The Gigantopithecus Rough Guide to Budget, Low-end, and Mid-range System Building

Gigantopithecus

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The Gigantopithecus Rough Guide to Budget, Low-end, and Mid-range System Building – Fall 2010

The old system guide is now about a year out of date so I thought I’d give something back to the AT community which has been an invaluable resource to me over the years.
Note I am not a professional system builder. I have no professional certifications and I don’t do this for a living. I, along with anyone who reads this thread, will appreciate feedback. Disclosure: I have no financial conflicts of interest, so when I recommend the same brands over and over, it's because I like how they've performed for me and my associates in the past, as well as from what I read online.

Also note that I do not cover high-end systems in this guide. I do not build enough high-end computers to be confident that my advice regarding those components is particularly valuable. That said, my idea of high-end is a $1,500 computer not including the monitor. To be honest, if you know you need a high-end computer, it will likely be because you are a niche user, and a rough guide like this isn’t the place for you to get advice.

General advice

1. Buy all of your system’s components at about the same time. No matter how expensive or purportedly high quality your components might be, there is always a chance of receiving a DOA part or having a part fail shortly after assembly. By buying all parts within a short period of time, you can test them all out and if something’s amiss, return them for a replacement. If you wait, and something goes wrong, you’ll need to RMA parts to the manufacturer. This takes longer than returning them to the retailer and you’ll receive back a refurbished part rather than a new part.

2. Shop around. Component prices vary wildly, even by the hour. While this fluctuation might only be $5-25 dollars per component, those small savings can add up over the cost of the whole system. I recommend compiling a list of potential part purchases and watching their prices on various websites for a few weeks to get a sense of what the lowest prices tend to be. Anandtech’s own Hot Deals forum, along with sites like Slickdeals.net and Fatwallet.com are valuable resources.

3. In my experience the two primary causes of system failure are heat and dirty power. Make sure you have a well-ventilated case, a good power supply, and that the juice from your outlet is clean. Regardless of how new your place is, I strongly recommend buying a solid surge protector/power conditioner. Since these devices are inexpensive (<$50), there’s no real reason to plug your PC directly into a wall outlet.

4. Have a backup system in place and use it. Depending on how much data you need to back up, anything from a $10, 4gb flash drive to a $100, 2tb external hard drive might work for you. Any hard drive can fail. Hard drive manufacturers will replace faulty drives but they will not recover data for you. Data recovery from a broken drive is extremely expensive and not at all guaranteed.

5. The wisest question you can ask yourself before building a computer is ’What am I going to do with it?’ Answer this question honestly. Computer equipment is a terrible investment – it depreciates incredibly fast. A computer that costs $2,000 today will be worth half that within a year or so, and you’ll be lucky if it’s worth $300-500 in three years. That said, there is one glaring exception to this: monitors. Monitors tend to hold their value much better than any other component and can easily be re-used with many systems over the years. You might be looking at it hours and hours per day, and it’s what everyone else will see as well. It’s the only component I recommend splurging on.

6. What about a budget? This is the only break from conventional wisdom I make in this guide. I think it is a much better idea to know what you’re going to do with your computer and buy appropriate hardware rather than set a budget and build to it. Again, computer hardware is a terrible investment. There is not much that a $1,500+ system can do that a $1,000 system can’t. And unless you need a high-end graphics card and/or solid state disk, there isn’t much that a $1,000 system can do that a $700 system can’t. Then again, I personally am very frugal so I’m biased.

Power supply – the heart of your system:

For whatever reason, people seem to cheap out on the power supply more than any other component. This is a bad idea. The power supply has the potential to destroy every other component in your system in the event of catastrophic failure. I’ve never seen a (non-overclocked) processor, hard drive, optical drive, etc. go bad and take out the entire system. I have seen power supplies do this. Make sure you buy a high-quality psu. JonnyGuru (jonnyguru.com) runs an excellent resource on power supplies. Beware that the rated output of less expensive (i.e. <$40-50) psus is often grossly exaggerated.

