The New York Mets are run by imbeciles (rant)

[raystorm]

I know there are a few Mets fans here...so I figured since I'm really irked right now I can post a small rant. I'm sure EVERY Mets fan was majorly pissed off when they heard that #1 prospect Scott Kazmir was traded for Victor Zambrano. Not ONE person whether it was a fan or a member of the media agreed with this trade. In fact, one GM called the Mets after the trade and asked, "What are you guys doing?".

Last night Scott Kazmir made his major league debut with the Devil Rays against the Seattle Mariners. How did he do??? He pitched 5 SHUTOUT innings!!! So...how is Victor Zambroken... opps.. I mean Zambrano doing? He's on the damn DL for probably the rest of the season. He was f'n DAMAGED GOODS!!! The stupid Mets knew about Zambroken's elbow problems..they didn't even bother with a damn physical prior to the trade. He was damaged goods from the get go. Now who had a big part in making this trade happen??? Rick Peterson..thats who. This freakin overrated pitching coach played a major role in this stupid trade. Peterson, who has done NOTHING with the young pitchers (and don't give me any BS about Leiter, Glavine or Trachsel's ERA's... they were good BEFORE this fool was hired). What happened to Jae Seo??? Tyler Yates??? Aaron Heilman (who is a COMPLETE BUST)?? Nothing..he has done nothing.

Peterson said he could fix Zambroken in 10 minutes. Now the man is on the DL while young stud Scott Kazmir who will probably be in the starting rotation for the D-Rays pitches 5 scoreless innings.


I know this is a HUGE and I guess stupid rant.. but you must understand. I am a huge Mets fan and I'm sick and tired of the crap they pull. The whole organization is filled top to bottom with idiots. Don't get me started on the Kris Benson trade.. if he doesn't sign the trade will become another big disaster. Typical Mets. :disgust:

If there are any Mets fans here.. please chime in with thoughts. In fact....I know there are some other baseball fans here (including some of your damn Braves fans.. can we have your GM and pitching coach??? ) so please post some of your thoughts including some nice pot shots at the Mets. Lord knows they deserve it.


oh.... if you are not a baseball fan, please don't post. (if the title of the thread is grammatically incorrect then let me know so I can fix it)

 

[UDT89]

im a dire hard met fan, but i think im gonna jump ships and root for the worst team in baseball........well damn, im already there too.


seriously though, im done with the mets. im gonna pick a new team. maybe the orioles.

 

[Doggiedog]

That was about the dumbest trade I've seen by them.

Ranks up there with trading Lenny Dykstra and completely negates trading for Hidalgo.

 

[maddogchen]

eh....i've seen worse. Try being a NBA Warriors fan. They take "We Got Suck" to a whole new meaning. This year should be good though. Hey i'm in denial thats why i'm a Warriors fan!

 

[ThePresence]

I think Met fans have to relax and see how much of a "stud" Scott Kazmir turns out to be. THe Met's might know something about him that nobody else does. I think you also have to calm down about Duqette. He did make the Hidalgo trade and the Benson trade. Calm down and see how well Zambrano pitches after Peterson actually gets to work with him for a while, and see how well Kazmir really does.

 

[raystorm]

Originally posted by: ThePresence
I think Met fans have to relax and see how much of a "stud" Scott Kazmir turns out to be. THe Met's might know something about him that nobody else does. I think you also have to calm down about Duqette. He did make the Hidalgo trade and the Benson trade. Calm down and see how well Zambrano pitches after Peterson actually gets to work with him for a while, and see how well Kazmir really does.

I understand. I have no issues with the job Duquette has done. He got rid of alot of garbage last season (Alomar, Cedeno, Burnitz..etc). The Hidalgo trade was pure brilliance and I hope he gets a nice contract during the offseason. The problem with Zambrano is that the elbow problem is an ongoing problem..even after surgery. This is something that may be with him for his entire career.

As for Kazmir.. you are right in saying that we should wait and see how he does, but you can't trade a so called "untouchable" prospect like Kazmir who has tremendous upside for damaged goods like Zambrano. If he is so highly touted then why not get something better? Maybe there is something potentially wrong with Kazmir, but other then his so called "cocky" attitude we don't really know.

As for Benson... just give him a few bad starts are Shea and we'll see if he wants to sign on for next season.

 

[SkunkApe]

How bout the mets paying $5million this year and next year for a player they don't even have in Roger Cedeno? Who is doing quite well in a limited role for the cardinals, I might add.

The mets are the laughingstock of the major leagues. What a joke.

 

[ThePresence]

Originally posted by: raystorm

Originally posted by: ThePresence
I think Met fans have to relax and see how much of a "stud" Scott Kazmir turns out to be. THe Met's might know something about him that nobody else does. I think you also have to calm down about Duqette. He did make the Hidalgo trade and the Benson trade. Calm down and see how well Zambrano pitches after Peterson actually gets to work with him for a while, and see how well Kazmir really does.

