The POPE has it right!!!!

[JEDIYoda]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101026...hdGVfc3VtbWFyeV9saXN0BHNsawNwb3BlY291bnRyaWU-

Pope: countries have a right to defend borders
VATICAN CITY – Pope Benedict XVI says all countries have the right to regulate immigration flows and protect their borders, and immigrants must respect the laws and national identity of their host nations.

The pontiff said in a message that every person has a right to migrate in search of better living conditions.

The Vatican on Tuesday issued the pope's message for the church's World Day for Migrants and Refugees, which is celebrated Jan. 16.

Benedict said that, as the word's societies become more multiethnic and intercultural, people should seek dialogue and respect each other's differences. States must respect the dignity of all migrants and share their resources, while immigrants "have the duty to integrate into the host country."
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Notice that imigrants don`t have the right to try to change the national identity of the host country, whether it be Jewish or Canadian or Muslim or American!!

Yet there are those on these forums who would argue against this....

 

[Jaskalas]

Yet there are those on these forums who would argue against this....

Those who'll say they want the destruction of the host country? They're too intelligent to just come out and say it. It'll be immigrant rights they argue 'for' and anyone who wants to protect their country will be a racist xenophobic bigot.

Why does the Pope hate brown people? Was he in the Hitler youth?

 

[JEDIYoda]

Why does the Pope hate brown people? Was he in the Hitler youth?

Why are you trying to derail this thread, with nothing that has anything to do with the subject matter?

 

[CanOWorms]

Sorry, but genocide and racism isn't a valid national identity.

 

[JEDIYoda]

Sorry, but genocide and racism isn't a valid national identity.

-- we all know there are exceptions to every issue but we are not talking about genocide or even racism for that matter....but it`s easy to not see the whole picture when it really does not affect you at all...

I`m also am sorry but that is not even an issue -- Lets take a country -- say Germany --
As my friend SamurAchzar stated -- Germans are entitled to decide who's getting in their country and who doesn't. This has nothing to do with Nazism, it has to do with maintaining national identity and some degree of homogeneous population. It's very easy to judge people from afar, but what would happen if your neighborhood was inhabited by large number of uneducated Muslim Middle Easterns, who have decidedly different values and mentality?
Many of these people aren't immigrating to Germany in order to be Germans. They are just looking for a more accommodating place to continue living their current lives, and this is destructive. This is how you form ghettos and get an uneducated, violent, religious underclass which later goes on to burn down your cities (think of Paris).
I doubt it has much to do with economic conditions, it's squarely directed at the Muslims coming in. You'd be a fool not to see the context here.--If Europe, as a whole, doesn't curb down Muslim immigration there will be severe problems down the line, from both sides.

You can take what was said above and instead of germany ...insert your own country or origin....just my opinion..

 

[CanOWorms]

-- we all know there are exceptions to every issue but we are not talking about genocide or even racism for that matter....but it`s easy to not see the whole picture when it really does not affect you at all...

I`m also am sorry but that is not even an issue -- Lets take a country -- say Germany --
As my friend SamurAchzar stated -- Germans are entitled to decide who's getting in their country and who doesn't. This has nothing to do with Nazism, it has to do with maintaining national identity and some degree of homogeneous population.

It definitely has a relation to bigotry. Which Germans get to decide who gets in and who doesn't? Do Germans of Turkish descent get to participate? Do Germans of Turkish descent also get a say in the national identity?

It's very easy to judge people from afar, but what would happen if your neighborhood was inhabited by large number of uneducated Muslim Middle Easterns, who have decidedly different values and mentality?
Many of these people aren't immigrating to Germany in order to be Germans. They are just looking for a more accommodating place to continue living their current lives, and this is destructive. This is how you form ghettos and get an uneducated, violent, religious underclass which later goes on to burn down your cities (think of Paris).

Doesn't the "burn down your cities (think of Paris)" thing show that integration is going well? That is how the French act. Look at what's been going on for the last few weeks.

I doubt it has much to do with economic conditions, it's squarely directed at the Muslims coming in. You'd be a fool not to see the context here.--If Europe, as a whole, doesn't curb down Muslim immigration there will be severe problems down the line, from both sides.

It seems like there would be severe problems if Europe doesn't accommodate more immigration given their declining demographics.

 

[soulcougher73]

It definitely has a relation to bigotry. Which Germans get to decide who gets in and who doesn't? Do Germans of Turkish descent get to participate? Do Germans of Turkish descent also get a say in the national identity?

Well if you are of Turkish decent then you are not really German now are you? You may be a German citizen but that does not make you a German. I know, i know im using the same word "German" in two different contexts, but hopefully you are smart enough to follow what i mean.

But in case you're not:
Of German decent is not the same as German Citizen.

 

[CanOWorms]

Well if you are of Turkish decent then you are not really German now are you? You may be a German citizen but that does not make you a German. I know, i know im using the same word "German" in two different contexts, but hopefully you are smart enough to follow what i mean.