What is 80+? 80+ is an efficiency rating. An 80+ power supply will run at least 80% efficient over a range of possible loads. There are different 80+ tiers: bronze, silver, gold. Efficiency does not directly affect power quality or even overall quality, though these supplies should run cooler simply because they are more efficient. Nowadays I see no reason to buy a non-80+ psu unless you are on a very tight budget. That said, I wouldn’t recommend spending a huge price premium to go from an 80+ bronze to 80+ gold psu unless there are other relevant factors.

How much power do you need? There are many power supply calculators available online, check Google. It is a bad idea to buy a power supply capable of outputting just a few watts more than what your system will use. I usually aim for 20% overhead (i.e. if a system under full load will be using 500W, I’d look for at least a 600W psu). This is because psus output less power as they age and when they get hot (this is an issue in the upper Midwest in the summer – it might not be an issue at all for you, or even more of an issue for you if you live down south and don’t run your AC 24/7).

Budget power supplies: I recommend these supplies only if you absolutely can’t afford better, and I only recommend them based on personal experience. You should be able to find each for $30-35. In no order:
Cooler Master Elite 460 RS-460-PSAR-J3
Thermaltake TR2 W0070RUC
Rosewill RV350
Low-wattage (400W or less) power supplies: Again, in no particular order. You should be able to find these for around $40.
SeaSonic SS-300ET
SeaSonic SS-350ET
Antec NEO ECO 400C
Antec EarthWatts Green EA-380D
Mid-wattage (400W-600W) power supplies: You should be able to find these for under $60. A 500W-600W psu will comfortably power just about any system that doesn’t have a high-end graphics card or an SLI/Crossfire setup.
Antec EarthWatts Green EA-430D
Rosewill Green Series RG430-S12
Corsair CMPSU-450VX
Antec EarthWatts Green EA-500D
Rosewill Green Series RG530-S12
Antec NEO ECO 520C
SeaSonic S12II 520 Bronze

Central Processing Units: Setting the tone for system performance.

Intel vs. AMD : Succinctly, Intel cannot compete with AMD on the low end in terms of value, and AMD cannot compete with Intel on the high end in terms of performance. Things get stickier in the mid range. I only consider AMD’s AM3 processors as their AM2/AM2+ chips are getting very long in the tooth and are increasingly difficult to find in retail channels. I am no longer building Intel LGA 775-based systems except on the budget end for people who insist on Intel. Both the socket and DDR2 are more or less dead at this point.

Single, Dual, Triple, Quad, and Hex-core computing: If you use your computer to browse the web, email, type papers, listen to mp3s, and look at photos, and are on a tight budget, you should still consider a single-core solution, though see a different perspective (mfenn's) below. However, if you like to do these things at the same time, and can afford to spend at least $30 more, get a dual core system. Triple-core processors are available from AMD and they only cost as much as mid to high-mid range dual cores, so they are also worth considering. Quads run from about $90 to over $500. AMD offers a $200 hex-core cpu, which puts six core computing in the mid to high-mid range of systems. You should check out Anandtech’s Bench to get an idea of how specific processors perform for specific tasks. Do not compare clock speeds, compare benchmarks. Both AMD and Intel have multiple core architectures available that can make clock speed comparisons less meaningful, and each company’s clock speeds are not particularly comparable to the other’s.

Single-cores: Only two single-core cpus are readily available as far as I know, the AMD Sempron 140 and Intel Celeron 430. The Intel chip costs almost 33% more and doesn’t perform as well. This is a non-decision – go with the Sempron.

Dual-cores: Two core cpus range from $50 to over $300. However, I see no reason to spend more than $100 on a dual core processor given that AMD’s least expensive quads are about $100 and therefore offer better value for most computing experiences. I also am hesitant to recommend a dual core cpu at more than $75 because AMD offers triple-core parts starting at that price. However, these quad core and triple core parts use more power and as many games and other software titles still do not use multiple cores, there are reasons to go with dual cores over $100 and $75. The biggest reason to go with a dual core part now is simple: you can upgrade it later.

Budget dual cores: These can be found for $60 or less. At this price range, you’re essentially looking at the AMD Athlon II X2 250 and Intel Pentium Dual Core E5400. They perform nearly identically in terms of real world usage. However, the AMD part has two things that tip the scales in its favor: you can use it on a DDR3-based AM3 motherboard and it’s cheaper.

