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The Philadelphia beating

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NoPity

Banned
Jun 30, 2000
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403, if you caught a man raping your daughter or attempting to kill her AND you killed that person, I would think that it would be considered justified.

Regardless of your "value" system, the death of some of these people IS the right thing!
 

Stosh

Platinum Member
Oct 13, 1999
2,149
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I apologize, I shouldn't talk that way. That fact is, those cops will not get justice. They'll get crucified in the media, and by all those race baiters like Jackson and Sharpton.

Did you hear the latest nonsense. I think Sharpton went to Detroit because a black security guard for some store put a choke hold on a black shoplifter and the criminal later died. It's a race issue because the owners of the store are white. You can't win.

I'm just getting old and cranky, and I'm really getting sick of criminal violence. It's always somebody else's fault, never the criminals.

 

403Forbidden

Banned
May 4, 2000
2,268
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<< 403, if you caought a man raping your daughter or attempting to kill her AND you killed that person, I would think that it would be considered justified. >>




No Pity,

No I was talking about if I learned later that my daughter was raped and then I went hunting for the rapist. If I went hunting for the rapist later and killed him, that is vigilante justice. Vigilante not be condoned in this country. And, while I hope you'd all understand why I chose vigilante justice, I would still totally expect to be punished by a court of law.

It's different if I killed the rapist during the act of the rape because by killing him then, I was stopping the crime.

 

NoPity

Banned
Jun 30, 2000
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403, would you accept that the jury did understand your actions and let you go free?

Or, do you just want to be &quot;naughty&quot; 403, and take your punishment? :)

First question was serious.
 

Yeeny

Lifer
Feb 2, 2000
10,848
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Ok, now I can understand the police losing their tempers, after what he put them through. What bothers me is the mob mentality, with twelve of them beating on him. You see it everyday in so many places, people losing control in groups, and attacking people. Like the LA Riots, police should not be any less accountable for actions like these because they lose control. I don't think they should be permanently suspended, as they are only human and will sometimes react to a situation in not the best way. But I do think some form of reprimand is in order.
 

403Forbidden

Banned
May 4, 2000
2,268
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<< 403, would you accept that the jury did understand your actions and let you go free? Or, do you just want to be &quot;naughty&quot; 403, and take your punishment? First question was serious >>



I would take whatever the jury decided. If the jury let me go free, I'm not gonna be stupid and argue that I, myself, should still be punished. Thats arguing against your own liberty. No sane person would do that. All I am saying is that I expect to be punished if I broke the law...I'm not gonna be suprised or argue that i shouldn't be punsihed either.

There are many reasons why jurys find a suspect not guilty. A lot of times they believe a suspect is guitly, but the say &quot;not guitly&quot; because the Prosecutor did a bad job and did not prove guilt.

All I am saying is that BOTH the suspect, and the Philly cops should be punished. If the jury finds the cops &quot;not guilty&quot;, it could be because of a variety of things.
 

Dean

Platinum Member
Oct 10, 1999
2,757
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they should have just shot and killed him in the vehicle...then none of this discussion would be necessary
 

Stark

Diamond Member
Jun 16, 2000
7,735
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The guy got what he deserved.

If cops lose their jobs, it will teach cops across the county one lesson: don't stop shooting (aka shoot for the head).
 
Jul 14, 2000
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I think one of the big reasons there is still racism in America is because the media keeps it that way. The media feeds on situations that could be percieved as racist and they always mention it as a possible racial issue. This in turn fuels racism by pissing white and black people off accordingly.
 
Jul 14, 2000
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On the note of rape, If somebody rapedmy girlfriend, even if i found out a week later, at the least i would seek him out and break his arms and legs. prosecutors dont seek maximum penalties for vigilante revengism. at most I would get a few months in jail and it would so be worth it.
 
Jul 14, 2000
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everyone is focusing on the wrong issue. the fact is, this person tried to kill a cop, then stole a vehicle and in a hide speed chase endangered EVERYONE on the road, then he fought the cops when they stopped him, but instead everyone cares because he got a few kicks and hits from the cops. Understandably, the cops acted outside the call of duty while they beat him, they should get a slap ont he wrist since their behavior was justice. which should be t he prime concern.

