The Eyewear industry has turned into complete Bull

[slayer202]

WAHHHH

is that PD really necessary? I got a prescription from an eyeglasses store, and ended up buying a pair from a different store. They didn't need any other number, nor did they measure or do whatever the fuck. Why do the online sites ask?

but really, WAHHHH some more

 

[poofyhairguy]

WTF is going on here....

Like most industries, primary eye care is getting to the point where it is hard to make a really good living just being a doctor. Vision plans are drying up thanks to ACA minimum standards, and compensation for exams/testing from Medicare and Medicaid go down every year (and insurance rates are pegged to those rates). For really successful optometrists most of their profit comes from the dispensary, not providing care. The few that I know who make six figures all have high-pressure sales tactics related to designer frames or have some of of payroll MD fly in and do surgeries for them.

That is not the real crime though. The real crime is the optometrists that won't mention treatment options like LASIK or multifocal lenses (or worse scare you away from them) because they want that gravy train of making you glasses to keep coming in. Or they won't refer a glaucoma patient for SLT treatment because they want the regular checkups to continue (even if that means the patient pays thousands of dollars a year in drop costs).

Primary eye care is just like dentistry, done by "doctors" with a minimal amount of training or moral brainwashing. What scares me is that some states are flirting with the idea of allowing optometrists of being able to perform laser procedures like SLTs and LASIK basically to drive down what they have to compensate real doctors. At that point the overall quality of eye care will be close to the overall quality of the used car sales industry.

 

[Imp]

I ordered my first pair of glasses ever online a few months ago.

Stop. The. Presses.

I only paid about $140 for an entire set. The last time I went to just get my lenses updated, it was $200. And insurance covered it!

Luckily, I've also been blind for my entire life so know my prescription very well and what my frame measurements are. Having past prescriptions and a body that hasn't grown much in over a decade helps too -- I just got the pupillary distance off an old prescription.

The annoying thing is that you have to know how to adjust your own glasses -- or if you don't care, you can walk into a store and ask. I learned to do it with 2 pairs of $300 Maui Jims and 1 pair of $150 Ray Bans in the past.

 

[BottledWater!]

Like most industries, primary eye care is getting to the point where it is hard to make a really good living just being a doctor. Vision plans are drying up thanks to ACA minimum standards, and compensation for exams/testing from Medicare and Medicaid go down every year (and insurance rates are pegged to those rates). For really successful optometrists most of their profit comes from the dispensary, not providing care. The few that I know who make six figures all have high-pressure sales tactics related to designer frames or have some of of payroll MD fly in and do surgeries for them.

That is not the real crime though. The real crime is the optometrists that won't mention treatment options like LASIK or multifocal lenses (or worse scare you away from them) because they want that gravy train of making you glasses to keep coming in. Or they won't refer a glaucoma patient for SLT treatment because they want the regular checkups to continue (even if that means the patient pays thousands of dollars a year in drop costs).

Primary eye care is just like dentistry, done by "doctors" with a minimal amount of training or moral brainwashing. What scares me is that some states are flirting with the idea of allowing optometrists of being able to perform laser procedures like SLTs and LASIK basically to drive down what they have to compensate real doctors. At that point the overall quality of eye care will be close to the overall quality of the used car sales industry.

Has absolutely nothing to do with ACA or any other recent political developments. The reason prices have been astronomical is because pricing and comparative information to the average consumer has not been transparent.

 

[BottledWater!]

I ordered my first pair of glasses ever online a few months ago.

Stop. The. Presses.

I only paid about $140 for an entire set. The last time I went to just get my lenses updated, it was $200. And insurance covered it!

Luckily, I've also been blind for my entire life so know my prescription very well and what my frame measurements are. Having past prescriptions and a body that hasn't grown much in over a decade helps too -- I just got the pupillary distance off an old prescription.

The annoying thing is that you have to know how to adjust your own glasses -- or if you don't care, you can walk into a store and ask. I learned to do it with 2 pairs of $300 Maui Jims and 1 pair of $150 Ray Bans in the past.

That was the down side. However, a quick trip to youtube provided all the information I needed.

 

[Phokus]

Most people don't know this, but one Italian company has a monopoly on eyewear (glasses + sunglasses)... not only that, but they own most of the most popular eyeglass/sunglass stores (aka vertical integration) Edit: Forgot they own of the 2 large vision insurance companies too!:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDdq2rIqAlM

Most eyewear is overpriced, as a result.

