The Official French Connection: Disturbing, Thought-Provoking Truths Surrounding France's Veto!

[xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx]

Resolution 687: Iraqi Cease-Fire Terms

20. Decides, effective immediately, that the prohibitions against the
sale or supply to Iraq of commodities or products, other than medicine and
health supplies, and prohibitions against financial transactions related
thereto contained in resolution 661 (1990) shall not apply to foodstuffs
notified to the Security Council Committee established by resolution 661 (1990)
concerning the situation between Iraq and Kuwait or, with the approval of that
Committee, under the simplified and accelerated "no-objection" procedure, to
materials and supplies for essential civilian needs as identified in the report
of the Secretary-General dated 20 March 1991, and in any further findings of
humanitarian need by the Committee;


24. Decides that, in accordance with resolution 661 (1990) and subsequent
related resolutions and until a further decision is taken by the Security
Council, all States shall continue to prevent the sale or supply, or the
promotion or facilitation of such sale or supply, to Iraq by their nationals,
or from their territories or using their flag vessels or aircraft, of:

(a) Arms and related materiel of all types, specifically including the
sale or transfer through other means of all forms of conventional military
equipment, including for paramilitary forces, and spare parts and components
and their means of production, for such equipment;

(b) Items specified and defined in paragraphs 8 and 12 above not
otherwise covered above;

(c) Technology under licensing or other transfer arrangements used in the
production, utilization or stockpiling of items specified in subparagraphs (a)
and (b) above;

(d) Personnel or materials for training or technical support services
relating to the design, development, manufacture, use, maintenance or support
of items specified in subparagraphs (a) and (b) above;



27. Calls upon all States to maintain such national controls and
procedures and to take such other actions consistent with the guidelines to be
established by the Security Council under paragraph 26 above as may be
necessary to ensure compliance with the terms of paragraph 24 above, and calls
upon international organizations to take all appropriate steps to assist in
ensuring such full compliance;

Why did France, Germany and Russia veto the resolution asking to use force to oust the brutal dictator? Could they have placed their own economic interests ahead of moraltiy and the lives of those living under totatalitarian rule in Iraq? Maybe, let's look at the 'facts':


22.5% of Iraq?s imports come from France.

France recently became Iraq?s largest European trading partner.

Sixty French companies conducted an estimated $1.5 billion in trade with Baghdad in 2001 under the UN oil-for food program.

France?s largest oil company, Total Fina Elf, has negotiated extensive oil contracts to develop the Majnoon and Nahr Umar oil fields in southern Iraq, estimated to contain as much as 25% of Iraq?s oil reserves.


France?s Alcatel company, a major telecom firm, was negotiating a $76 million contract and have signed contracts with Iraq worth more than $150 million that are suspected of being linked to its military operation.

From 1981 to 2001, France was responsible for over 13% of Iraq?s arms imports.




Wow, France was supplying Saddam with weapons, against the U.N. resolution, and those weapons were used to shoot at Americans. Every American should to be outraged and demand a full investigation into Chirac's administration!

 

[sMiLeYz]

Had some bad fromage as a kid or something John Galt?

 

[Lonyo]

From 1981 to 2001, France was responsible for over 13% of Iraq?s arms imports.

And in that same 20 year period, who was responsible for the other 87% of Iraq's arms imports?
(straight question, no spin please)

France?s largest oil company, Total Fina Elf, has negotiated extensive oil contracts to develop the Majnoon and Nahr Umar oil fields in southern Iraq, estimated to contain as much as 25% of Iraq?s oil reserves

Isn't the US saying Iraq's oil fields are a big asset, thus by developing them, the French woul dhave allowed more revenue for Iraq, as a whole. And possible more jobs and everything that comes with new development.

And people give money/aid to countries that are at war all the time, and then the aid money that should be used to help the peopl eof the country goes on the war effort, further destroying the country, so don't say "no one ever gives people money that helps them be bad", because it happens all the time.


Oh, and look, another France bashign thread.
You're as bad as PhillyTIM and BOBDN.

 

[NesuD]

You're as bad as PhillyTIM and BOBDN

Not even close. those two are far and away the worst i have seen around here in some time.

 

[amok]

Originally posted by: NesuD

You're as bad as PhillyTIM and BOBDN

Not even close. those two are far and away the worst i have seen around here in some time.