Dual cores worth considering for future upgrade purposes only:
Intel Pentium G6950 is the least expensive Socket 1156 part available. I suspect you’ll be able to find used i5-750s for $150 or less by the middle of 2011 and that will be one hell of a drop-in upgrade - this is the only reason I think this part is worth considering if you must build a system now.
AMD Phenom II X2 555 Black Edition is an extremely fast dual core with serious overclock potential. I suspect you’ll be able to find used AMD six-core cpus for $150 or less by the middle of 2011 and that also will be one hell of a drop-in upgrade.

Triple core processors: Only AMD offers tri-core cpus. At $75, the Athlon II X3 440 offers tremendous value for general computing. Its overall performance simply can’t be matched in the $60-$90 cpu range.

Budget quad cores: Only AMD offers quad cores around $100. At $90 the Athlon II X4 620 is the cheapest and at $105 the Athlon II X4 640 is the most expensive. Note that this is a very narrow range of pricing – Newegg currently offers the 640 with a $10 gift card making the real cost of the cpu $95. At $95, the 3.0ghz quad core AMD 640 is an astonishing value for its performance!

Low end quad cores: AMD offers three quad core processors at $165 or less. Their Phenom II quads perform better than their Athlon II quads by a noticeable but not dramatic margin. I like the Phenom II X4 945 because of its lower TDP, though note the Phenom II X4 955 and Phenom II X4 965 can often be undervolted so that they draw less juice. However, I recommend either the 945 or 955; I see no real reason to get a 965 - the effort required to turn a 955 into a 965 is next to nothing and spending the extra $15 is a waste.
Note I am not recommending comparably priced Intel quads because they do not perform as well as the Phenom II X4s and they are tied to a dead socket (LGA 775) and a dead RAM standard (DDR2).

Mid-range quads: I really consider only the Intel i5-750 and i5-760 as mid-range quads. These processors are amazing! They perform better than the Phenom II X4s by a substantial margin while using less juice. Their only real competition is…

The budget six core cpu: AMD’s Phenom II X6 1055T. Whether you should get an i5-750/760 or a 1055T depends on your usage. The i5s perform much better clock-for-clock but the X6 has two more cores. Check out Bench. For general, mixed-purpose computing, I recommend the i5s mostly for power consumption reasons.

Motherboards: Again, I am no longer building/recommending DDR2-based boards. DDR3 is now no more expensive than DDR2 and while DDR2 still has some life left, its days are numbered and that number is not large.

Budget AMD AM3 boards: These can be found for $50 or less:
Biostar MCP6P3: this has an ancient chipset but I’ve never had one arrive DOA and none have died on me yet.
Foxconn A74ML-K 3.0: This is my current top recommendation for $50 or less (normal/non-sale priced) AM3 boards.

Low end AMD AM3 boards: These can be found for $75-80 or less.
Biostar TA785G3HD AM3: This is my go-to low end AM3 board recently. I’m very pleased with it. With a capable onboard graphics processor, DVI and HDMI outs, and T-series build quality, it is an excellent value at $65.
ASUS M4A785TD-M EVO: Same chipset as the above board, but I like ASUS’ build quality more than Biostar’s. They also have a better warranty system in my experience.
MSI 880GM-E41 AM3: this is based on a newer chipset than the above boards and I like MSI’s build quality and SATA port placement on this board. One drawback is a lack of a DVI port for its excellent (at least for) onboard graphics, so you’ll need to get an HDMI-DVI adapter if your monitor uses DVI and not HDMI.
Gigabyte GA-770T-USB3: it has an older chipset and no onboard video, but is a full-sized ATX board with more features than the above boards. I am a big fan of Gigabyte build quality.

