The reason why conservatives are morally deplorable

agent00f

Lifer
Jun 9, 2016
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James Flynn of the Flynn Effect fame explains the link between abstract thinking ability and moral reasoning.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vpqilhW9uI

To answer the title it's basically because they're ignorant and have low IQ, just like the ancestors they desire to emulate. All this will also perfectly explain why conservatives hate educated people, for discovering facts that are a source of embarrassment.
 

wirelessenabled

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Feb 5, 2001
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James Flynn of the Flynn Effect fame explains the link between abstract thinking ability and moral reasoning.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vpqilhW9uI

To answer the title it's basically because they're ignorant and have low IQ, just like the ancestors they desire to emulate. All this will also perfectly explain why conservatives hate educated people, for discovering facts that are a source of embarrassment.

I wouldn't say that Conservatives have low IQ. I would say that they have an extraordinary ability to ignore facts and bend their minds to a result that has little to do with reality. Trump is and is going to be a disaster for America. Let's hope that the Republican members of Congress realize that, and act on that, sooner rather than later.
 
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Moonbeam

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James Flynn of the Flynn Effect fame explains the link between abstract thinking ability and moral reasoning.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vpqilhW9uI

To answer the title it's basically because they're ignorant and have low IQ, just like the ancestors they desire to emulate. All this will also perfectly explain why conservatives hate educated people, for discovering facts that are a source of embarrassment.

You reached these conclusions on your own. There was no intent by the lecturer to reach such a point of view. His point, if any political is that modern people are ignorant of the past, that they do not know history, nor are they aware of the history and political systems of other countries and can't therefore form rational political views, true for all modern younger people not just conservatives.
 

disappoint

Lifer
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You reached these conclusions on your own. There was no intent by the lecturer to reach such a point of view. His point, if any political is that modern people are ignorant of the past, that they do not know history, nor are they aware of the history and political systems of other countries and can't therefore form rational political views, true for all modern younger people not just conservatives.

Where did he mention modern people are ignorant of the past?

What I got out of it is that modernity has placed demands on people to utilize cognitive ability in more flexible and abstract ways, leading to an increase in IQ and flexibility in changing mindsets given new information as well as consider hypothetical situations instead of rejecting them out of hand as our ancestors would.
 
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agent00f

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I wouldn't say that Conservatives have low IQ. I would say that they have an extraordinary ability to ignore facts and bend their minds to a result that has little to do with reality. Trump is and is going to be a disaster for America. Let's hope that the Republican members of Congress realize that, and act on that, sooner rather than later.

If you watch the video, he touches on the appeal to tradition inherent to archaic mindset. If there's a lesson of perspective here, it's these groups were displaced by progressively better (on average) generations through improved education, not necessarily that backwards individuals somehow figured out how to think better.

You reached these conclusions on your own. There was no intent by the lecturer to reach such a point of view. His point, if any political is that modern people are ignorant of the past, that they do not know history, nor are they aware of the history and political systems of other countries and can't therefore form rational political views, true for all modern younger people not just conservatives.

Reaching new conclusions is a natural by-product of abstract figuring, as the video explicitly demonstrates. Applying the lessons learned through that area of research to understand something else, let's say politics, is only going to be more pervasive as time passes and these abilities in the population improve.

The applicable distinction here is between peoples who're going to reach those milestones sooner rather than later. For example, the continuing progress of western liberalism, of which many are better students of than others.
 

Moonbeam

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Where did he mention modern people are ignorant of the past?

What I got out of it is that modernity has placed demands on people to utilize cognitive ability in more flexible and abstract ways, leading to an increase in IQ and flexibility in changing mindsets given new information as well as consider hypothetical situations instead of rejecting them out of hand as our ancestors would.
He mentions it toward the end where he says that cognitive functioning has not improved in all areas pointing out historical political knowledge as one example, where he points out the number of Western invasions of Afghanistan and their lack of success plus the lies we were told that and didn't know were lies, generally, that were used to get us into our last many major wars. A country, for example, that could elect Trump can only be full of ignorant idiots.
 
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Moonbeam

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If you watch the video, he touches on the appeal to tradition inherent to archaic mindset. If there's a lesson of perspective here, it's these groups were displaced by progressively better (on average) generations through improved education, not necessarily that backwards individuals somehow figured out how to think better.



Reaching new conclusions is a natural by-product of abstract figuring, as the video explicitly demonstrates. Applying the lessons learned through that area of research to understand something else, let's say politics, is only going to be more pervasive as time passes and these abilities in the population improve.

