The Dutch government will abandon the model of a multicultural society

[Zebo]

My mom is Scandinavian and is tight as a drum. I'm taking cutting up old tshirts & underwear for rags. Making "windex" out of vinegar and water, etc. My parents are millionaires and she remained that way. We always got the speech growing up.. we came here with $90 etc etc etc whenever we wanted something. Tight.

My dad, irish, thankfully had a different philosophy (what's the point of making it if you can't enjoy it) but mom never changed i think she still sews her own clothes.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

My mom is Scandinavian and is tight as a drum.

^_^

 

[sactoking]

The national identity of the Dutch used to be one of tolerance or acceptance. It seems that the cultures/religions/etc. immigrants are bringing in have been in the Netherlands longer than this new idea of xenophobia.

Tolerance and acceptance is not an identity, it is a trait. If it were an identity then the nation would have no true identity as it would be constantly changed to reflect the current ethnic/religious majority.

Even the most tolerant of people have a breaking point at which they say "Fuck it, you're not even trying to do anything except turn my homeland into *random country* part two."

 

[nonlnear]

Frugal is the word you're looking for Actually, I agree with you on that one, the Dutch are generally penny pinchers and cheap.

A coworker of my dad's once went on an employee exchange with a partner company in the Netherlands. He was tasked with planning a sale and figured that a 20% discount would make for a suitable campaign (which would have been appropriate for such a campaign over here in this industry). When he presented his plan he was chastised for his insanity, and management whittled it down to a sale of 3% off.

 

[CanOWorms]

The Dutch are also notorious for integrating very quickly into any foreign culture when they emigrate, and dropping their native language faster than most other cultures in favor of their adopted country's language.

<- Also of Dutch extraction, now living in the US.

And they are stingy bastards.

LOL

Yes, I am sure they integrated quickly into their slave-genocide colonies.

 

[CanOWorms]

That's great, we'll respect your culture, but there are some base things we need to agree on. If you disagree with the fundamental tenets of freedom, go live somewhere else."

<- Dutch, now living in the US.

The problem is that much of these "fundamental tenets of freedom" are not what they claim to be.

The Dutch want these people to change their names, religions, ethnicities, skin color, etc. That is not acceptable. The Dutch need to integrate into the world's culture as well.

 

[nonlnear]

LOL

Yes, I am sure they integrated quickly into their slave-genocide colonies.

I'm not talking about their colonies. (And on that point, the Dutch weren't really any more horrific than any other colonizing power in terms of slavery or genocide. It just happened that one of their colonies managed to hang on to that legacy in a slightly more noteworthy manner than many other recovering European colonies.)

I was talking about when Dutch people move to a country such as the USA, GBR, etc. The Dutch have a massive cultural inferiority complex, especially regarding the Germans. (Kind of like Canada vis a vis the US actually.) It makes them rather eager to integrate into many other cultures.

 

[freegeeks]

The problem is that much of these "fundamental tenets of freedom" are not what they claim to be.

The Dutch want these people to change their names, religions, ethnicities, skin color, etc. That is not acceptable. The Dutch need to integrate into the world's culture as well.

show me where the Dutch govt wants immigrants to change their names, religions, ethnicities, skin color, etc.

I want to see proof

 

[nonlnear]

show me where the Dutch govt wants immigrants to change their names, religions, ethnicities, skin color, etc.

I want to see proof

You'll be waiting for a while...

 

[CanOWorms]

show me where the Dutch govt wants immigrants to change their names, religions, ethnicities, skin color, etc.

I want to see proof

How do I provide proof of what is in someone else's mind?

Additionally, can the world afford a Netherlands, and Europe overall, with declining and aging population? Especially when Europe developed itself based on the resources pillaged from the rest of the world? Europeans should gracefully allow their continent and countries to thrive beyond any sort of ethnic decline. They need to abandon beliefs of ethnic and racial purity. The era of Hitler has been over for a while.