Mid range AM3 boards: These are less than $100.
ASUS M4A88T-M: The only drawback to this board is its lack of an eSATA port.
ASUS M4A88T-M/USB3: This board is identical to the one above except a few dollars more gets you a couple USB 3.0 ports.
ASUS M4A79XTD EVO: This has an older chipset than the above two boards and no onboard video but is Crossfire capable.
MSI 790X-G45: Same chipset as the above ASUS board, also Crossfire capable. Note the worse warranty, though.
Biostar TA890GXB: Slightly newer chipset than the 880-based boards above.
Biostar TA880G HD AM3: Biostar T-series quality, and I’ve been seeing this on sale for $80-90 recently. A friend of mine has a Phenom II X6 1055T at 3.6ghz with stock volts and all features (like Turbo Core) intact, so my small sample size of 1 indicates this is a beastly overclocker.

Budget Intel LGA 1156 board:
Biostar H55 HD: This is the only budget LGA 1156 board I can recommend.

Low-end Intel LGA 1156 boards: Almost every <$100 LGA 1156 board uses the same H55 chipset, which supports the IGP on Core i3 processors.
Biostar TH55B HD: I’ve built a dozen systems with this board and have been pleased with it thus far…
ASUS P7H55-M PRO: Now that this board has been available for about the same cost as the above Biostar, I’ve been buying it. Only three systems so far, but I like it a lot.

Low-mid range Intel LGA 1156 boards: These boards at $125 or less typically use the P55 chipset. This article is a nice comparison of H55, H57, and P55. The differences between these chipsets, however, are not particularly relevant to the budget, low and mid range builder, aside from the facts that H55/57 support the IGP of Core i3s while P55 can run Crossfire and SLI in true 8x/8x mode. I recommend these primarily for upgradeability (to Crossfire or SLI) and build quality.
Gigabyte GA-P55M-UD2: This is a very well-built P55-based board.
ASUS P7P55 LX: I’ve been pleased with this model as well.

DDR3 RAM: It's RAM, not much to say here other than AMD systems tend to respond better to lower CAS timings than Intel systems. On the budget end, simply go with 2, 3, or 4gb of well-built memory. Windows 7 runs just fine with 2gb total system memory, though 4gb is always better. RAM is just about the easiest component to upgrade, so this is one place you can save $40-50 on now and easily upgrade in a few months when you have a few more dollars. Kingston, Crucial, and G.Skill are my preferences but the only maker I shy away from is OCZ.
Sample 2x1gb kit.
Sample 2x2gb kit.
Sample mid-range kit with lower timings and lower power consumption.

HDDs and SSDs: SSDs started becoming available to mid-range builders in late 2009 when Kingston sold more or less issue-free rebadged Intel G2 40gb SSDs for less than $100. Since then, a plethora of sub-$200 SSDs from various manufacturers have hit the market using different controllers. SSDs offer incredible performance gains over older mechanical HDDs while using far less power. Their disadvantages compared to mechanical disks are that they have far lower capacities and far higher price tags. I can’t emphasize enough how much of a difference using an SSD for a boot/OS/app drive and a mechanical disk for storage makes in terms of overall general computing. If you can afford a tandem SSD+HDD setup, it’s worth it.

SSDs: I have only used Intel SSDs. So far these are the most reliable and non-power user friendly SSDs available. I would especially appreciate input on non-Intel SSDs. At $200 or less, you have two Intel SSD options: 40gb and 80gb. The 40gb variant has half the sequential write speed and slightly lower sequential read speeds as the 80gb variant. These are less important for an OS/app drive than random reads and writes, and even the 40gb disk is astonishingly faster than the fastest mechanical disks. If you’re concerned about the small size of the 40gb disk, don’t be. I have Win 7 Enterprise, Office 2010, Acrobat Pro, and a dozens of smaller apps installed on my 40gb SSD with room to spare. I did install Steam on another disk, though.

Single HDD solutions: Seagate began having issues with their 7200.11 series drives over a year ago and their 7200.12 drives continue to be plagued with defects so I strongly recommend against buying any Seagate hard drive right now. I’m sure others will disagree, but that’s my opinion. Right now I am recommending the following:
Western Digital 500gb AAKS Caviar Blue: Amazon has priced this drive at $45 shipped for about a month now. There is no reason to buy a smaller drive for $5 less. This model has excellent reliability and performance for a mainstream system. Don’t let the horror stories about Amazon’s HDD packaging dissuade you; every drive I’ve bought from them in the last 2-3 months was double-boxed.
Samsung F3 1tb: This can be found for $60. There is no reason to consider purchasing any other hard drive (than the above, simply for cost reasons) for a single disk solution right now given its cost, performance, and capacity.