The applicable distinction here is between peoples who're going to reach those milestones sooner rather than later. For example, the continuing progress of western liberalism, of which many are better students of than others.

You may draw whatever conclusions you wish from the research but you imply that your conclusions are the ones the lecturer was making and I see him making the point that our whole culture is intellectually gifted compared to just a few generations ago. Why the primates that post here in P and N are filled with knuckle draggers can't be explained by a lack of education because many conservative imbeciles that post here have advanced degrees. I reaffirm that the explanation is that these troglodytes are simply moral degenerates who are motivated not to see how shameful their condition is because they were shamed as children and will not open themselves to remembering their pain, the only way that pain can be mended. Sick people do not like to know they are sick. What you want to do is find a rationalization for your own contempt for them. You are in denial of the fact that conservatives were fucked as children and nothing can be done about it. They were hurt and you want to hurt them more because people who hurt want others to hurt. That makes you just like them. You have to carry all that pain and live with it if you don't want to add to the worlds Karma. Sorry. Man up is all you can do.
 
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alcoholbob

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On the flip side higher IQ individuals are also more likely to fall prey to certain logical failures like the conjunction fallacy.
 

John Connor

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Nov 30, 2012
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To answer the title it's basically because they're ignorant and have low IQ, just like the ancestors they desire to emulate.


You must have a really low IQ buddy. Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin and Madison just to name a few were some of the most astute brilliant visionaries since the Renaissance.

Get off my lawn and don't tread on me!
 

1sikbITCH

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Jan 3, 2001
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James Flynn of the Flynn Effect fame explains the link between abstract thinking ability and moral reasoning.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vpqilhW9uI

To answer the title it's basically because they're ignorant and have low IQ, just like the ancestors they desire to emulate. All this will also perfectly explain why conservatives hate educated people, for discovering facts that are a source of embarrassment.

I have a friend from Arkansas who escaped and is now educated and has met black people.
He tells stories about his parents who to this day believe that black people cause polio and that gay people are here to punish us for being bad Christians. Everyone there in the little backwoods village or whatever of course is a Republican. And they do not want to discuss it.
 

agent00f

Lifer
Jun 9, 2016
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You may draw whatever conclusions you wish from the research but you imply that your conclusions are the ones the lecturer was making and I see him making the point that our whole culture is intellectually gifted compared to just a few generations ago. Why the primates that post here in P and N are filled with knuckle draggers can't be explained by a lack of education because many conservative imbeciles that post here have advanced degrees. I reaffirm that the explanation is that these troglodytes are simply moral degenerates who are motivated not to see how shameful their condition is because they were shamed as children and will not open themselves to remembering their pain, the only way that pain can be mended. Sick people do not like to know they are sick. What you want to do is find a rationalization for your own contempt for them. You are in denial of the fact that conservatives were fucked as children and nothing can be done about it. They were hurt and you want to hurt them more because people who hurt want others to hurt. That makes you just like them. You have to carry all that pain and live with it if you don't want to add to the worlds Karma. Sorry. Man up is all you can do.

I don't think you've fully understood the points that flynn rather convincingly argues. First, the flynn effect is just an average across the population, not a floor for abstract reasoning ability, so being born into modern times is no guarantee of high IQ. It's certainly possible to get by in school to a surprising level by largely memorizing and regurgitating without full awareness going on upstairs.

Second, there's always some risk in the social sciences and certainly psychology to attribute cause as "this instead of that", implying mutual exclusion of causes which isn't necessarily the case, when contributory causation is all a matter of degree. It doesn't seem to me that deficiency in abstract reasoning precludes moral deficiency, especially when flynn precisely makes a concrete case that the former leads to the latter (with the religious example, etc).

Third, the question of "moral degeneracy" is an not entirely straightforward proposition, because linguistically speaking it's really a concatenation of two distinguishable phenomena. One is the personal ethical choices we make, eg whether to ban arabs because a few of them are real shifty, and the other is social interpretation of those actions. To persons who cannot reason about numbers or empathize abstractly, it may well be from their perspective that they're rightly protecting the tribe (ie their own) by ostracizing people of given appearance who can be enemies. This in direct contrast to post-enlightenment values which has the opposite take on matters of bigotry.