I understand. I have no issues with the job Duquette has done. He got rid of alot of garbage last season (Alomar, Cedeno, Burnitz..etc). The Hidalgo trade was pure brilliance and I hope he gets a nice contract during the offseason. The problem with Zambrano is that the elbow problem is an ongoing problem..even after surgery. This is something that may be with him for his entire career.

As for Kazmir.. you are right in saying that we should wait and see how he does, but you can't have a so called "untouchable" prospect like Kazmir who has tremendous upside for damaged goods like Zambrano. If he is so highly touted then why not get something better?

As for Benson... just give him a few bad starts are Shea and we'll see if he wants to sign on for next season.

Untouchable prospects are highly touted before they are traded. Happens all the time. Makes their value higher in the eyes of other teams. He may have only "seemed" untouchable because the Mets wanted him to look that way to bump his value up.
I'm sure the Mets think they can resign Benson. Otherwise, that is a terrible trade.
The only issue I really have is that they could've gotten Soriano in the offseason for Kazmir. They said no to that, but trade him for Zambrano instead?! I have to believe that they found out something about him afterwards, be it healthwise or something else.

 

[RabidMongoose]

The Mets are idiots. The inmates are running the asylum. The ownership, players, 'superscouts' and so on have too much influence with the front office, IMO. Scott Kazmir was a possible top 15 prospect in all of baseball. The best LHP prospect in the game and possibly the #2 overall pitching prospect. What justifies trading an elite prospect for the MLB starter with the least control? Nothing in the recent trade history says that this trade was justified. The Mets made an idiotic panic move and now I hope it embarasses them so much that they will actually think before they irrationally pull a trade.

The thing that pisses me off if Peterson's 'I'll fix him (Zambrano) in 10 minutes because I'm awesome' comments along with the 'minor league pitchers drafted out of high school need 500 innings in the minors!' which is completely and utter BS. They didn't even expect Kazmir to come up to the majors for 2 years. 2 years! This kid was DOMINATING AA. He would have been ready by mid 2005 at the latest.

Did you see last night's game against Seattle? It was amazing. Kazmir was easily throwing in fastballs at 97! Consistently at 94-97! And from a lefty! Ugh...

As for the Benson trade, it wasn't as bad...but if he's a type A free agent and if he doesn't sign, then that might be OK.

At least the Mets didn't trade of David Wright...

 

[RabidMongoose]

Untouchable prospects are highly touted before they are traded. Happens all the time. Makes their value higher in the eyes of other teams. He may have only "seemed" untouchable because the Mets wanted him to look that way to bump his value up.

Kazmir's numbers in the minors were flat out dominating. He had the highest K/9 in all of the minors last season. He is highly regarded by virtually every prospect analyst. By deeming him 'untouchable', I don't see how you can raise his value even higher than it already was.

Most people aren't upset that the Mets traded him. They're upset because they traded him for trash.

 

[TheAudit]

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose
The Mets are idiots. The inmates are running the asylum. The ownership, players, 'superscouts' and so on have too much influence with the front office, IMO. Scott Kazmir was a possible top 15 prospect in all of baseball. The best LHP prospect in the game and possibly the #2 overall pitching prospect. What justifies trading an elite prospect for the MLB starter with the least control? Nothing in the recent trade history says that this trade was justified. The Mets made an idiotic panic move and now I hope it embarasses them so much that they will actually think before they irrationally pull a trade.

The thing that pisses me off if Peterson's 'I'll fix him (Zambrano) in 10 minutes because I'm awesome' comments along with the 'minor league pitchers drafted out of high school need 500 innings in the minors!' which is completely and utter BS. They didn't even expect Kazmir to come up to the majors for 2 years. 2 years! This kid was DOMINATING AA. He would have been ready by mid 2005 at the latest.

Did you see last night's game against Seattle? It was amazing. Kazmir was easily throwing in fastballs at 97! Consistently at 94-97! And from a lefty! Ugh...

As for the Benson trade, it wasn't as bad...but if he's a type A free agent and if he doesn't sign, then that might be OK.

At least the Mets didn't trade of David Wright...

Yeah, ol' Kaz picked up a win last night.
5 innings, 101 pitches/56 strikes, 4 hits, 3 walks and 4 K's.

 

[raystorm]

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose


Most people aren't upset that the Mets traded him. They're upset because they traded him for trash.

Yep... if they had traded Kazmir for ...lets say... Soriano, Barry Zito, Carlos Zambrano..something like that, then I'm sure most Mets fans would've been ok with the trade. Instead they trade for Victor Zambroken. I understand that the trade can't be truly evaluated yet (maybe in 4 or so years), really.. they couldn't get anything better than Zambroken?

 

[raystorm]

Originally posted by: TheAudit

Yeah, ol' Kaz picked up a win last night.
5 innings, 101 pitches/56 strikes, 4 hits, 3 walks and 4 K's.

Aaron Heilman..another #1 pick by the Mets has even done THAT yet in his 10+ major league starts. What a mega bust. He's just awful and was just pure crap last night.

 

[TheAudit]

Originally posted by: raystorm

Originally posted by: TheAudit

Yeah, ol' Kaz picked up a win last night.
5 innings, 101 pitches/56 strikes, 4 hits, 3 walks and 4 K's.

