The Information Technology Association of America says...

SuperTool

Lifer
Jan 25, 2000
14,000
2
0
Well, at least we know they are not biased
rolleye.gif


Well, at least the board is really representative of average IT worker. ;)
 

PingSpike

Lifer
Feb 25, 2004
21,765
615
126
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Are you dense? CORPORATIONS HIRE IT PEOPLE. You know...like big big corporations...you know the companies that actually EMPLOY IT people.

Or I could just ask what your point was, since we know it takes Corporations(sometimes really really big ones) to employ IT people.:D

CkG

Well, I haven't really read them yet and I'm not sure if I agree with Kerry's plan or not yet...but corporations do hire people. The cheapest people they can find. In India.
 

SuperTool

Lifer
Jan 25, 2000
14,000
2
0
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Are you dense? CORPORATIONS HIRE IT PEOPLE. You know...like big big corporations...you know the companies that actually EMPLOY IT people.

Or I could just ask what your point was, since we know it takes Corporations(sometimes really really big ones) to employ IT people.:D

CkG

You going somewhere with this? Yeah they hire people. So what? I work for a big corporation. Am I supposed to be all happy and cheerful about outsourcing my job now?
The point is their member companies want to hire people in India, instead of the US, and that's what this group supports. No surprise there.
 

CADsortaGUY

Lifer
Oct 19, 2001
25,162
1
76
www.ShawCAD.com
Originally posted by: SuperTool
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Are you dense? CORPORATIONS HIRE IT PEOPLE. You know...like big big corporations...you know the companies that actually EMPLOY IT people.

Or I could just ask what your point was, since we know it takes Corporations(sometimes really really big ones) to employ IT people.:D

CkG

You going somewhere with this? Yeah they hire people. So what? I work for a big corporation. Am I supposed to be all happy and cheerful about outsourcing my job now?
The point is their member companies want to hire people in India, instead of the US, and that's what this group supports. No surprise there.

Maybe you should actually read the report's summary then;) Maybe you'll see why it isn't all "doom and gloom" on the outsourcing front. I don't neccessarily fully agree with their points but I can see the argument they present in their summary does refute some of the "outsourcing is teh eval" rhetoric that is tossed around. Anyway - please actually read what they say before trying to comment further.

CkG
 

SuperTool

Lifer
Jan 25, 2000
14,000
2
0
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY
Originally posted by: SuperTool
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Are you dense? CORPORATIONS HIRE IT PEOPLE. You know...like big big corporations...you know the companies that actually EMPLOY IT people.

Or I could just ask what your point was, since we know it takes Corporations(sometimes really really big ones) to employ IT people.:D

CkG

You going somewhere with this? Yeah they hire people. So what? I work for a big corporation. Am I supposed to be all happy and cheerful about outsourcing my job now?
The point is their member companies want to hire people in India, instead of the US, and that's what this group supports. No surprise there.

Maybe you should actually read the report's summary then;) Maybe you'll see why it isn't all "doom and gloom" on the outsourcing front. I don't neccessarily fully agree with their points but I can see the argument they present in their summary does refute some of the "outsourcing is teh eval" rhetoric that is tossed around. Anyway - please actually read what they say before trying to comment further.

CkG

Outsourcing is not the evil for the companies represented by ITAA. That's why they want to portray it in the best possible light. Anyone with a half brain realizes that outsourcing will cost US jobs. And in the long run, it may well destroy the US technology industry. Because those engineers in India that we are transferring our technology to so they can work for US companies will one day ask themselves: Why should we work for US corporations and have them keep the profits when we can start our own comanies and outcompete the US companies? Maybe a CEO in India will work for 1% of what Carly Fiorina makes, so they can outcompete HP on price.
The Japanese went from 90% of DRAM market to 30% in one decade. It could happen to our IT industry too.
 

CADsortaGUY

Lifer
Oct 19, 2001
25,162
1
76
www.ShawCAD.com
Originally posted by: SuperTool
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY
Originally posted by: SuperTool
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Are you dense? CORPORATIONS HIRE IT PEOPLE. You know...like big big corporations...you know the companies that actually EMPLOY IT people.

Or I could just ask what your point was, since we know it takes Corporations(sometimes really really big ones) to employ IT people.:D

CkG

You going somewhere with this? Yeah they hire people. So what? I work for a big corporation. Am I supposed to be all happy and cheerful about outsourcing my job now?
The point is their member companies want to hire people in India, instead of the US, and that's what this group supports. No surprise there.

Maybe you should actually read the report's summary then;) Maybe you'll see why it isn't all "doom and gloom" on the outsourcing front. I don't neccessarily fully agree with their points but I can see the argument they present in their summary does refute some of the "outsourcing is teh eval" rhetoric that is tossed around. Anyway - please actually read what they say before trying to comment further.