It's certainly my experience and I'm guessing yours that many of these people really do have some trouble grasping the finer points of enlightenment reasoning. Like they've been told and therefore aware that bigotry is bad, same as this or that illegal thing is bad, but can't figure out why (to varying degrees) due to insufficient cognitive tools. Therefore in a dispute between innate loyalty vs. abstract ideal, it's perfectly understandable they go with their gut instead of what's taught by leftard teachers. In sum, very much degenerate by the standard of modern social mores, but not by archaic ones befitting their intellectual prospects.


You must have a really low IQ buddy. Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin and Madison just to name a few were some of the most astute brilliant visionaries since the Renaissance.

Get off my lawn and don't tread on me!

Case in point, someone who lacks said tools to grasp the basis for that "brilliant vision".
 

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
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I wouldn't say that Conservatives have low IQ. I would say that they have an extraordinary ability to ignore facts and bend their minds to a result that has little to do with reality. Trump is and is going to be a disaster for America. Let's hope that the Republican members of Congress realize that, and act on that, sooner rather than later.

Agreed. I would restate this as, being intelligent is not the same thing as being rational. Intelligence is raw mental capacity. Rationality has to do with separating emotion from the process of reasoning. Those unable to separate the two will waste whatever raw capacity they have.
 

agent00f

Lifer
Jun 9, 2016
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Agreed. I would restate this as, being intelligent is not the same thing as being rational. Intelligence is raw mental capacity. Rationality has to do with separating emotion from the process of reasoning. Those unable to separate the two will waste whatever raw capacity they have.

It would help to watch the video, IQ is defined by abstract thinking ability which is evidently necessary to reason about modern/sophisticated moral values. It's of course possible to adhere to any given moral value without reasoning about it, but it perfectly explains why conservatives stuck on some archaic value for whatever reason cannot understand why they're degenerate. Similar to being given a poor mark by some teacher on a test problem, but for the life of them can't figure why and end up hating on education out of frustration.
 

WHAMPOM

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Feb 28, 2006
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You must have a really low IQ buddy. Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin and Madison just to name a few were some of the most astute brilliant visionaries since the Renaissance.

Get off my lawn and don't tread on me!

What is the connection of those most astute brilliant visionaries to today's conservatives?
I really want to know besides coat tail riding?
 

1sikbITCH

Diamond Member
Jan 3, 2001
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What is the connection of those most astute brilliant visionaries to today's conservatives?
I really want to know besides coat tail riding?

He certainly went back a few years for his examples of a brilliant conservative mind. Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay back.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
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I don't think you've fully understood the points that flynn rather convincingly argues..

My question is whether you understand the points you are trying to make. In your OP you stated:
"All this will also perfectly explain why conservatives hate educated people, for discovering facts that are a source of embarrassment."

What does that say? It says that conservatives hate the kind of increased intellectual capacity modern education has effected because for some reason they feel inferior in their capacity to so reason themselves, that they feel embarrassed not only by their lack of capacity but to express that kind of capacity among their peers. They have been humiliated by the fools who surrounded them as children and now conform to those same standards humiliating their own children. They do not lack the capacity to reason, they suppress its use for fear of ridicule. The contempt that was directed at them as children they now direct at others Our buddy John Connor, here, is a perfect example of such an anti-intellectual. But he is a programmed machine and not at fault for what he does. He can do only what he was programmed to do because he will not see how embarrassing he is in reality. He was badly hurt and won't open up to that pain. Of what use is it to kick somebody like that. People who have to kick are just a different kind of programmed machine. There is no where to go. Nobody to cure. You can only save yourself. Shine a light. Put down the hammer.
 
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agent00f

Lifer
Jun 9, 2016
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> They do not lack the capacity to reason, they suppress its use for fear of ridicule.

Just so we're clear on what "capacity" means, most humans have the capacity to run very long distances a la marathon, but we don't consider any such unfulfilled "capacity" due to lack of physical practice/development a suppression.
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
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but we don't consider any such unfulfilled "capacity" due to lack of physical practice/development a suppression.

Wouldn't it be? If as a child one were beaten / harassed / bullied for ever wanting to run?
 

agent00f

Lifer
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Wouldn't it be? If as a child one were beaten / harassed / bullied for ever wanting to run?

When a skill requires personal development/diligence to obtain, like say calculus/physics, or somewhat akin levels of abstract moral thinking as explained in the video, that's not the context/situation the linguistic concept of "suppression" refers to. And the moral scenario just like the physical one, where there certainly are lifelong fatties who work their way to fitness, it's a noteworthy exception far from the norm.