the dotard isnt pulling out of syria now. (now we are again)

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Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
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#26
You realize that Trump has shifted and Bolton works for him, or is Trump so weak of mind and character that Bolton mind controls him?

Trump will have us staying for as long as it takes, AKA forever. My how great a brain that takes.
Trump talks shit, then backs away from it. UC blames Bolton, defends Trump's abandoned "decision".

Which would tend to imply that the stable genius somehow found reason to reconsider. Not that he could have been wrong in the first place. Heavens no.
 
Jan 28, 2002
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#27
You do know that if Trump was a General he would have McAurthur and Patton look like school children!
In fact I would guess that General Trump would be called the worlds greatest General ever!!!
MAKE America Great Again!!

What are you into, like Drano enemas or something now?
 

bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
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#28
In another thread I said I would be shocked if Trump actually pulled out. I don't believe presidents control our foreign policy much anymore. It is apparent that Trump wants out and it is also apparent that powerful non-elected actors will never allow it to happen. With regards to Middle East wars, there appears to be no President capable of getting us out. We have really gotten a bang for our trillions of dollars haven't we? What would our infrastructure look like today if those trillions of dollars had been spent on that instead? I think the game here is to delay Trump from withdrawing long enough to impeach/remove him and then get a President who will escalate. If I had to make a bet, it would be that Assad will be eventually taken down and Saudi Arabia will get an oil pipe-line through Syria. If that happens, American forces will remain in Syria for the rest of my life.

Props to journalist William Arkin who quit NBC news with this resignation memo:

When the attacks of 9/11 came, I was called back to NBC. I spent weeks on and off the air talking about al Qaeda and the various wars we were rushing into, arguing that airpower and drones would be the centerpiece not troops. In the new martial environment where only one war cry was sanctioned I was out of sync then as well. I retreated somewhat to writing a column for the Los Angeles Times, but even there I had to fight editors who couldn’t believe that there would be a war in Iraq. And I spoke up about the absence of any sort of strategy for actually defeating terrorism, annoying the increasing gaggles of those who seemed to accept that a state of perpetual war was a necessity.
I thought then that there was great danger in the embrace of process and officialdom over values and public longing, and I wrote about the increasing power of the national security community. Long before Trump and “deep state” became an expression, I produced one ginormous investigation — Top Secret America — for the Washington Post and I wrote a nasty book — American Coup — about the creeping fascism of homeland security.

Looking back now they were both harbingers for what President Obama (and then Trump) faced in terms of largely failing to make enduring change.

I find it disheartening that we do not report the failures of the generals and national security leaders. I find it shocking that we essentially condone continued American bumbling in the Middle East and now Africa through our ho-hum reporting."
There is not a soul in Washington who can say that they have won or stopped any conflict. And though there might be the beloved perfumed princes in the form of the Petraeus' and Wes Clarks', or the so-called warrior monks like Mattis and McMaster, we've had more than a generation of national security leaders who sadly and fraudulently have done little of consequence. And yet we (and others) embrace them, even the highly partisan formers who masquerade as "analysts". We do so ignoring the empirical truth of what they have wrought: There is not one county in the Middle East that is safer today than it was 18 years ago.
I’d argue that under Trump, the national security establishment not only hasn’t missed a beat but indeed has gained dangerous strength. Now it is ever more autonomous and practically impervious to criticism. I’d also argue, ever so gingerly, that NBC has become somewhat lost in its own verve, proxies of boring moderation and conventional wisdom, defender of the government against Trump, cheerleader for open and subtle threat mongering, in love with procedure and protocol over all else (including results). I accept that there’s a lot to report here, but I’m more worried about how much we are missing. Hence my desire to take a step back and think why so little changes with regard to America’s wars.
For me I realized how out of step I was when I looked at Trump’s various bumbling intuitions: his desire to improve relations with Russia, to denuclearize North Korea, to get out of the Middle East, to question why we are fighting in Africa, even in his attacks on the intelligence community and the FBI. Of course he is an ignorant and incompetent impostor. And yet I’m alarmed at how quick NBC is to mechanically argue the contrary, to be in favor of policies that just spell more conflict and more war. Really? We shouldn’t get out Syria? We shouldn’t go for the bold move of denuclearizing the Korean peninsula? Even on Russia, though we should be concerned about the brittleness of our democracy that it is so vulnerable to manipulation, do we really yearn for the Cold War? And don’t even get me started with the FBI: What? We now lionize this historically destructive institution?
Additional props to Elizabeth Warren for coming out in support of Syria withdrawal this week. It is almost certainly a lost cause but it is appreciated.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
48,370
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#29
Trump talks shit, then backs away from it. UC blames Bolton, defends Trump's abandoned "decision".

Which would tend to imply that the stable genius somehow found reason to reconsider. Not that he could have been wrong in the first place. Heavens no.
I noticed that as well, but we expected it, didn't we?
 
Jul 11, 2001
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#30
It's like I said, you can't believe a fucking thing he says. Policy is something he's incapable of managing. He can't be bothered to read his briefings. He's all about sound bites, with bilateral gesticulations when the cameras are rolling. There is no administration. In fact Trump did not expect to win, he had no plan. Did you expect things to be better than this? I did not.
 
Last edited:
Mar 25, 2001
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#32
Trump talks shit, then backs away from it. UC blames Bolton, defends Trump's abandoned "decision".