Aaron Heilman..another #1 pick by the Mets has even done THAT yet in his 10+ major league starts. What a mega bust. He's just awful and was just pure crap last night.

Heilman's time in the majors last year looked pretty bad and it seems like he is setting the same low standards this year.

 

[murphy55d]

Zambrano was averaging close to a BB/IP I think in Tampa, I'm not even sure Leo Mazzone could fix that. Well, yeah he probably could.

 

[raystorm]

Originally posted by: murphy55d
Zambrano was averaging close to a BB/IP I think in Tampa, I'm not even sure Leo Mazzone could fix that. Well, yeah he probably could.

Indeed... Mazzone must be some god or a magician or something.. jeez. Unlike Peterson who is an overated fool. Fix Zambrano in 10 minutes..holy cow. Don't give me any crap about his work at Oakland because Hudson, Mulder and Zito are doing damn fine without him.

 

[ThePresence]

Originally posted by: raystorm

Originally posted by: murphy55d
Zambrano was averaging close to a BB/IP I think in Tampa, I'm not even sure Leo Mazzone could fix that. Well, yeah he probably could.

Indeed... Mazzone must be some god or a magician or something.. jeez. Unlike Peterson who is an overated fool. Fix Zambrano in 10 minutes..holy cow. Don't give me any crap about his work at Oakland because Hudson, Mulder and Zito are doing damn fine without him.

Yeah, except that Mulder credits him for his success.

 

[isasir]

Ugh, I read Newsday this morning talking about how Kazmir pitched last night, but I forgot to check if he won (late game). As soon as I saw this thread title I had a feeling he did damn well.

I bought Mets 8-pack of tix 2 yrs. ago and yearly the Mets will call me to see if I'll buy another 8-pack. I just laugh at them and say that once the Mets start doing good, I'll buy tickets. I've only been to 1 game in the past 2 yrs.

Should be interesting to see how well Kazmir does. Getting called up this year, in itself, saws a damn lot.

 

[raystorm]

Originally posted by: ThePresence

Yeah, except that Mulder credits him for his success.

That I did not know. I suppose Peterson needs a few years for a total evaluation when it comes to younger talent.

How long has Mazzone been a pitching coach? Was he a pitching coach before the Braves?

 

[maddogchen]

Originally posted by: isasir

Should be interesting to see how well Kazmir does. Getting called up this year, in itself, saws a damn lot.

heheh not when its by Tampa Bay!

 

[RabidMongoose]

Originally posted by: raystorm

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose


Most people aren't upset that the Mets traded him. They're upset because they traded him for trash.

Yep... if they had traded Kazmir for ...lets say... Soriano, Barry Zito, Carlos Zambrano..something like that, then I'm sure most Mets fans would've been ok with the trade. Instead they trade for Victor Zambroken. I understand that the trade can't be truly evaluated yet (maybe in 4 or so years), really.. they couldn't get anything better than Zambroken?

The trade can be evaluated RIGHT NOW. Did the Mets receive equal value in return? No. Therefore it was a bad trade at the time of the trade. Kazmir had better value than freaking Zambroken.

 

[RabidMongoose]

Originally posted by: ThePresence

Originally posted by: raystorm

Originally posted by: murphy55d
Zambrano was averaging close to a BB/IP I think in Tampa, I'm not even sure Leo Mazzone could fix that. Well, yeah he probably could.

Indeed... Mazzone must be some god or a magician or something.. jeez. Unlike Peterson who is an overated fool. Fix Zambrano in 10 minutes..holy cow. Don't give me any crap about his work at Oakland because Hudson, Mulder and Zito are doing damn fine without him.

Yeah, except that Mulder credits him for his success.

Mulder was a first round draft pick. His becoming a success doesn't give Peterson significant credit. And I'm sure that many pitchers credit success to their pitching coaches, but that doesn't really mean much.

Peterson can perhaps take credit for keeping his pitchers free of arm problems though.

 

[rh71]

I used to care a lot about the Mets and baseball in general until the lockout season. These days, I only care if they have a winning streak. I did attend fireworks night too.

Anyway, I think your point about giving away Kazmir would hold water IF he continues this. Of course Zambrano wasn't a 1:1 trade, but still, you can't hype up a rookie after 5 innings of pitching. Hitters learn every pitcher up in the majors and only then do the pitchers show talent in adjusting.

Your other points are taken... I really don't follow all that much anymore.

 

[RabidMongoose]

I think your point about giving away Kazmir would hold water IF he continues this.

No it does not. Kazmir had significant value at the time of the trade and many feel that the Mets did not receive equivalent value.

 

[rh71]

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

I think your point about giving away Kazmir would hold water IF he continues this.

No it does not. Kazmir had significant value at the time of the trade and many feel that the Mets did not receive equivalent value.

Yes, this is true. Value. But the OP made it sound like he's a stud from 5 major league innings... he's not a stud yet. But yes, like I said, it wasn't a 1:1 trade from the beginning.