The Dunning-Kruger Effect is Everywhere Now!

Mai72

Lifer
Sep 12, 2012
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Definition of the Dunning-Kruger effect: In psychology, a cognitive bias whereby people with limited knowledge or competence in a given intellectual or social domain greatly overestimate their own knowledge or competence in that domain relative to objective criteria or to the performance of their peers or of people in general.

When I was getting gas I had the gas attendant give me a break down on COVID. How it's not a real virus. And then he switched gears, and told me with conviction that Joe Biden stole the election. It dawned on me that this man pumps gas for a living. I have nothing against that. He can do what he wants for a living. But, the fact is he is a gas attendant. He isn't a doctor. He isn't a politican, or a political analysis. He pumps gas. And where did he get his information? Fox News. The internet. Social Media: Facebook, Instagram, and yes TikTok. Do these people read? Ha. Yea right. Its not just this guy. Its the majority of the American public. Republican and Democrat. Christian or atheist. It doesn't matter. I do think atheist tend to know more about Christanity than most Christians. My point is people today overestimate what they truly know and understand. Which isn't much. But they watch a few YT videos on Covid. Or, watch videos on how Biden stole the election. And now they think they are experts.

These people also vote. Which is scary.
 

igor_kavinski

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In a way, we created these people. Information is power and they think they have power, no matter the source of the information. We have made good education unaffordable. The simple people in our lives, who do all the dirty work and let us live comfortably so we don't have to do menial jobs, they think we don't want them to succeed and get ahead. So they get knowledge and information from wherever they can and they try to succeed in their own way, by spreading disinformation. How many of us talk to these people in our daily lives and involve them in intelligent conversations? We are too busy for that and frankly, a lot of us would think it a total waste of time. And so the divide grows and grows until the world is messed up as it is today.
 
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Mai72

Lifer
Sep 12, 2012
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In a way, we created these people. Information is power and they think they have power, no matter the source of the information. We have made good education unaffordable. The simple people in our lives, who do all the dirty work and let us live comfortably so we don't have to do menial jobs, they think we don't want them to succeed and get ahead. So they get knowledge and information from wherever they can and they try to succeed in their own way, by spreading disinformation. How many of us talk to these people in our daily lives and involve them in intelligent conversations? We are too busy for that and frankly, a lot of us would think it a total waste of time. And so the divide grows and grows until the world is messed up as it is today.
Yea. Disinformation is also power. If you want to believe it, than its the truth. If you trily believe that Covid was fake, than you are going to believe it. if you believe that Democrats eat babies then you are going to believe it. It doesn't matter that actual experts put out information that counters the false claims. They are going to ignore it, and are going to dig in deeper into the misinformation. Religion is the same. Over 50% of Christians still beleive that Jesus is going to come back in their life time. This has been going on for the last 2000 years. What sin't suprising, its relative to the education level of the Christian. Christians who have dropped out of HS are the largest group at over 50%. It starts to decline until we get to college grads at 14% of Christians who believe that Jesus is still going to return in their lifetime. Lack of education has the same effect on how one views politics, science, medicine, etc. Add in social media and it gets very bad. We have a generation of people who believe that they are now the experts.

A good book on this is "When Prophecy Fails" by Henry Riecken, Leon Festinger, and Stanley Schachter. Its about the UFO cults in the 1950s. The people who were involved in these cults believed that America and other parts of the world were going to be wiped out by a major flood. And, flying saucers were their salvation. Many within the group sold their homes, quit their jobs, etc. When it never happened, what did they do? THEY DOUBLED DOWN. They just moved the date further. Many didn't leave the group, and they still stuck to their message. Think JWs, Trump supporrters, hardcore religious groups, and so on. Cognitive dissonance is in full effect.
 
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Torn Mind

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Nov 25, 2012
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If it's a matter of competence, the first matter to figure out is what exactly constitutes political incompetence.

Being delusional and consuming a narrative is not exactly the same as overestimating competency in a field.
 
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AdamK47

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
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Confirmation bias based on little to no factual information through social media exasperates this.
 
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BudAshes

Lifer
Jul 20, 2003
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Re-watched Sin City the other day and heard this quote.

"Power don't come from a badge or a gun. Power comes from lying. Lying big, and gettin' the whole damn world to play along with you. Once you got everybody agreeing with what they know in their hearts ain't true, you've got 'em by the balls."
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
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Once I was a nobody and had no idea I was. But then that told me because I didn’t know. Now I’m the greatest thing since sliced bread. Now you are the stupid asshole. I have God and Trump.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
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In a way, we created these people. Information is power and they think they have power, no matter the source of the information. We have made good education unaffordable. The simple people in our lives, who do all the dirty work and let us live comfortably so we don't have to do menial jobs, they think we don't want them to succeed and get ahead. So they get knowledge and information from wherever they can and they try to succeed in their own way, by spreading disinformation. How many of us talk to these people in our daily lives and involve them in intelligent conversations? We are too busy for that and frankly, a lot of us would think it a total waste of time. And so the divide grows and grows until the world is messed up as it is today.
We?? What’s this we shit? Who convinced idiots to vote for the like of Marjorie Taylor Greene? I had nothing to do with that. Nobody I know who is like minded politically did either.