CkG

Outsourcing is not the evil for the companies represented by ITAA. That's why they want to portray it in the best possible light. Anyone with a half brain realizes that outsourcing will cost US jobs. And in the long run, it may well destroy the US technology industry. Because those engineers in India that we are transferring our technology to so they can work for US companies will one day ask themselves: Why should we work for US corporations and have them keep the profits when we can start our own comanies and outcompete the US companies? Maybe a CEO in India will work for 1% of what Carly Fiorina makes, so they can outcompete HP on price.
The Japanese went from 90% of DRAM market to 30% in one decade. It could happen to our IT industry too.

I see you continue to NOT read the summary.
Meh -whatever...
rolleye.gif


CkG
 

SuperTool

Lifer
Jan 25, 2000
14,000
2
0
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY
Originally posted by: SuperTool
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY
Originally posted by: SuperTool
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Are you dense? CORPORATIONS HIRE IT PEOPLE. You know...like big big corporations...you know the companies that actually EMPLOY IT people.

Or I could just ask what your point was, since we know it takes Corporations(sometimes really really big ones) to employ IT people.:D

CkG

You going somewhere with this? Yeah they hire people. So what? I work for a big corporation. Am I supposed to be all happy and cheerful about outsourcing my job now?
The point is their member companies want to hire people in India, instead of the US, and that's what this group supports. No surprise there.

Maybe you should actually read the report's summary then;) Maybe you'll see why it isn't all "doom and gloom" on the outsourcing front. I don't neccessarily fully agree with their points but I can see the argument they present in their summary does refute some of the "outsourcing is teh eval" rhetoric that is tossed around. Anyway - please actually read what they say before trying to comment further.

CkG

Outsourcing is not the evil for the companies represented by ITAA. That's why they want to portray it in the best possible light. Anyone with a half brain realizes that outsourcing will cost US jobs. And in the long run, it may well destroy the US technology industry. Because those engineers in India that we are transferring our technology to so they can work for US companies will one day ask themselves: Why should we work for US corporations and have them keep the profits when we can start our own comanies and outcompete the US companies? Maybe a CEO in India will work for 1% of what Carly Fiorina makes, so they can outcompete HP on price.
The Japanese went from 90% of DRAM market to 30% in one decade. It could happen to our IT industry too.

I see you continue to NOT read the summary.
Meh -whatever...
rolleye.gif


CkG

I looked into it. It's 10 pages of BS. I am supposed to believe job creation estimates for 2008 in an industry that changes every day.
rolleye.gif
 

SuperTool

Lifer
Jan 25, 2000
14,000
2
0
When I see numbers like 317,367 jobs created by 2008, I know they've been pulled out of someone's @ss. They will be lucky if the first digit is right, much less the other 5.
 

CADsortaGUY

Lifer
Oct 19, 2001
25,162
1
76
www.ShawCAD.com
Originally posted by: SuperTool
I looked into it. It's 10 pages of BS. I am supposed to believe job creation estimates for 2008 in an industry that changes every day.
rolleye.gif

Yet you KNOW "...outsourcing will cost US jobs. And in the long run, it may well destroy the US technology industry."

rolleye.gif
Way to actually read something instead of allowing your ASSumptions to take over.


CkG
 

SuperTool

Lifer
Jan 25, 2000
14,000
2
0
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY
Originally posted by: SuperTool
I looked into it. It's 10 pages of BS. I am supposed to believe job creation estimates for 2008 in an industry that changes every day.
rolleye.gif

Yet you KNOW "...outsourcing will cost US jobs. And in the long run, it may well destroy the US technology industry."

rolleye.gif
Way to actually read something instead of allowing your ASSumptions to take over.

CkG

OK, sending jobs overseas will create US jobs. Cutting taxes and raising spending will create a surplus. Anything else I am missing?
 

CADsortaGUY

Lifer
Oct 19, 2001
25,162
1
76
www.ShawCAD.com
Originally posted by: SuperTool
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY
Originally posted by: SuperTool
I looked into it. It's 10 pages of BS. I am supposed to believe job creation estimates for 2008 in an industry that changes every day.
rolleye.gif

Yet you KNOW "...outsourcing will cost US jobs. And in the long run, it may well destroy the US technology industry."

rolleye.gif
Way to actually read something instead of allowing your ASSumptions to take over.

CkG

OK, sending jobs overseas will create US jobs. Cutting taxes and raising spending will create a surplus. Anything else I am missing?

wow - you are teh brite tuday.
rolleye.gif


You might try actually READING IT and offering more that rhetoric.

CkG
 

tnitsuj

Diamond Member
May 22, 2003
5,446
0
76
Originally posted by: SuperTool
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Are you dense? CORPORATIONS HIRE IT PEOPLE. You know...like big big corporations...you know the companies that actually EMPLOY IT people.