The Dutch are dying. That's the way it is. But that doesn't mean that the Netherlands must die. Let the Nigerians or Mongolians take it over and become the new Dutch.

 

[freegeeks]

How do I provide proof of what is in someone else's mind?

Additionally, can the world afford a Netherlands, and Europe overall, with declining and aging population? Especially when Europe developed itself based on the resources pillaged from the rest of the world? Europeans should gracefully allow their continent and countries to thrive beyond any sort of ethnic decline. They need to abandon beliefs of ethnic and racial purity. The era of Hitler has been over for a while.

The Dutch are dying. That's the way it is. But that doesn't mean that the Netherlands must die. Let the Nigerians or Mongolians take it over and become the new Dutch.

you can't, how do you know then what Dutch people are thinking? So I'm waiting for proof that the official policy is what you claim it to be

still waiting...

 

[William Gaatjes]

I understand on one hand where they are coming from but I also fear the backlash that can occur towards the immigrants who are not causing any issues and just want to be normal citizens

THE HAGUE, June 17 (Xinhua) -- The Dutch government will abandon the model of a multicultural society.

In a letter to parliament on Thursday Minister Piet Hein Donner of Internal Affairs states that the Netherlands will start a new integration policy.

"The government shares the social discontent that exists on the multicultural society," read the letter published Friday. "In the new integration, the values of the Dutch society play a central role. With this change, the government steps away from the model of a multicultural society."

The new government wants more demands on immigrants. They should be responsible themselves for ensuring that they learn the Dutch language.

"A more obligatory integration is justified because the government also demands that from its own citizens," the letter continued.

"It is necessary because otherwise the society gradually grows apart and eventually no one feels at home anymore in the Netherlands. The integration will not be tailored to different groups."

The letter announced various measures, such as subsidies and measures for the integration of specific groups will be stopped and will be part of an overall integration policy.

Action will be taken against forced marriages and a burqa ban will be announced from Jan. 1, 2013.

The measures are no surprise since the new government of the liberal party VVV and the Christian Democrats CDA, supported by the anti-islam Party of Freedom PVV, already signaled of taking these steps.

The largest opposition party, the labor party PvdA, was't happy at all with the integration note.

"I fear that the government is making a historic mistake," said integration spokesman Martijn van Dam in Dutch newspaper De Volkskrant. "Actually, they say there are problems, but they will not help," he added.

"These sounds were also heard in the sixties and eighties. That did not go well. I'm afraid we have to say the same in about 10 years."
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english2010/culture/2011-06/17/c_13936084.htm

Anybody who will ever visit the Netherlands will see that the people with the Islamic faith and who work, are friendly kind people who are willing to fight against extremists. The men and the women who have education do not walk in traditional clothing. Here it is very open, foreign customs are accepted as long as the customs respect other people. I myself would not be surprised that in the hypothetical situation where some extremist group would attack the Netherlands, all people no matter what religion will join and fight against the extremists. Of course, there are exceptions, but they do always exist.

IMHO :

I am not happy with the view the PVV has. But i am happy they are currently in the government because the presence of the PVV acts as a balance against the left parties who believe to much in fairy tales. An left only government will destabilize a country just as an right only government will destabilize a country.

The PVV only could rise in power because of the simple fact that the left and far left politicians would not listen to the problems of the common people.
And that is something the left and the far left still do not seem to understand. Dutch people do not like the PVV that much, but they do not like it all when they are being harassed by youth gangs. Of course these youth gangs are not representative for the entire population but every day people experience every day life and then it is not that easy to put things into perspective every time they are harassed. Luckily, things do approve but not enough. Add the fact that left politicians immediately come up with the VOC past or label people as NSB(dutch nazi) whenever native dutch people complain about anti-social behavior.

When they cannot speak their minds without being labeled racists by native Dutch left people. And of course it will happen that a small minority of not native people who really have their own political agenda use these deranged left people to their own benefits.