 

[phucheneh]

Yea, I noticed that when I get my prescription I have to ASK for my PD every single time. They always leave it out for some odd reason...

I was under the impression the glasses place did that; not the optometrist. You bring in your Rx from the doc, you pick out frames/options, they take measurements and make glasses.

So for you long-time online shoppers, what's the best place? EyeBuy, Zenni, or something else?

 

[poofyhairguy]

Has absolutely nothing to do with ACA or any other recent political developments.

I never said it did, the eye business has long had glasses as the profit driver. But ACA and the related price pressure that puts on health insurance policies for businesses has impacted the coverage for vision plans which were guaranteed payments in eyecare. This then means that optometrists have to lean even HARDER on the dispensary to make their money.

The reason prices have been astronomical is because pricing and comparative information to the average consumer has not been transparent.

Well that is all American medicine.

 

[Zee]

Here's the deal. I have VSP. It's 10 for exam and they pretty much over most of the frame, but they only cover basic polycarb lens. Therefore I spend a additional 100 or more for lens. So I get one pair of basic frame and higher lens for around 120 (with tax).

vsp is garbage. it's known to be an insurance under name only.

 

[lxskllr]

I went to Walmart yesterday, and spent $368 total for an exam, and two pair of glasses. That was higher than I expected, but the quality looks about the same as lenscrafters. I got my last glasses from them around 15 years ago, and I spent $240 for two pair of glasses. The price increase seems to have eclipsed inflation, especially considering I have to wait a week for my Walmart glasses, but whatcha gonna do? Either pay the price, or don't see...

 

[phucheneh]

Since when does eye insurance actually do anything other than maybe cover some of the exam? I'm sure there are plans out there, but most people's eye insurance nothing more than what amounts to a 25% coupon. Off of regular price.

Meanwhile, every single store is always running 25% off sales. Or '40% off frames,' or '50% off lenses.' Something that amounts to nearly the exact same savings your insurance offers.

 

[waggy]

Most people don't know this, but one Italian company has a monopoly on eyewear (glasses + sunglasses)... not only that, but they own most of the most popular eyeglass/sunglass stores (aka vertical integration):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDdq2rIqAlM

Most eyewear is overpriced, as a result.

yeap. wich is why it really does not matter where you go. those laughing at walmart eye doctor are insane. they are just as well trained and you get glass's FAR cheaper. though they are still higher then online.

Yea, I noticed that when I get my prescription I have to ASK for my PD every single time. They always leave it out for some odd reason...

last eye exam i had they REFUSED to give it to me.

 

[lxskllr]

yeap. wich is why it really does not matter where you go. those laughing at walmart eye doctor are insane. they are just as well trained and you get glass's FAR cheaper.

My Walmart doctor was a weirdo. She was getting *very* excited over correctly narrowing down my prescription, and then told me I needed bifocals, even after saying I didn't want them. She went as far as laying a guilt trip on me about spending time to get the bifocal part right, and now I wasn't gonna take them. I seriously thought she wouldn't let me leave without bifocals :^/

While she's technically correct, I can see up close without glasses, and don't want changes part way into the lens. I require my eyes for work, and I need to be able to see clearly at all angles for distance more than anything. I'm fine with taking them off, or looking over the top to see close.

As long as the glasses turn out right, I can deal with the weirdness of the doctor, but the whole thing was kind of unsettling.

 

[phucheneh]

My Walmart doctor was a weirdo. She was getting *very* excited over correctly narrowing down my prescription, and then told me I needed bifocals, even after saying I didn't want them. She went as far as laying a guilt trip on me about spending time to get the bifocal part right, and now I wasn't gonna take them. I seriously thought she wouldn't let me leave without bifocals :^/

While she's technically correct, I can see up close without glasses, and don't want changes part way into the lens. I require my eyes for work, and I need to be able to see clearly at all angles for distance more than anything. I'm fine with taking them off, or looking over the top to see close.

As long as the glasses turn out right, I can deal with the weirdness of the doctor, but the whole thing was kind of unsettling.

I recently had this shit after complaining that they were over-correcting my vision and causing me to be uncomfortable up close.

'I can see exception detail in clouds forty miles away, and that's great, but also useless. I have too much eye strain up close.'

'Oh. Well you need bifocals!'

'...no, that's not how that works.'

Apparently they think bifocals with their far presciption and a near prescription of...nothing...is a good solution to this problem.