Storage HDD solutions: I like so-called ‘green’ disks for storage because they use less power, generate less heat, and are quieter than 7200rpm disks. For storage, their performance is more than adequate. Pair one of these with an SSD for the best of both worlds (performance and capacity):
Western Digital 500gb AADS: These can be found for $45 on sale.
Samsung EcoGreen F2 1tb: These have been as cheap as $55 shipped. I like them as much as I like…
Western Digital Green 1tb: I’ve seen these as low as $60 shipped. I have two of these and two of the above Samsung F2s in my personal system.
Western Digital Green 2tb: I also have one of these, which I picked up for $92 from Amazon.

Video cards: for gaming, or at least better than integrated/onboard video:

Budget video cards: Most sources online indicate the best performance at $60 or less is with the Radeon HD 4650 gpu.
4650: XFX builds good quality cards and has one of the best (maybe the best?) warranties in the business.

Low end video cards: I’ve been pleased with the performance of the GT240 DDR5 video cards at the $80 or less bracket.
GT240: EVGA builds good cards and their rebates are reliable. At $45 after rebate, this is tough to beat.

Low-mid-range video cards: For about $100, The Radeon 4850 and Nvidia GTS250 perform very similarly but the GTS250 uses less juice so I recommend those:
GTS 250: This MSI model has a nice cooler and at $70 after rebate (MSI rebates are reliable in my experience), this is a great value.

Mid range video cards: The Radeon 5750s and 5770s are the best mid range cards available at the moment.
I’m starting to see 5750s for just over $100 recently after rebate like this ASUS card. At $125 up front, $105 after rebate, this is the best deal going for a ~$100 video card.
5770s like this Sapphire are also starting to drop to around or even below $150 with a rebate. XFX has this and this available for about $150 after rebate.

High-mid range video cards: The GTX460 reigns here, and you can snag these for less than $200. EVGA has this with a 2 year warranty and this with a lifetime warranty.

Optical drives: Not much to say here. You can find any number of DVD burners for less than $20 shipped. Aside from a few recent dud models (like LGs with bundled Bluebird crapware), I see no real product differentiation amongst burners anymore. A few dollars more will get you Lightscribe and/or dual layer DVD support.

Cases: The appearance of a case is so subjective I don’t really recommend those. Just make sure to get a case with good air flow. Some personal recommendations, however, include:
Antec 300: this can often be found for less than $50 shipped either with or without a rebate. It’s roomy, has excellent airflow, and I think it looks nice. My main system is in one of these.
Cooler Master Elite 341 & 335: I build a lot of simple systems with these; they can often be found for under $40 shipped (or locally).
Antec NSK4482: At $95 shipped this is not a good value but I’ve seen these for $70-80 shipped, and since they include a nice Antec EarthWatts 380W psu, I think it’s a very nice case+psu combo at the lower pricing. It’s also available in an all black variant as well.

Hope this helps. Please feel free to provide feedback!
 
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mfenn

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Somebody give this man a sticky!

Giga, I appreciate the time that you put into this list, but I must disagree with a couple of your points about the CPUs:
(a) I think that buying a single-core like Sempron 140 is a false economy for anything other than "embedded-like" systems (fileservers, routers, etc.). I believe that the number of processes that are vying for CPU time on a modern system (even while single-tasking) warrants a dual-core.
(b) I see no reason to buy a Phenom II X4 965 over a 955 when the 955 is $15 cheaper and can be turned into a 965 via a simple multiplier change (they are both Black Editions).
 

Gigantopithecus

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Dec 14, 2004
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Somebody give this man a sticky!