 

ltk007

Banned
Feb 24, 2000
6,209
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You guys don't know the whole story here. The guy was resisting arrest like a bitch and was fighting those cops off with all his strength. He's huge and he bit a few of em too. I think the beating started as a way to subdue him and just got a little out of hand. The man shot a cop, stole a car, and then led the cops on a dangerous high speed chase. He got what he deserved.
 

Double Trouble

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
9,273
103
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The cops should get a verbal reprimand or warning for using somewhat excessive force, and that should be the end of it.

The guy deserved to be killed, but got off easy. He should count his lucky stars he's alive. I completely understand the cops 'boiling over', as Rogue so aptly put it, as anyone else would in this situation. Of course, as a society, we can't condone what they did, no matter how justified..... so the cops should be let off with a warning.
 

PCAddict

Diamond Member
Nov 19, 1999
3,804
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I have to put in my $.02 here. I live in the Philly suburbs, and I know more than a few Philly cops.

Here are the facts. The guy is a criminal. He shot at a cop. He deserved what he got and then some. He needs to go inside. This guy cannot be put back on the street. He's got a prior record as long as my arm. There are two separate situations here. Maybe the cops did go too far. I agree that hey should get verbal warnings, and maybe be on some sort of probation . That should be the end of it. The &quot;victim&quot; (gag) needs to be tried, convicted, and sentenced. Period.
 

CyberSax

Banned
Mar 12, 2000
1,253
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Police officers have no right to beat the living sh|t out of you, once they have you in custody and you're incapacitated. That follows no sort of procedure and is just plain wrong.

I apologize, I shouldn't talk that way. That fact is, those cops will not get justice. They'll get crucified in the media, and by all those race baiters like Jackson and Sharpton.

Did you hear the latest nonsense. I think Sharpton went to Detroit because a black security guard for some store put a choke hold on a black shoplifter and the criminal later died. It's a race issue because the owners of the store are white. You can't win.

I'm just getting old and cranky, and I'm really getting sick of criminal violence. It's always somebody else's fault, never the criminals.


OK. What planet are you living on? You're like one of those white people who think its the end of the world now, that minorities have a few rights here and there and occasionaly get their day in court.

In the Rodney King beating (which was a hell of a lot worse than this), all four cops were set free. After a large chunk of Los Angeles was burned down, the court reconsidered its decision and gave partial punishment to two of the officers. In the two police brutality incidents in New York City, I don't believe any cops were convicted (and these incicidents were *worse* than the Rodney King beating, only less publicized). And in the bombing of the move compound in Philadelphia, hardly anyone was held accountable.

Don't worry man, although Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson may occasionally cause a fuss, the white man's justice system is still - 9 times out of 10 - protecting your right to harass minorities and get away with it.
 

Ulfwald

Moderator Emeritus<br>Elite Member
May 27, 2000
8,646
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Ok, here is news for everyone here Cops are not legally bound to protect anyone. This is from a supreme court ruling. Many cops do what they do due to a sense of duty and pride. So lay off them. They are human too, and many times do make mistakes, the same mistakes you would make in the same situation. So quit roasting them.
Cybersax, true, for many years, the justice system did favor the &quot;whiteman&quot;, but today, due to affirmative action and other such programs, the caucasion community is now the most widely discriminated against in the US. Many people are hired just to fill quotas set by the gov't, not for their skill or knowledge.

If you also read the facts, this was not a racial issue, there were black cops as well as white cops participating in this arrest. We need to quit playing the race card on every little thing. This was not a racial issue, it was an issue of public safety.
 

403Forbidden

Banned
May 4, 2000
2,268
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<< Ok, here is news for everyone here Cops are not legally bound to protect anyone. >>



Could you please provide some sort of proof for this satement? Since all court decisions are of public record, it will be easy to find this case online...that is if it really exists.

Fact is, any person that fails to uphold their &quot;duty&quot; can be legally prosecuted, both criminal and civil. Medical doctors have a duty to protect life, Cops have a duty to protect the peace.