Lol, there are times when I think its a close race . I'm pretty sure this Galt's way of protesting the BB's over-the-top crap, but two wrongs don't make a right as the old saying goes.

As for the actual topic itself, I can't really disagree with it. IMO, anyone breaking resolutions they've agreed to should be held accountable (that includes us as well). The problem, ofc, is that with us currently having to kiss a little international ass, we can't be stepping on anyone's toes over this type of thing. After the Iraq thing is eventually sorted out, I believe we should pursue an addendum to the UN's regs that at the very least temporarily removes vetoing power from any permanent member that violates a resolution. Probably won't happen though.

 

[konichiwa]

Originally posted by: sMiLeYz
Had some bad fromage as a kid or something John Galt?

Maybe he's British

 

[no0b]

You need to watch Uncle Saddam, an Iraqi defector had an interesting thing to say about the french.

 

[Ferocious]

Didn't Reagan give arms and stuff to Saddam?

 

[phillyTIM]

He definately did. And Rumsfeld was right there in Iraq, in a photo with Saddam, as they fed him chemicals.

The reagan/bush team essentially created the saddam monster.

 

[mastertech01]

Originally posted by: phillyTIM
He definately did. And Rumsfeld was right there in Iraq, in a photo with Saddam, as they fed him chemicals.

The reagan/bush team essentially created the saddam monster.

They might have fed the monster, but he was always a monster. If you recall history we had reasons to support him.. IRAN. And in some ways we still have a problem with IRAN.

 

[xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx]

What do ?Reagan in the '80s? and ?France in 2001/2002? have to do with each other? Was there a U.N. resolution, which the French consider to be holy documents, prohibiting trade with Saddam it he '80s? Was there a U.N. resolution in 2001 when France was helping Saddam to reconstitute his military? Okay, so what was your point again?

 

[Bowfinger]

Originally posted by: sMiLeYz
Had some bad fromage as a kid or something John Galt?

I heard he was abused with a French fry when he was in prison.

 

[Bowfinger]

Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx
Resolution 687: Iraqi Cease-Fire Terms
[ ... ]
Why did France, Germany and Russia veto the resolution asking to use force to oust the brutal dictator? Could they have placed their own economic interests ahead of moraltiy and the lives of those living under totatalitarian rule in Iraq? Maybe, let's look at the 'facts':


22.5% of Iraq?s imports come from France.

France recently became Iraq?s largest European trading partner.

Sixty French companies conducted an estimated $1.5 billion in trade with Baghdad in 2001 under the UN oil-for food program.

France?s largest oil company, Total Fina Elf, has negotiated extensive oil contracts to develop the Majnoon and Nahr Umar oil fields in southern Iraq, estimated to contain as much as 25% of Iraq?s oil reserves.


France?s Alcatel company, a major telecom firm, was negotiating a $76 million contract and have signed contracts with Iraq worth more than $150 million that are suspected of being linked to its military operation.

From 1981 to 2001, France was responsible for over 13% of Iraq?s arms imports.


Wow, France was supplying Saddam with weapons, against the U.N. resolution, and those weapons were used to shoot at Americans. Every American should to be outraged and demand a full investigation into Chirac's administration!

Your statistics are bunk. Prove them.

 

[xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx]

Originally posted by: Bowfinger

Originally posted by: sMiLeYz
Had some bad fromage as a kid or something John Galt?

I heard he was abused with a French fry when he was in prison.

What happened to your premises about attacking people? pot...kettle...black.


Has anyone every told you that you look like your 'author icon'? Holy cow, what a resemblance....too funny, man.

 

[Bowfinger]

Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx

Originally posted by: Bowfinger

Originally posted by: sMiLeYz
Had some bad fromage as a kid or something John Galt?

I heard he was abused with a French fry when he was in prison.

What happened to your premises about attacking people? pot...kettle...black.

Always changing the subject.

Has anyone every told you that you look like your 'author icon'? Holy cow, what a resemblance....too funny, man.

Huh? OK, how about: small world, so do you?

 

[Bowfinger]

Originally posted by: Bowfinger

Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx
Resolution 687: Iraqi Cease-Fire Terms
[ ... ]
Why did France, Germany and Russia veto the resolution asking to use force to oust the brutal dictator? Could they have placed their own economic interests ahead of moraltiy and the lives of those living under totatalitarian rule in Iraq? Maybe, let's look at the 'facts':


22.5% of Iraq?s imports come from France.