Or I could just ask what your point was, since we know it takes Corporations(sometimes really really big ones) to employ IT people.:D

CkG

You going somewhere with this? Yeah they hire people. So what? I work for a big corporation. Am I supposed to be all happy and cheerful about outsourcing my job now?
The point is their member companies want to hire people in India, instead of the US, and that's what this group supports. No surprise there.


It's not your job. It's the corporations job. If you want "your job" start your own company and hire group a to do the same job that group b could do for much cheaper. See how it works out.
 

SuperTool

Lifer
Jan 25, 2000
14,000
2
0
Originally posted by: tnitsuj
Originally posted by: SuperTool
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Are you dense? CORPORATIONS HIRE IT PEOPLE. You know...like big big corporations...you know the companies that actually EMPLOY IT people.

Or I could just ask what your point was, since we know it takes Corporations(sometimes really really big ones) to employ IT people.:D

CkG

You going somewhere with this? Yeah they hire people. So what? I work for a big corporation. Am I supposed to be all happy and cheerful about outsourcing my job now?
The point is their member companies want to hire people in India, instead of the US, and that's what this group supports. No surprise there.


It's not your job. It's the corporations job. If you want "your job" start your own company and hire group a to do the same job that group b could do for much cheaper. See how it works out.

Well, it's my vote, it's not the corporations vote. If I want to vote for politicians who look after me instead of the corporations than that's what I will do. Corporations can look after their interests, and I will look after mine. Sometimes they align, and sometimes they don't. I am not going to support outsourcing just because IT corporate lobbyist group thinks it's a good idea. See how it works out?
 

Ozoned

Diamond Member
Mar 22, 2004
5,578
0
0
Originally posted by: PingSpike
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Are you dense? CORPORATIONS HIRE IT PEOPLE. You know...like big big corporations...you know the companies that actually EMPLOY IT people.

Or I could just ask what your point was, since we know it takes Corporations(sometimes really really big ones) to employ IT people.:D

CkG

Well, I haven't really read them yet and I'm not sure if I agree with Kerry's plan or not yet...but corporations do hire people. The cheapest people they can find. In India.


I get it now, If I invest in these corporations that have goals of making a real proffit,
then I make money and I don't even have to work for it?





 

razor2025

Diamond Member
May 24, 2002
3,010
0
71
LOL, this document is hillarious in its attempt to shine positive light. I would LOVE to see how they came up with their job growth number for 2008. They have to be some uber-genius who can forsee 4 years in a super volatile industry, or pulling BS numbers straight out of their ass. The former is a impossibility, and the latter, certainty. CAD, you just can't see why "outsourcing" is bleeding a country to death. When all the dust are settled, the corporations are fat with profits and the "host" country is used and dried. Don't even start arguing about how businesses will spend their profit in US for "R&D and other upper level spending", because they won't. Why should they? When they can outsource it? You say they won't? That's what the experts said couple of years ago regarding the IT & Service industry. New training? New fields? Who's going to pay the cost for training/researching? How long will that take? How do we find income until we adjusts our new economy? It's not just simply "Suck it up, too bad". We've taken advantage for having that attitude far too long. It's true that every business have their right to seek maximum profit (and lately, w/o regards to ethical/moral consideration), but it's also true that as a citizen of a country and a individual worker, we have our power as voter and protestors to demand/force changes. All changes start with b*tching and complaining. France didn't start their revolution without the peasents complaining about their condition to the obscenely rich nor did our revolution without the complaint about unfair taxation.
 

SherEPunjab

Diamond Member
Oct 23, 2002
3,841
0
0
Originally posted by: SuperTool
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY
Originally posted by: SuperTool
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Are you dense? CORPORATIONS HIRE IT PEOPLE. You know...like big big corporations...you know the companies that actually EMPLOY IT people.

Or I could just ask what your point was, since we know it takes Corporations(sometimes really really big ones) to employ IT people.:D

CkG

You going somewhere with this? Yeah they hire people. So what? I work for a big corporation. Am I supposed to be all happy and cheerful about outsourcing my job now?
The point is their member companies want to hire people in India, instead of the US, and that's what this group supports. No surprise there.

Maybe you should actually read the report's summary then;) Maybe you'll see why it isn't all "doom and gloom" on the outsourcing front. I don't neccessarily fully agree with their points but I can see the argument they present in their summary does refute some of the "outsourcing is teh eval" rhetoric that is tossed around. Anyway - please actually read what they say before trying to comment further.

