The distortion /clipping blows speakers myth settled once and for all

[glen]

At 05:33 AM 3/17/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>Maybe the biggest myth in audio is that lower powered amps distort and clip
>and magically blow speakers faster than high powered ones.
>Where does this idea come from and is there any truth to it?
>
>
>Peace,
>Glen

Hello Glen,
The first myth here is that distortion and clipping can damage a speaker.
This is nonsense... we have articles on this subject at: www.autosound2000.com

Only humans care about distortion... how in the heck could a speaker know
the difference between distortion, clipping, etc.? A speaker is just a coil
of wire in a magnet...

I'm not sure where the myth began.... probably with some salesperson trying
to earn a larger commission... I'll ask RC for comment.
Dave


David Navone
Navone Engineering, Inc.
4119 Coronado Avenue, Suite 4
Stockton, CA 95204-2336
Phone Toll Free 800-669-****
Phone 209-465-****
FAX 209-465-****
e-Mail: dnavone@davidnavone.com

cc: Vicki Helsby, Sales Manager

 

[xirtam]

Do I need to post a pic to show that clipping can damage a speaker?

 

[StageLeft]

And so it begins!

 

[glen]

Originally posted by: xirtam
Do I need to post a pic to show that clipping can damage a speaker?

You will have to come up with someone with more name recognition and credibility than David Navone or Tom Nousaine.

 

[silverpig]

How do you blow speakers then?

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: silverpig
How do you blow speakers then?

Too much power to them?

 

[GasX]

so, www.autosound2000.com is the definitive source for the truth regarding this topic?

It's a crap site, with a crap design and crap content.

 

[EvilYoda]

Originally posted by: Mwilding
so, www.autosound2000.com is the definitive source for the truth regarding this topic?

It's a crap site, with a crap design and crap content.

Don't hold yourself back now Mwilding, really tell us how you feel.

 

[xirtam]

Originally posted by: glen

Originally posted by: xirtam
Do I need to post a pic to show that clipping can damage a speaker?

You will have to come up with someone with more name recognition and credibility than David Navone or Tom Nousaine.

Screw name recognition...

Now which speaker were you wondering about?

 

[glen]

Originally posted by: Mwilding
so, www.autosound2000.com is the definitive source for the truth regarding this topic?

It's a crap site, with a crap design and crap content.

Basically yes.
We can't exactly "prove" anything debating it here in the forums.
We can get someone widely recognized as an expert to debunk it.
Everyone involved enough in audio to have heard the myth also knows Tom Nousaine and David Navone.
I posted Tom's response a while ago in a different thread.

 

[GasX]

Instead of posting the opion of a reputed expert (I have not heard of him), why don't you post some proof.

You claim it is a myth, the burden is on you.

 

[glen]

Originally posted by: Mwilding
Instead of posting the opion of a reputed expert (I have not heard of him), why don't you post some proof.

You claim it is a myth, the burden is on you.

I thought everyone had heard of him, that is why I choose to get his opinion.
Here is his bio.
I would find it unusual if anyone even remotely interested in audio, especially car audio had not heard of him.
He is the GURU of car audio along with Richard Clark.
http://www.autosound2000.com/aboutus.html

 

[GasX]

Originally posted by: glen

Originally posted by: Mwilding
Instead of posting the opion of a reputed expert (I have not heard of him), why don't you post some proof.

You claim it is a myth, the burden is on you.

I thought everyone had heard of him, that is why I choose to get his opinion.
Here is his bio.
I would find it unusual if anyone even remotely interested in audio, especially car audio had not heard of him.
He is the GURU of car audio along with Richard Clark.
http://www.autosound2000.com/aboutus.html

And that proves what about clipping and underpowered amps?

 

[Spac3d]

Clipping and underpowering a sub are 2 very different things. Underpowering a sub does not make it blow, clipping does.

 

[Demon-Xanth]

Where I can see distortion and clipping blowing a speaker is if the speaker is doing the distorting and clipping (ie: getting hammered all the way out and in)

 

[NewSc2]

the point is that it's car audio

anybody that goes into a vehicle with many objects in the way, off-center listening and much ambient noise to listen to audiophile sound needs to figure out their priorities

 

[HomeBrewerDude]

Did i miss something, or did your guru fail to answer the second part of the question. I.e., Is a low powered amp more likely to blow a speaker than a high powered amp?

 

[Rastus]

Silly people, everyone knows it's country music that blows speakers.

edit: It's the twang.

 

[chiwawa626]

Wheres my buddy shockwave ?

thx for the link glen

 

[Spac3d]

Originally posted by: NewSc2
the point is that it's car audio

anybody that goes into a vehicle with many objects in the way, off-center listening and much ambient noise to listen to audiophile sound needs to figure out their priorities

You obviously have not been into a well balanced and tuned car. I know I listed to a lot more music in my car than I do in my house, it is more important to me to have good sound in my car.

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: Spac3d

Originally posted by: NewSc2
the point is that it's car audio

anybody that goes into a vehicle with many objects in the way, off-center listening and much ambient noise to listen to audiophile sound needs to figure out their priorities

You obviously have not been into a well balanced and tuned car. I know I listed to a lot more music in my car than I do in my house, it is more important to me to have good sound in my car.

Mark Levinson and Lexus

 

[jteef]

he didn't answer the question. Where can I buy some of these magic speakers that defy the conservation of energy laws.

 

[Woodchuck2000]

As I understand it, passing a square wave AC signal through a speaker cone can damage it. If you think about the motion induced by a sine wave in a speaker cone, it's smoothly oscillating about the mean point. If you put a square wave through it, it jerks the cone backwards and forwards. When a signal coming out of an amp clips, a square wave is produced. Hence if you overdrive an amplifier, you'll get a square wave out and could damage the speaker.

 

[Spac3d]

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: Spac3d

Originally posted by: NewSc2
the point is that it's car audio

anybody that goes into a vehicle with many objects in the way, off-center listening and much ambient noise to listen to audiophile sound needs to figure out their priorities

You obviously have not been into a well balanced and tuned car. I know I listed to a lot more music in my car than I do in my house, it is more important to me to have good sound in my car.

Mark Levinson and Lexus

I wanted my parents to get Mark Levinson in both of the Lexus' they got ... but they don't need that when they listen to mainly AM radio

Oh well, one of the cars lease is up in December ... another shot for Mark Levinson! Who hoo!

 

[thomsbrain]

Originally posted by: Woodchuck2000
As I understand it, passing a square wave AC signal through a speaker cone can damage it. If you think about the motion induced by a sine wave in a speaker cone, it's smoothly oscillating about the mean point. If you put a square wave through it, it jerks the cone backwards and forwards. When a signal coming out of an amp clips, a square wave is produced. Hence if you overdrive an amplifier, you'll get a square wave out and could damage the speaker.

Oh for christ sake. Old Nintendo games used to use square waves all the time, and no one's TV speakers blew up. And if you run a Nintendo sound through your stereo, that won't blow up either. In fact, I saw an interactive museum exhibit once where you could feed a subwoofer a number of different frequencies in both square and a sine waves, and it had been running day in and day out for years.

As posted in last night's thread, I routinely overdrive the power amp section of both my tube and solid state amplifers when playing guitar, and have never damaged a speaker, despite pumping out a crapload more distortion than you would get out of a pro audio amplifer. This includes running my distorted signal through (you guessed it) a subwoofer (I use a sub to extend my low range). No problems whatsoever.