back, is responsible for raising prices on simple things, to the extent that we have to look for the best prices on everything.

It's a vicious cycle, and as long as the Government can spend uncontrollably, there is no hope for the normal American.

-John

 

[Zorkorist]

You can't hire a house-keeper today, as she will make minimum wages.

You have to report her, and pay taxes, etc.

-John

 

[Mai72]

You can't hire a house-keeper today, as she will make minimum wages.

You have to report her, and pay taxes, etc.

-John

That sucks.

When I was in Thailand I met a few foreigners who had housekeepers. They were paid $30 usd a week. You could never get away with that in America.

 

[Jhhnn]

That is all fine and dandy , but when you ask an American to open up their wallet and pay a little more in goods and services, they don't say no problem because it is going to an American and all of their needs,

Oh no, instead they think you as a business owner is trying to rip them off so they take their money to the guy hiring illegals who charges a lot less.

It's remarkable how easily Nativism is exploited. Offshoring & automation have had a much more profound effect than imported labor. Witness the rust belt & the devastation of employment in the manufacturing sector as a whole. Witness 30 years of insufficient wage growth. Witness the demise of Unions & pensions. Witness the rise of internet marketing. Witness the doubling of financial sector share of national income & the shift to the tippy-top. The list goes on. Witness the looting of America by her own Capitalists.

More Americans don't have jobs? No shit, Sherlock. Our economic leaders would rather hire somebody else, pit us against each other fighting for the scraps they leave behind.

 

[PokerGuy]

Why don't you try that then?

Why would I? I've done quite well for myself and am not looking for any handouts. I'm willing to work to get ahead. I know, it's shocking, but some people aren't too keen on just letting someone else pick up the tab for their life.

 

[Zorba]

It's remarkable how easily Nativism is exploited. Offshoring & automation have had a much more profound effect than imported labor. Witness the rust belt & the devastation of employment in the manufacturing sector as a whole. Witness 30 years of insufficient wage growth. Witness the demise of Unions & pensions. Witness the rise of internet marketing. Witness the doubling of financial sector share of national income & the shift to the tippy-top. The list goes on. Witness the looting of America by her own Capitalists.

More Americans don't have jobs? No shit, Sherlock. Our economic leaders would rather hire somebody else, pit us against each other fighting for the scraps they leave behind.

Look at the devastation of the construction industry for American workers in the south. Or the Farm hand in the west.

I agree that outsourcing and the death of unions has had a bigger impact than illegals, but that doesn't mean illegals have had no impact.

 

[Zorba]

I'd really like to see how the rate of working women has changed over that same period of time. I am guessing the rate of women working has grown far faster than the rate of men not working.

The article also hits on the fact that older people are not retiring as much as in the past, at least in part due to the death of pensions. But these people are taking up slots for younger men to fill.

So lets respin this thread to be about the massive increase in women workers and the working elderly and we can show how much less lazy America is than in 1960.

 

[nickqt]

This is made possible in part by generous social programs. Also just a general acceptance of it among certain lower class demographics.

This brief article fails to capture what a sizable number of young, unemployed men are doing. I found the shittiest zip code in my area back in the summer and drove there one lunch. Saw lots of guys who should have been at work (or on lunch break) standing around in their neighborhoods in the middle of the street, on porches, etc. So these guys aren't doing anything productive at all.Exactly. Because generous social programs have made it such that it's not strictly necessary anymore. It's possible to just scrape by--badly, true--but scrape by nonetheless doing basically nothing at all and you can do this for years. Many are unemployed for years on end and not because they are disabled but because they just can't be bothered.

Let's be real clear here.

The people playing video games for 8 hours a day aren't on SS, SSI, TANF, SCHIP and Medicaid.

Mom and dad are paying their bills.

Some people inherit millions from mom and dad and get to walk around as if they're a success story who should be respected for the company they "created' with those millions.

Other people sit in a basement staring at a computer screen while mom makes them sandwiches.

Blaming our non-existent "welfare" program is an obfuscation and a lie through misleading.