CkG

Outsourcing is not the evil for the companies represented by ITAA. That's why they want to portray it in the best possible light. Anyone with a half brain realizes that outsourcing will cost US jobs. And in the long run, it may well destroy the US technology industry. Because those engineers in India that we are transferring our technology to so they can work for US companies will one day ask themselves: Why should we work for US corporations and have them keep the profits when we can start our own comanies and outcompete the US companies? Maybe a CEO in India will work for 1% of what Carly Fiorina makes, so they can outcompete HP on price.
The Japanese went from 90% of DRAM market to 30% in one decade. It could happen to our IT industry too.


Specifically what technology are we transferring to them? And i say its a good thing if the ceo's there work for 1% of what U.S. Ceo's work for. Lower costs of production should equate to lower market costs of the products. We've been outsourcing for YEARS. Whats new now? That, heaven forbid, the WHITE collar jobs are being outsourced? It was okay when the dirt poor of this country suffered, and lost manafacturing jobs to china, mexico, ireland, etc. but now that the educated, campaign donors are hurting we should blame outsourcing? Funny thing, i never see people b%tching about jobs when we lose them to European countries.


 

BugsBunny1078

Banned
Jan 11, 2004
910
0
0
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY
Originally posted by: SuperTool
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Are you dense? CORPORATIONS HIRE IT PEOPLE. You know...like big big corporations...you know the companies that actually EMPLOY IT people.

Or I could just ask what your point was, since we know it takes Corporations(sometimes really really big ones) to employ IT people.:D

CkG

You going somewhere with this? Yeah they hire people. So what? I work for a big corporation. Am I supposed to be all happy and cheerful about outsourcing my job now?
The point is their member companies want to hire people in India, instead of the US, and that's what this group supports. No surprise there.

Maybe you should actually read the report's summary then;) Maybe you'll see why it isn't all "doom and gloom" on the outsourcing front. I don't neccessarily fully agree with their points but I can see the argument they present in their summary does refute some of the "outsourcing is teh eval" rhetoric that is tossed around. Anyway - please actually read what they say before trying to comment further.

CkG

I can easily refute any point no matter how valid.For every issue each side needs to puto ut their arguments. Not to argue but so each sides supporters have something to read and quote when confronted on the topic. Its still all bullshit.
 

XZeroII

Lifer
Jun 30, 2001
12,572
0
0
Originally posted by: BugsBunny1078
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY
Originally posted by: SuperTool
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Are you dense? CORPORATIONS HIRE IT PEOPLE. You know...like big big corporations...you know the companies that actually EMPLOY IT people.

Or I could just ask what your point was, since we know it takes Corporations(sometimes really really big ones) to employ IT people.:D

CkG

You going somewhere with this? Yeah they hire people. So what? I work for a big corporation. Am I supposed to be all happy and cheerful about outsourcing my job now?
The point is their member companies want to hire people in India, instead of the US, and that's what this group supports. No surprise there.

Maybe you should actually read the report's summary then;) Maybe you'll see why it isn't all "doom and gloom" on the outsourcing front. I don't neccessarily fully agree with their points but I can see the argument they present in their summary does refute some of the "outsourcing is teh eval" rhetoric that is tossed around. Anyway - please actually read what they say before trying to comment further.

CkG

I can easily refute any point no matter how valid.For every issue each side needs to puto ut their arguments. Not to argue but so each sides supporters have something to read and quote when confronted on the topic. Its still all bullshit.

On a side note, learn to use commas, apostrophies and coherent sentences. I read that twice and still have no clue what you are trying to say.
 

PingSpike

Lifer
Feb 25, 2004
21,765
615
126
Originally posted by: Ozoned
Originally posted by: PingSpike
Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Are you dense? CORPORATIONS HIRE IT PEOPLE. You know...like big big corporations...you know the companies that actually EMPLOY IT people.

Or I could just ask what your point was, since we know it takes Corporations(sometimes really really big ones) to employ IT people.:D

CkG

Well, I haven't really read them yet and I'm not sure if I agree with Kerry's plan or not yet...but corporations do hire people. The cheapest people they can find. In India.


I get it now, If I invest in these corporations that have goals of making a real proffit,
then I make money and I don't even have to work for it?

If only I had some money to invest, I'd be rich. To bad I can't find a good job to start with.
 

BaliBabyDoc

Lifer
Jan 20, 2001
10,737
0
0
I willing to bet the farm that the 272K jobs that will be created overseas will actually happen and double or nothing that the 244K jobs destined for the US will NOT.

It's a ridiculous notion that the accelerating trend of offshoring will produce a marginally greater number of overseas jobs compared to US jobs.

If you use a global balance sheet, then clearly offshoring benefits the world. But the cohort of US citizens that will benefit will be quite small. In fact, the hundreds of thousands of US jobs that would have provided goods and services to US IT professionals is just as important to our economy as the IT jobs themselves. Alas, the ITAA apparently lacks sufficient mathematical skills in their cadre to calculate those loses.