For every party there is something to say. Currently the VVD has a lot to say. But the VVD is a bit as the US government. Will make rules and plans that only work in an utopian setting, not taking into account real life. This can be seen many times as they will rollback their own political decisions from the recent past (prior government configurations) that (how strange, who would have expected that) do not work.


At the moment , the ritual slaughter of Jews and Muslims is a discussion in the Netherlands. Any body who knows about how animals raised for consumption are treated, would agree with me that the last minute of the miserable life of such an animal is not really an issue to discuss.
First improve the general life of animals for consumption, then we can talk about ritual slaughter in the western world. It smells of hypocrisy to me.

 

[CanOWorms]

you can't, how do you know then what Dutch people are thinking? So I'm waiting for proof that the official policy is what you claim it to be

still waiting...

Are you seriously this stupid? I am offering my opinion.

In support of my opinion, I would offer at the minimum that the burqa policy is an attempt to force minorities to change their religion. Moreover, I offer Geert Wilders' beliefs and his influence on the government and the country as a whole.

The problem with your attitude is that nothing is wrong until millions are slaughtered. Why not stop what is going to happen before it happens? For example, Hitler or Churchill could have been stopped before they went on their genocide rampages. But Europeans tend not to do this. And that's extremely dangerous for a continent that suffers from mentally unbalanced leaders enacting a series of genocides.

 

[William Gaatjes]

FreeGeeks, please take some advice about canofworms :

 

[CanOWorms]

Anybody who will ever visit the Netherlands will see that the people with the Islamic faith and who work, are friendly kind people who are willing to fight against extremists. The men and the women who have education do not walk in traditional clothing. Here it is very open, foreign customs are accepted as long as the customs respect other people.

Who determines whether a custom respects other people? How is that determined? Can you list examples of customs that don't respect other people?

Is it acceptable for Dutch customs that don't respect other people to be accepted but foreign customs to not be accepted?

I myself would not be surprised that in the hypothetical situation where some extremist group would attack the Netherlands, all people no matter what religion will join and fight against the extremists. Of course, there are exceptions, but they do always exist.

I would be worried about who the locals deem to be extremists.

The PVV only could rise in power because of the simple fact that the left and far left politicians would not listen to the problems of the common people.

The social fabric is only going to get worse if you don't acknowledge the truth: The Dutch are accepting bigotry and racism. Trying to blame the rise of a Nazi-like political party because some other parties don't "listen to the problems of the common people" is just a deflection. People do not casually vote for a far-right, pro-genocide political party. You vote for it when you want ethnic cleansing.

These people need to be assimilated. You are not assimilated or integrated from the virtue of your birth, but your actions.

 

[CanOWorms]

FreeGeeks, please take some advice about canofworms :

I'm pretty sure the person who just said that he supports having an ultra far-right, white supremacist political party in government is the troll.

 

[freegeeks]

I'm pretty sure the person who just said that he supports having an ultra far-right, white supremacist political party in government is the troll.

this forum is in agreement that you are stupid troll
you are full of fail, lot's of big talk, zero on susbstance and providing proof

carry on my mentally deranged friend ...

fyi, the PVV is not in govt. , CDA and VVD are the govt parties

 

[William Gaatjes]

I will forget the sign and answer. You are an delusional idiot.

Nothing in my text has stated that i am what you claim i am. Thinking of white supremacy sites...

Where you not the one defending a white supremacy web site : The eu.times.net ?

I looked it up :

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2133447&highlight=eutimes

And yes it was you.


And to debunk you even more :
I did not ever vote for the PVV as i had already realized that there where enough concerned people that would vote for the PVV. Concerned people who have experienced negativity from people who exhibit anti -social behavior while abusing the Islam by claiming that they behave out of the name of Islam. I am not right or left. I use common sense. If any given person shows the same respect towards me and my customs as i do towards them, they can live a very happy free life with their religion. And yes, i am an Atheist. Although i can find myself in the ideas of Gandhi and the message of Jesus.