Which would tend to imply that the stable genius somehow found reason to reconsider. Not that he could have been wrong in the first place. Heavens no.
I noticed that as well, but we expected it, didn't we?
The buck certainly stops at Trump and it’s his about face and any blood for staying will be on his hands, but did you even bother to open up the link in the OP? First two paragraphs:

White House national security adviser John Bolton on Sunday outlined conditions for a U.S. troop departure from Syria that appeared to contradict President Trump’s insistence less than a month ago that the withdrawal would be immediate and without conditions.​
Speaking during a visit to Israel, Bolton said that certain “objectives” must be achieved before a pullout could take place. “The timetable flows from the policy decisions that we need to implement.”​
 

GodisanAtheist

Golden Member
Nov 16, 2006
1,491
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#33
The buck certainly stops at Trump and it’s his about face and any blood for staying will be on his hands, but did you even bother to open up the link in the OP? First two paragraphs:

White House national security adviser John Bolton on Sunday outlined conditions for a U.S. troop departure from Syria that appeared to contradict President Trump’s insistence less than a month ago that the withdrawal would be immediate and without conditions.​
Speaking during a visit to Israel, Bolton said that certain “objectives” must be achieved before a pullout could take place. “The timetable flows from the policy decisions that we need to implement.”​
- Thing with this Admin is you don't know if John Bolton is acting on established policy or if he's trying to establish policy by going public and hoping Trump follows. Even his wording is ambiguous " policy decisions that we need to impliment" suggesting these decisions have not been finalized yet.

No way Bolton was happy with the unconditional withdrawal language the president used and might be trying to strong arm things in his favor.

It's a bold move Cotton, let's see how that works out for him...
 
Jun 23, 2004
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#34
Can you imagine the mental gymnastics needed to support Trump after he repeatedly demonstrates how completely not in control he is?
None what so ever. They're 100% ignorant of what is occurring. Fox will shield them by not highlighting and/or focusing on it. They'll never know he promises everything to everyone and waffles without substance. They think he's some god damn hero for being a rude, crass, POS. Trump is celebrated amongst his base.

Thankfully, the things that make Trump... Trump, will wipe out his support among anyone beyond the core. To that end, winning an election as an incumbent is nearly impossible.
 

Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
53,631
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#35
The buck certainly stops at Trump and it’s his about face and any blood for staying will be on his hands, but did you even bother to open up the link in the OP? First two paragraphs:

White House national security adviser John Bolton on Sunday outlined conditions for a U.S. troop departure from Syria that appeared to contradict President Trump’s insistence less than a month ago that the withdrawal would be immediate and without conditions.​
Speaking during a visit to Israel, Bolton said that certain “objectives” must be achieved before a pullout could take place. “The timetable flows from the policy decisions that we need to implement.”​
Fluff it up, cowboy. Trump's reversal is to head off rebuke from the Senate-

https://thehill.com/blogs/floor-action/defense/423898-senate-poised-to-rebut-trump-on-syria
 
Dec 7, 2004
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#36
Even a stopped clock is right twice a day. Syria is the one place we SHOULD be right now. If for no other reason than the Kurds have helped us take down ISIS, and if we leave their cheese out in the wind Erdogan will slaughter then. Have fun finding local allies for the next terrorist goon squad if that happens.
 
Sep 5, 2000
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#37
Even a stopped clock is right twice a day. Syria is the one place we SHOULD be right now. If for no other reason than the Kurds have helped us take down ISIS, and if we leave their cheese out in the wind Erdogan will slaughter then. Have fun finding local allies for the next terrorist goon squad if that happens.
dotard dont care
 
Feb 24, 2009
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#38
Feb 24, 2009
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#39
- Thing with this Admin is you don't know if John Bolton is acting on established policy or if he's trying to establish policy by going public and hoping Trump follows. Even his wording is ambiguous " policy decisions that we need to impliment" suggesting these decisions have not been finalized yet.

No way Bolton was happy with the unconditional withdrawal language the president used and might be trying to strong arm things in his favor.

It's a bold move Cotton, let's see how that works out for him...
Well Jarad should be on top of all this right? Jarad...Jarad.... By the way what ever happened to Jarad. I guess he's working extra hard on this situation or maybe he's just spending his time trying to figure out how to stay out of jail.
 
Feb 6, 2002
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#40
but...but...Trump said his position in Syria that he pulling out all troops immediately hasn't changed. Ok folks, which is it??
 

Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
53,631
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#41
Feb 23, 2005
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#42
I thought you guys would be happy about this?
 
Jun 23, 2004
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#45
I thought you guys would be happy about this?
We'd be happy with a President that knew WTF he was doing. Or at least listened to those who do.

Happy? We won't get the trust of the Kurds back. We won't get General Mattis back. One does not simply unring this bell, but you jest. That isn't his intention in the first place. Trump is simply a liar who promises everything to everyone. Do not trust a word he says for they are fickle.

What "we" want is a stable situation in Syria. What we will get is probably something far worse.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
64,280
900
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#47
Isn't there a commonly used term for pulling out and going back in, pulling out and going back in, pulling out and going back in?
 
Oct 20, 2014
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#48
Well, the big win here is that it got Mattis out of the Pentagon so that Trump could roll in yet another monied CEO stooge into a position that puts him in control of the giant contracts that he used to bid for.

Because, totally not corrupt.
To Trump the lobbyists and stooges aren't the swamp; the swamp is the furloughed workers and the ones working without a paycheck.
 

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