I have a friend who after Charlottesville I tried to convince what an evil racist piece is shit Trump really is. I couldn’t do it. I reminded her with quotes exactly what he said and her final response was, “ he really didn’t mean it”

I gave up
 

Mai72

Lifer
Sep 12, 2012
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Once I was a nobody and had no idea I was. But then that told me because I didn’t know. Now I’m the greatest thing since sliced bread. Now you are the stupid asshole. I have God and Trump.
Hitler and Goebbels were able to lie to a country (Germany) and start WW2 in which millions of people died.
 

igor_kavinski

Diamond Member
Jul 27, 2020
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I have a friend who after Charlottesville I tried to convince what an evil racist piece is shit Trump really is. I couldn’t do it. I reminded her with quotes exactly what he said and her final response was, “ he really didn’t mean it”

I gave up
Good luck trying to change a woman's mind. From my experience, it's a futile exercise, unless the woman wants you in her bed.

Now if you tried to change a guy's mind, I would like to hear that story :)
 

igor_kavinski

Diamond Member
Jul 27, 2020
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Do you know, many women feel that exact same way about men?
Women can change a guy's mind with sex (actually right after, is when they softly whisper their demands into the guy's ear, acting all romantic and cutesy). A man trying to do that may not always be guaranteed success.
 

Captante

Lifer
Oct 20, 2003
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LOL
Do you know, many women feel that exact same way about men?

Actually I'd say the accurate phrase would be "never try to change a morons mind"..... and both sexes fully qualify as such at times. (same with ethnic identity/race)



Women can change a guy's mind with sex

Getting older as a man sucks in MANY ways including reduced sex-drive BUT having far greater control over the "dick for brains" factor isn't one of them.
 
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nakedfrog

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Apr 3, 2001
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Women can change a guy's mind with sex (actually right after, is when they softly whisper their demands into the guy's ear, acting all romantic and cutesy). A man trying to do that may not always be guaranteed success.
Thanks for the demonstration ;)
Actually I'd say the accurate phrase would be "never try to change a morons mind"..... and both sexes fully qualify as such at times. (same with ethnic identity/race)
No argument here!
 
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HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
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Women can change a guy's mind with sex (actually right after, is when they softly whisper their demands into the guy's ear, acting all romantic and cutesy). A man trying to do that may not always be guaranteed success.
We had sex in the past. Maybe that's why. We are still friends
 
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Fritzo

Lifer
Jan 3, 2001
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I have a hypothesis that a lot of people...especially lower income and undereducated people...feel so powerless and unnoticed in today's world that they're latching on to conspiracy theories/anti-science tropes for a feeling of superiority. They feel like they're finally more informed and more clever than others because they stumbled upon this "secret info" that the general population isn't smart enough to uncover. This feeling get addictive as it cancels out the feelings of meaninglessness in their actual lives.

Politicians are now feeding on these people. "You want to believe that stuff? HELL YEAH! THEN IT'S REAL IN MY BOOK! VOTE FOR ME!!!"
 

JWade

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
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www.heatware.com
It does take two to tango for a lot of this shit. A lot of people enjoy hating others for things beyond their control like their race, sex, ethnicity or religion.
you want to see hate, go to the politcal forum here. It is full of hate, you cant have a politics discussion without name calling, personal attacks, downright rudeness. It is rare to find someone to have a political discussion with and it not turn into personal attacks and name calling
 

PowerEngineer

Diamond Member
Oct 22, 2001
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In a way, we created these people. Information is power and they think they have power, no matter the source of the information. We have made good education unaffordable. The simple people in our lives, who do all the dirty work and let us live comfortably so we don't have to do menial jobs, they think we don't want them to succeed and get ahead. So they get knowledge and information from wherever they can and they try to succeed in their own way, by spreading disinformation. How many of us talk to these people in our daily lives and involve them in intelligent conversations? We are too busy for that and frankly, a lot of us would think it a total waste of time. And so the divide grows and grows until the world is messed up as it is today.
While I agree that the cost and availability of education directly threatens our foundational notion of equal opportunity in this country, I do not believe that it is the root of this problem. The root of this problem is the populist-pushed "free thinker" distrust of those among us who as a result of education and experience are experts in their fields.

Taking myself as an example, I've had the benefits of a good education; I'll even claim to be something of an expert in the field of electrical power engineering (what a surprise! 😁). But that good education hasn't made me an expert in any other field of knowledge. For instance, I do not believe I am anywhere close to knowledgeable enough to dispute medical experts on matters relating to my health (e.g. COVID and vaccines) -- I'd be a fool to think so. And yet, one doesn't have to search very hard these days to find someone spouting anti-vax and/or COVID hoax conspiracy drivel (many supposedly graduating college with some non-medical degree).

The truth is that we are all "people with limited knowledge or competence" in all but the handful of areas in which we have education or experience. It's best if we recognize the limits of our own knowledge and listen to those who know more than we do.
 

igor_kavinski

Diamond Member
Jul 27, 2020
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It's best if we recognize the limits of our own knowledge and listen to those who know more than we do.
I think some are using this to their advantage, by telling lies so often enough that it seems like the truth to people who recognize their limits of knowledge/intelligence and as a result, are keen to listen.
 

DAPUNISHER

Super Moderator and Elite Member
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Aug 22, 2001
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I have a hypothesis that a lot of people...especially lower income and undereducated people...feel so powerless and unnoticed in today's world that they're latching on to conspiracy theories/anti-science tropes for a feeling of superiority. They feel like they're finally more informed and more clever than others because they stumbled upon this "secret info" that the general population isn't smart enough to uncover. This feeling get addictive as it cancels out the feelings of meaninglessness in their actual lives.

Politicians are now feeding on these people. "You want to believe that stuff? HELL YEAH! THEN IT'S REAL IN MY BOOK! VOTE FOR ME!!!"
You are not the first to forward that hypothesis -

 

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