 

[waggy]

My Walmart doctor was a weirdo. She was getting *very* excited over correctly narrowing down my prescription, and then told me I needed bifocals, even after saying I didn't want them. She went as far as laying a guilt trip on me about spending time to get the bifocal part right, and now I wasn't gonna take them. I seriously thought she wouldn't let me leave without bifocals :^/

While she's technically correct, I can see up close without glasses, and don't want changes part way into the lens. I require my eyes for work, and I need to be able to see clearly at all angles for distance more than anything. I'm fine with taking them off, or looking over the top to see close.

As long as the glasses turn out right, I can deal with the weirdness of the doctor, but the whole thing was kind of unsettling.

rolf. yeah i can see why that would be.

The doctor at the local walmart is pretty good. i used to go there but my insurance does not pay for them. but i HATE the place they send em too

 

[Leyawiin]

Vision care (along with dental) is a complete racket. Thank goodness I never have problems with my teeth (haven't needed anything other than a couple fillings replaced in 30+ years) because my glasses set me back enough. Strong, complicated prescription.

 

[DrPizza]

You would have to be delusional to think that it costs for than $10 per pair of frames to manufacture high quality vs. cheap quality frames.

Memory titanium frames, fit perfectly, can get hit in the face by a basketball, can drop them, can fall asleep with them on and roll on top of them while sleeping, and they're no worse for wear. $25 for the pair of glasses. "But... But... They don't say Oakley." Who cares.

 

[steppinthrax]

vsp is garbage. it's known to be an insurance under name only.

VSP actually is not bad. 10 for an exam and they cover basic frames. If I want to go with basic polycarb then I pay around 60 bucks or so for one pair of coke bottle glasses.

 

[steppinthrax]

yeap. wich is why it really does not matter where you go. those laughing at walmart eye doctor are insane. they are just as well trained and you get glass's FAR cheaper. though they are still higher then online.



last eye exam i had they REFUSED to give it to me.

I called before to make abs sure they are going to give me the PD. I've been around the block enough to know these type of tricks.

 

[nickbits]

I only wear contacts that aren't sold online. Last time I was in he wanted me to wear the lenses for half their rated life span (3 mos vs 6 rated). Total cost was like $700. However I am just going to wear them for 6 months and not go back next year so he actually saved me some money.

 

[steppinthrax]

WAHHHH

is that PD really necessary? I got a prescription from an eyeglasses store, and ended up buying a pair from a different store. They didn't need any other number, nor did they measure or do whatever the fuck. Why do the online sites ask?

but really, WAHHHH some more

PD is necessary so when they grind the lens the area where your eyes spend the most time is going to dictate the lens shape.

 

[Schfifty Five]

Vision Insurance for the win. Free pair a year.

How much do you pay for your vision insurance? If it's anything above $0.00, then your glasses ain't free.

 

[OutHouse]

Since when does eye insurance actually do anything other than maybe cover some of the exam? I'm sure there are plans out there, but most people's eye insurance nothing more than what amounts to a 25% coupon. Off of regular price.

I have VSP and it covers a lot more than your silly coupon analogy

 

[OutHouse]

How much do you pay for your vision insurance? If it's anything above $0.00, then your glasses ain't free.

$7.50 a paycheck for the family.

 

[Slew Foot]

Like most industries, primary eye care is getting to the point where it is hard to make a really good living just being a doctor. Vision plans are drying up thanks to ACA minimum standards, and compensation for exams/testing from Medicare and Medicaid go down every year (and insurance rates are pegged to those rates). For really successful optometrists most of their profit comes from the dispensary, not providing care. The few that I know who make six figures all have high-pressure sales tactics related to designer frames or have some of of payroll MD fly in and do surgeries for them.

That is not the real crime though. The real crime is the optometrists that won't mention treatment options like LASIK or multifocal lenses (or worse scare you away from them) because they want that gravy train of making you glasses to keep coming in. Or they won't refer a glaucoma patient for SLT treatment because they want the regular checkups to continue (even if that means the patient pays thousands of dollars a year in drop costs).

Primary eye care is just like dentistry, done by "doctors" with a minimal amount of training or moral brainwashing. What scares me is that some states are flirting with the idea of allowing optometrists of being able to perform laser procedures like SLTs and LASIK basically to drive down what they have to compensate real doctors. At that point the overall quality of eye care will be close to the overall quality of the used car sales industry.

More or less this, insurance reimbursement for basic primary care/screening are so low that it barely covers the overhead of keeping the lights on. If the guy wants to eat, they have to sell you lenses or glasses. One of the eye doctors around here quit doing surgery because he made more money selling eyeglasses than doing cataract surgery for medicare patients.