Any medical professional who sees a dieing person in need of help, and simply walks by, can be prosecuted. Likewise, any cop who sees someone in danger, but simply walks by, can be prosecuted.
 

T2T III

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
12,899
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Cops are frustrated. Imagine having to pick up shoplifters for the first 6 hours of your shift and then all of a sudden, you get entangled with this mess. Trying to chase the loser down ... the stress keeps building ... reports come in that a cop was shot ... the stress keeps building ... this loser is trying everything to get away from you ... and the stress keeps building. Finally, he wrecks the police car, get pulled out of the car ... stress keeps building ... and proceeds to keep on fighing. By that point, you -- the cop, is quite irritated. Are you going to shake his hand and say &quot;have a nice day&quot;? I think not!

Unfortunately, there doesn't appear to be a good method for cops keep their cool in situations like this.

Having said that, this guy got what he deserved. Nothing like a good wood shampoo to start the morning off right.
 

CyberSax

Banned
Mar 12, 2000
1,253
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Unlike Saudi Arabia, America is not some kind of police state that caters to angry mob justice. The procedure that's followed here is to prevent the police, undoubtedly the most powerful civilian members of society, from being corrupted by their power.

The purpose of the police is *not* to punish. That is the purpose of the legal system. The police have only the authority to apprehend a subject. But some force is justifiable. If a suspect refuses to cooperate in an arrest, the police can use force to incapacitate that person. If an individual fires at the police, the police can fire back at them. But once a suspect is in custody, what possible purpose could beating the cr@p out of that suspect possibly serve? From the video, it was pretty apparent that the guy was incapacitated by the police moments after he got out of his car (since they outnumbered him 20 to 1), but they went on beating him for at least a minute. Why?

Many people here seem to think that its understandable that the cops beat the guy, and therefore they should be let off. Well of course it's &quot;understandable&quot;. But then again, most battery and assault incidents in this country would be &quot;understandable&quot; if you listened to the facts behind it. If someone did something mean to me, and later on in the day, I went and beat the cr@p out of him, I would face assault charges. Thankfully - unlike millitary officers - civilian police officers are not, at any time, &quot;above the law&quot;. When they commit a vicious act of battery, regardless of the fact that they were angry, they must be held accountable for it.
 

NoPity

Banned
Jun 30, 2000
14
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cybersax, you appear to have a HUGE chip on your shoulder.

I have some news for you. CONTRARY TO WHAT SHARPTON WOULD HAVE YOU BELIEVE, THERE REALLY ARE BLACK CRIMINALS OUT THERE. Maybe someday you'll run into one. But I guess you won't mind, it isn't their fault they are a criminal.

By the way, why are you even supporting such a s-h-i-t anyway. Does anyone here remember Tawana Brawley?


 

CyberSax

Banned
Mar 12, 2000
1,253
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Why don't you read my post first. How am I supporting Al Sharpton?

What I said was that idiots like you hear blowhards like Al Sharpton on TV, and about 5%-10% reservation quotas for universities and jobs (need I remind you that 12% of the population is black, and another 12% is Hispanic), and then - because of an utter lack of logic - you suddenly feel threatened and reach the laughable conclusion that white people in this country are being discriminated against.

And when did I say there aren't black criminals? Last time I checked, the guy in Philadelphia who got beat up did commit quite a few crimes. But I fail to see how that suddenly delegates the police the authority to do whatever the hell they want to him.
 

chess9

Elite member
Apr 15, 2000
7,748
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My dad was a cop, as many of you know. So, I tend to wax nostalgic about cops at times. But the boys in Philly went a skosh too far. I would expect some fallout. The guy must have been on crack. It makes you strong like a bull and very aggressive. A couple of guys overreacted. Nothing serious though. He's still breathing, and lucky to be doing so.

No reason to take this opportunity to dump on cops, though. Most of them are doing a great job under really difficult circumstances.
 
Apr 5, 2000
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Once hes on the ground with no gun hes no threat to anyone especially with the 30+ cops surrounding him - beating him was unnecessary
 

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