Now can you please stop making up lies and trying to play the man such as can be seen in some of the political campaigns of some US politicians ? Instead of staying on topic ?

 

[CanOWorms]

this forum is in agreement that you are stupid troll
you are full of fail, lot's of big talk, zero on susbstance and providing proof

The entire forum? Really?

I consider it a badge of honor to at least have the entire white supremacist contingent on this forum to be against me. It means that I'm doing something right.

 

[Double Trouble]

FreeGeeks, please take some advice about canofworms :

This. Please do not feed the nutcase troll, it only encourages his lunacy.

 

[CanOWorms]

I will forget the sign and answer. You are an delusional idiot.

Nothing in my text has stated that i am what you claim i am. Thinking of white supremacy sites...

What did I claim you to be?

Where you not the one defending a white supremacy web site : The eu.times.net ?

I looked it up :

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2133447&highlight=eutimes

And yes it was you.

LOL

I suppose reading comprehension is not your strong point. I can forgive you since you're European and Europe tends to have among the worst English education nowadays, especially with the nationalism surrounding their decaying languages.

However, in no way was I defending the web site. I was characterizing it as typical of European media. Indeed, that thread you linked to has me saying that "Culturally, the website is pure European. Most European media is crazy." Our argument wasn't even on the substance of the website, but where it's based.

And to debunk you even more :
I did not ever vote for the PVV as i had already realized that there where enough concerned people that would vote for the PVV. Concerned people who have experienced negativity from people who exhibit anti -social behavior while abusing the Islam by claiming that they behave out of the name of Islam. I am a not right or left. I use common sense. If any given person shows the same respect towards me and my customs as i do towards them, they can life a very happy free life with their religion.

I don't know what this is debunking. I did not claim that you voted for the PVV.

Now can you please stop making up lies and trying to play the man such as can be seen in some of the political campaigns of some US politicians ? Instead of staying on topic ?

It seems that you're the one making things up.

 

[CanOWorms]

This. Please do not feed the nutcase troll, it only encourages his lunacy.

I don't think being against genocide is lunacy. I would argue that being for genocide is lunacy.

 

[RabidMongoose]

These are interesting statements from the Dutch. I'm concerned about what the Dutch will do next. It's been a bit since the last European genocide and during that one, Dutch soldiers were cowards who abandoned their duties and allowed the genocide to happen. I think that this results in a higher likelihood of a genocide happening in the Netherlands.

Perhaps the US should place a carrier attack group off the coast of the Netherlands as a show of force that we're not going to tolerate another European genocide.

 

[RabidMongoose]

The social fabric is only going to get worse if you don't acknowledge the truth: The Dutch are accepting bigotry and racism. Trying to blame the rise of a Nazi-like political party because some other parties don't "listen to the problems of the common people" is just a deflection. People do not casually vote for a far-right, pro-genocide political party. You vote for it when you want ethnic cleansing.

These people need to be assimilated. You are not assimilated or integrated from the virtue of your birth, but your actions.

Maybe the 'problems of the common' people translates to 'racist platform.' I agree in that people just don't vote for a political party because 'parties don't listen to me,' it's more in that they agree more with the political party with a racist platform.

Perhaps a lot of Dutch people are now like many Americans in the US who are of European descent. They have de-assimilated themselves from Dutch society.

 

[Doppel]

It is common knowledge that seven of the top 10 in Hitler's close circle were Dutch. It it in their genes to hate and to kill and destroy. The windmills they originally built were envisioned as torture devices. The dykes built in support of "Verdrink de Mensen", or drowning of the peasants, and date back to the 15th century. Every 20 years or so the local magistrates would organize a local festival in late spring and unbeknownst to the local populous the dykes would be let loose to kill them en masse. Everyone knows this!