France recently became Iraq?s largest European trading partner.

Sixty French companies conducted an estimated $1.5 billion in trade with Baghdad in 2001 under the UN oil-for food program.

France?s largest oil company, Total Fina Elf, has negotiated extensive oil contracts to develop the Majnoon and Nahr Umar oil fields in southern Iraq, estimated to contain as much as 25% of Iraq?s oil reserves.


France?s Alcatel company, a major telecom firm, was negotiating a $76 million contract and have signed contracts with Iraq worth more than $150 million that are suspected of being linked to its military operation.

From 1981 to 2001, France was responsible for over 13% of Iraq?s arms imports.


Wow, France was supplying Saddam with weapons, against the U.N. resolution, and those weapons were used to shoot at Americans. Every American should to be outraged and demand a full investigation into Chirac's administration!

Your statistics are bunk. Prove them.

I hear crickets . . .

 

[Bigdude]

Originally posted by: Ferocious
Didn't Reagan give arms and stuff to Saddam?

You miss the point, Saddam was an ally against Iran at that time.

 

[phillyTIM]

Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx

Wow, France was supplying Saddam with weapons, against the U.N. resolution, and those weapons were used to shoot at Americans. Every American should to be outraged and demand a full investigation into Chirac's administration!

*YAWN* Those weapons were used to shoot Americans (troops) that shouldn't have been in that place.

France has every right to make a profit wherever it can; the United States sure as hell does. Remember, we fed chemicals to Saddam in the first place, with Donald Rumsfeld being the man-on-the-spot in the first place (in a photo with saddam in the 1980s).

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Bigdude

Originally posted by: Ferocious
Didn't Reagan give arms and stuff to Saddam?

You miss the point, Saddam was an ally against Iran at that time.

Didn't he use French Exocet Missiles against the U.S.S. Vincente during the Iran/Iraq war (sounds like a Flock of Seagulls song) while he was our Allie?

 

[xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx]

Originally posted by: phillyTIM



*YAWN* Those weapons were used to shoot Americans (troops) that shouldn't have been in that place.

Finally, the truth comes out. Because you feel the troops shouldn't be in Iraq, it is okay for the French to arm Iraqis if they plan to kill Americans. Why don't you just join the French mnilitary, kill American troops in, say, Germany, and skip the middleman? Your lack of respect for the men and women who wear the uniform that keeps your feedom to post trash like this on the internet makes me sick...

 

[phillyTIM]

BOOO HOOO!! WAAAAAAAH

 

[kage69]

He definately did. And Rumsfeld was right there in Iraq, in a photo with Saddam, as they fed him chemicals.

The reagan/bush team essentially created the saddam monster.

You, essentially, don't know what you're talking about - you're trying to use your displeasure with the current administration to explain away Saddam...and it doesn't work. Did Rumsfeld and Co. give Saddam military assistance? Yes, they did, but Saddam's brutality is a result of his upbringing at the hands of abusive family members and in an area plagued with almost constant violence. Saddam committed his first murder at age 15 at the behest of his uncle - I suppose Bush and Rumsfeld are somehow to blame for that? Enough with the doctoring of history, you have no point, Saddam was a monster before we arrived - deal with it.

A lot of people are missing the point: France was playing the benevolent upholder of the UN all the while defying it in pursuit of Iraqi funds.

 

[phillyTIM]

Saddam does have a history of brutality, I am not arguing that point. But I'm also sure the US was QUITE well aware of that before, and during, the time they gave him chemicals and weapons. It was members of the Reagan, Bush I and now the Bush Weasel Regimes that fed chemicals & weapons to Saddam knowing the kind of man he was. This invalidates the spin you're attempting to use in your post.

I KNOW damn well what I talk about.

Perhaps France was being hypocritical, but so has the United States. Theres no dispute there.

 

[xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx]

Originally posted by: kage69


A lot of people are missing the point: France was playing the benevolent upholder of the UN all the while defying it in pursuit of Iraqi funds.

It took a few too many posts to arrive at the 'the point', but you, sir, are a much welcomed voice of reason.

 

[xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx]

Originally posted by: phillyTIM


Perhaps France was being hypocritical, but so has the United States. Theres no dispute there.

Even Timmy is coming around, so I feel like I have accomplished something good today ..not exactly a voice of reason, but you win the most improved player award. Good job, Tim.