Giga, I appreciate the time that you put into this list, but I must disagree with a couple of your points about the CPUs:
(a) I think that buying a single-core like Sempron 140 is a false economy for anything other than "embedded-like" systems (fileservers, routers, etc.). I believe that the number of processes that are vying for CPU time on a modern system (even while single-tasking) warrants a dual-core.
(b) I see no reason to buy a Phenom II X4 965 over a 955 when the 955 is $15 cheaper and can be turned into a 965 via a simple multiplier change (they are both Black Editions).

I respectfully disagree with point (a) for two reasons: I have a 140 system at work and for light usage, even with Win 7, it is more than sufficient, and it's also often free or close to free with a low-mid to mid range board.
(b) was a mistake on my part - thanks for catching that - it's fixed now.
 

superccs

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Suggested amendments:
*AMD Phenom II x3 740 BE $88 as fast as a c2d e8600 for $200 less.
*OCZ agility 60Gb SSD are also incredibly awesome at the $110 price point.

*Mid range video should be more towards a $150-200 budget since your low end is $60 and low mid range is $100.
Right now the king of midrange is the GTX460

If you go with many of the mid range suggestions so far you should end up with a i5 of AMD quad CPU, a 500-600W PSU and a decent mobo... a 460 GTX or (if the price drops) hd5850 would provide more system balance.

Good reference post though, cheers.
 

crucibelle

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Giga,

I have a question about one of the motherboards you recommended, the Asus M4A785TD-M EVO. I've been considering the Asus M4A88TD-V EVO/USB3, myself.. which is quite a bit more expensive than than the recommended one. I'd rather go with the less expensive option, but I'm worried about the audio. Every other Asus board that is cheaper than the M4A88TD-V EVO/USB3 uses VIA VT1708S instead of Realtek ALC892. So what I'm wondering is... will I be able to tell a difference between the two? Is one better than the other? Obviously, I have assumed the Realtek is better, but I don't know. I'd be using headphones, if that makes any difference. I'd love to have your (and anyone else) thoughts on this.

ps -- Giga, I also just wanted to say thank you for taking the time to put this together. I was hoping someone would do this, since the similar thread is out-of-date.
 
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mfenn

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Giga,

I have a question about one of the motherboards you recommended, the Asus M4A785TD-M EVO. I've been considering the Asus M4A88TD-V EVO/USB3, myself.. which is quite a bit more expensive than than the recommended one. I'd rather go with the less expensive option, but I'm worried about the audio. Every other Asus board that is cheaper than the M4A88TD-V EVO/USB3 uses VIA VT1708S instead of Realtek ALC892. So what I'm wondering is... will I be able to tell a difference between the two? Is one better than the other? Obviously, I have assumed the Realtek is better, but I don't know. I'd be using headphones, if that makes any difference. I'd love to have your (and anyone else) thoughts on this.

In my experience, it really depends more on the board's integration of the audio chip than it does the chip itself. So basically, it is a crap shoot, but ASUS tends to do a good job.
 

Gigantopithecus

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Dec 14, 2004
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Giga,

I have a question about one of the motherboards you recommended, the Asus M4A785TD-M EVO. I've been considering the Asus M4A88TD-V EVO/USB3, myself.. which is quite a bit more expensive than than the recommended one. I'd rather go with the less expensive option, but I'm worried about the audio. Every other Asus board that is cheaper than the M4A88TD-V EVO/USB3 uses VIA VT1708S instead of Realtek ALC892. So what I'm wondering is... will I be able to tell a difference between the two? Is one better than the other? Obviously, I have assumed the Realtek is better, but I don't know. I'd be using headphones, if that makes any difference. I'd love to have your (and anyone else) thoughts on this.

ps -- Giga, I also just wanted to say thank you for taking the time to put this together. I was hoping someone would do this, since the similar thread is out-of-date.

Onboard audio chips nowadays are solid on all but the lowest of the low end motherboards. Both Realtek and Via release good drivers for the above-mentioned chips, too. I personally noted no difference between them on Sennheiser HD203s. Perhaps a difference might emerge on nice stereo equipment, but I doubt it's detectable on headphones.
 

Gigantopithecus

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Dec 14, 2004
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Suggested amendments:
*AMD Phenom II x3 740 BE $88 as fast as a c2d e8600 for $200 less.
*OCZ agility 60Gb SSD are also incredibly awesome at the $110 price point.