But in case you're not:
Of German decent is not the same as German Citizen.

So only people of German descent AND German citizenship get to choose what is to be the "national identity" in Germany?

Should the world even let them? After all, the last time they went crazy for this national identity stuff they massacred millions of people.

 

[sportage]

KNowing how the church stood with Hitler, Im not impressed.
Just because you wear a funny hat doesnt make one Gaundi.

 

[Brigandier]

What does integrating into society mean?

 

[werepossum]

KNowing how the church stood with Hitler, Im not impressed.
Just because you wear a funny hat doesnt make one Gaundi.

Shouldn't that be "Just because you wear a diaper that doesn't mean you are Gandhi"? By papal standards, Gandhi's headgear wasn't humorous in the slightest.

 

[werepossum]

Well if you are of Turkish decent then you are not really German now are you? You may be a German citizen but that does not make you a German. I know, i know im using the same word "German" in two different contexts, but hopefully you are smart enough to follow what i mean.

But in case you're not:
Of German decent is not the same as German Citizen.

WTF? You want to have some citizens who are more equal than others?

Pretty sure that has been done in Germany before. I seem to remember the world administering a gigantic bitch-slapping, maybe starting around June 1944 . . .

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

So only people of German descent AND German citizenship get to choose what is to be the "national identity" in Germany?

Should the world even let them? After all, the last time they went crazy for this national identity stuff they massacred millions of people.

I agree with you that citizens of a nations are as much of a part of that nation as everyone else.

The rest of your bullshit you can shove up your arse though, no nation on this earth including the US and the UK concerns itself as much of it's past as Germany does.

I'm not even very convinced that it's all that much productive anymore because it actually teaches Germans to be ashamed of their past which, if they had no part in it, they shouldn't be. Besides, the last time Germany had a bout with national identity, the first thing that happened was that they went to war.

Last time the US had a bout with national identity was every day and there have been a multitude of wars because of it, American pride is still stronger than any other nations pride in the world with the possible exception of South Africa.

 

[alphatarget1]

The pope has no credibility as far as I'm concerned since he knew about and covered up church sex abuses. If there is a Christian hell, this Nazi Pope belongs there.

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

WTF? You want to have some citizens who are more equal than others?

Pretty sure that has been done in Germany before. I seem to remember the world administering a gigantic bitch-slapping, maybe starting around June 1944 . . .

O for fucks sakes, history that none of the population partook in is irrelevant, you're smarter than this.

 

[techs]

I always get my moral advice from former Nazis.

 

[iGas]

Nice we now have Neo-Jew/s worshiping former Nazi.

 

[werepossum]

O for fucks sakes, history that none of the population partook in is irrelevant, you're smarter than this.

History is ALWAYS important. If we ignore those mistakes made before our time we are doomed to repeat them.

Even more important than history though are principles. A modern state simply cannot have some citizens who represent the culture and some citizens who do not. A country's culture is the aggregate of ALL its citizens. Yes, people need to assimilate into the culture, but assimilation still brings change. Culture always evolves, and should; just look at Afghanistan for the result of culture not evolving (beyond substituting RPGs and Kalashnikovs for pointy sticks I mean.)

I completely support limiting the number of new citizens coming in, especially from countries with widely differing cultures. I completely support requiring ALL citizens (and resident non-citizens) to learn to properly speak, read and write the language of the nation, to pledge allegiance to the country, to learn and abide by its laws. But I cannot support having a multi-tiered system by which some are "real citizens" representing the country's culture and some are citizens in name only. That's just wrong.

 

[iGas]

Adolf Hitler quotes:

By the skillful and sustained use of propaganda, one can make a people see even heaven as hell or an extremely wretched life as paradise.

As a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, but I have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice.

I believe today that my conduct is in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator.

Who says I am not under the special protection of God?

Great liars are also great magicians.

How fortunate for governments that the people they administer don't think.

 

[CanOWorms]

I agree with you that citizens of a nations are as much of a part of that nation as everyone else.

The rest of your bullshit you can shove up your arse though, no nation on this earth including the US and the UK concerns itself as much of it's past as Germany does.

I'm not even very convinced that it's all that much productive anymore because it actually teaches Germans to be ashamed of their past which, if they had no part in it, they shouldn't be. Besides, the last time Germany had a bout with national identity, the first thing that happened was that they went to war.

Young Germans today don't concern themselves with the past. Surveys show that most young Germans don't even know what the Holocaust was!

http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,,1561164,00.html

Last time the US had a bout with national identity was every day and there have been a multitude of wars because of it, American pride is still stronger than any other nations pride in the world with the possible exception of South Africa.

The problem is that many of these issues in Europe are more about racial pride and supremacy. That creates such a dangerous situation. And having knowledge of history is important because it shows that it repeatedly leads to genocide in Europe.