*Mid range video should be more towards a $150-200 budget since your low end is $60 and low mid range is $100.
Right now the king of midrange is the GTX460

If you go with many of the mid range suggestions so far you should end up with a i5 of AMD quad CPU, a 500-600W PSU and a decent mobo... a 460 GTX or (if the price drops) hd5850 would provide more system balance.

Good reference post though, cheers.

Thank you.

Two quick questions:
By the time you get a hsf, the X3 740 is as expensive as the 3.0ghz Athlon II X4. I'm not certain why you'd go with the BE tri-core over the AIIX4?
I know when I researched SSDs a few months ago OCZ's SSDs were still not particularly user-friendly out of the box. Have those issues been resolved?

Good advice on the video card - updating that in a moment.
 

mfenn

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I know when I researched SSDs a few months ago OCZ's SSDs were still not particularly user-friendly out of the box. Have those issues been resolved?

Not sure what you mean when you say "not user friendly". You pretty much plug them in and they work, same as any other drive. Sure, there are a bunch of tweaks you can do, but those are not required.
 

crucibelle

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mfenn & Giga -- Thank you both for the info! :)

I have a couple more questions, if you don't mind: About the QVL - do I have to choose the exact RAM modules that are listed on the QVL, or is just making sure I get RAM from a listed vendor ok? And one more question... when purchasing 8 gigs of RAM, is it better to get 2 x 4GB or 4 x 2GB? Just wondering if one or the other configuration is more stable. Thanks again! :)
 

Gigantopithecus

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Dec 14, 2004
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mfenn & Giga -- Thank you both for the info! :)

I have a couple more questions, if you don't mind: About the QVL - do I have to choose the exact RAM modules that are listed on the QVL, or is just making sure I get RAM from a listed vendor ok? And one more question... when purchasing 8 gigs of RAM, is it better to get 2 x 4GB or 4 x 2GB? Just wondering if one or the other configuration is more stable. Thanks again! :)

I used to (~5 years ago) check QVLs but don't bother at all anymore. If you buy good RAM from a good manufacturer, it will work with a good motherboard. The cynic in me suspects QVLs are paid listings.

Neither 2x4gb nor 4x2gb is inherently more stable, though 2x4gb has the added advantage of drawing less juice and easier upgrading. Because 2x4gb kits are less expensive (for the most part) than 4x2gb kits, go with a 2x4gb kit. Just make sure your board can support 4gb modules. I don't think anything I listed above won't work with 4gb modules, but some of the cheaper ones might only support 4gb max, so...

Another thing to consider is whether you really need 8gb of RAM. The best way to test this, in my experience, is to order 8gb, do your thing with 4gb, and then do it with 8gb. Any difference? If not, sell the extra 4gb. You'll lose a few dollars but that's far cheaper than having an extra 4gb worth of RAM in your system that never really does anything.
 

Gigantopithecus

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Not sure what you mean when you say "not user friendly". You pretty much plug them in and they work, same as any other drive. Sure, there are a bunch of tweaks you can do, but those are not required.

Erm, to qualify, it was now more than a few months ago - more like end 2009/start 2010. There were a lot of issues with the early non-Intel SSDs. Apparently, though, this is now corrected. Please feel free to add non-Intel SSD recommendations.
 

mfenn

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Jan 17, 2010
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Erm, to qualify, it was now more than a few months ago - more like end 2009/start 2010. There were a lot of issues with the early non-Intel SSDs. Apparently, though, this is now corrected. Please feel free to add non-Intel SSD recommendations.

Yeah, the original non-Intel SSD's really sucked. Everything since the Indilinx drives came out has been solid though.

My current favorite drives would be something Sandforce-based like the OCZ Agility 2, OCZ Vertex 2, or the Corsair Force. The Intel X25-M G2's are still good, of course.
 

crucibelle

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Yeah, the original non-Intel SSD's really sucked. Everything since the Indilinx drives came out has been solid though.

My current favorite drives would be something Sandforce-based like the OCZ Agility 2, OCZ Vertex 2, or the Corsair Force. The Intel X25-M G2's are still good, of course.

What are the differences between the Agility and the Vertex?
 

Zap

Elite Member
Oct 13, 1999
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Nice start to a guide!

Disclosure:

Heh, the important part for the person posting.

1. Buy all of your system’s components at about the same time.

Thank you. I always, always tell people this, but for some reason a lot of people really, really want to buy a piece at a time when they can afford it.

4. Have a backup system in place and use it.

Again, thank you. However, you might be talking to a brick wall as far as most users are concerned. :|

Monitors tend to hold their value much better than any other component and can easily be re-used with many systems over the years. You might be looking at it hours and hours per day, and it’s what everyone else will see as well. It’s the only component I recommend splurging on.

Great advice.

Beware that the rated output of less expensive (i.e. <$40-50) psus is often grossly exaggerated.

This isn't strictly true. For instance the regular price on an 80+ Bronze Seasonic 350W seems to always be under $50. I'd use that PSU in a heartbeat unless I needed to run a higher powered graphics card.

On the flip side, this expensive PSU was overrated crap.

I used to (~5 years ago) check QVLs but don't bother at all anymore. If you buy good RAM from a good manufacturer, it will work with a good motherboard. The cynic in me suspects QVLs are paid listings.

I don't think they are paid, but likely the RAM is "donated."

I'd like to add that instead of just "good" RAM, usually the most compatible RAM is those that follow JEDEC and chipset specs to a dot. For instance, what should you buy for socket 1156? Well, JEDEC specifies 1.5V at whatever latency, and Intel specifies 1333MHz max frequency for their memory controller. Thus, if you buy 1333MHz DDR3 that is 1.5v, chances are it will work fine (unless it is faulty, badly binned, wrong SPD data, yada yada).

This thread really needs to be stickied!

Maybe someone should suggest it under Forum Issues in the Suggestion Box?
 

crucibelle

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mfenn -- thank you so much for your answer to my previous question.

I have yet more questions, guys.. hope you don't mind! Ok, I don't game at all, so I usually purchase motherboards that have integrated video. However, I do hope to use some of the new features of Photoshop CS5. In any case, I've noticed that some of the motherboards I've been looking at have something called "sideport memory". All I want to know is if it's important for my application to have a board that includes this sideport memory, or not? By the way, there was a question posed upthread about why choose 8 gigs of memory. My reasoning is that if I'm going to be sharing system memory with the IGP, I should probably have more than 4 gigs. Is this sound reasoning, or ? Plus, there's also the fact that I'll be using photoshop, which I read needs a lot of memory. However, I only do it as a hobby, not professionally. I'm not a big fan of going overboard and getting stuff I don't need (4 gig vs 8 gig, for example)... so any advice on that is welcome. :)
 
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mfenn

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Sideport memory is essentially dedicated video RAM for the IGP. It does improve the IGP's performance a bit. Perhaps more importantly, it allows the IGP to run without stealing any of the main memory.

As for going to 8GB, it really depends on how much memory you currently utilize. Open Task Manager when you are Photoshopping and see how much memory is free. If you don't have any free memory, then you should probably think about going to 8GB.
 

crucibelle

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Feb 21, 2005
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mfenn - Thank you. :) This was copied from Everest (while photoshopping). I currently have only 2 gigs of memory. Seems like a lot of virtual memory is being used. What do you think?

Field Value
Physical Memory
Total 2030 MB
Used 1539 MB
Free 490 MB
Utilization 76 &#37;

Swap Space
Total 3923 MB
Used 1625 MB
Free 2298 MB
Utilization 41 %

Virtual Memory
Total 5953 MB
Used 3165 MB
Free 2788 MB
Utilization 53 %

Paging File
Paging File C:\pagefile.sys
Initial / Maximum Size 2046 MB / 4092 MB
Current Size 2046 MB
Current / Peak Usage 15 MB / 37 MB
Utilization 1 %
 

mfenn

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Jan 17, 2010
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The physical memory field is really the only one that you need to pay attention to. It looks like you could definitely use an upgrade to 4GB, but 8GB would be overkill.