The Derek Chauvin / George Floyd Trial

[Vic]

Imagine that you were in hell and the door to heaven has socialism written on it. Now imagine the hell you were in was the product of a concept of individualism you had been taught to regard as sacred and that the enemy of that sacred belief was that very socialism that could free you from your prison. Can you see that in such a prison you would never be able to escape because your worst enemy was your only real friend? Every time escape was offered you, you would react with panic and fear and hatred of the only way you could ever escape. Your only hope would be to die to everything you believe, to remember how you were made to suffer as a child having at it's very heart the desire for socialism. All socialism is is the love we feel for God and the love he feels for us, the thing you are terrified to feel. The very last time you felt real love you were killed. I'm so sorry but we all went through it. The truth is always 180 degrees from where we know how to look. No exist is possible until you realize there is none you can possibly imagine.

The very first question posed in the Bible is, "Am I my brother's keeper?" And if a person manages to read the rest and comes to the end and does not realize that God's answer to that question was (and is) a resounding YES!, then that person is not a Christian. Period. It doesn't matter how often they go to church and/or call upon God. They just aren't.

 

[dank69]

Imagine that you were in hell and the door to heaven has socialism written on it. Now imagine the hell you were in was the product of a concept of individualism you had been taught to regard as sacred and that the enemy of that sacred belief was that very socialism that could free you from your prison. Can you see that in such a prison you would never be able to escape because your worst enemy was your only real friend? Every time escape was offered you, you would react with panic and fear and hatred of the only way you could ever escape. Your only hope would be to die to everything you believe, to remember how you were made to suffer as a child having at it's very heart the desire for socialism. All socialism is is the love we feel for God and the love he feels for us, the thing you are terrified to feel. The very last time you felt real love you were killed. I'm so sorry but we all went through it. The truth is always 180 degrees from where we know how to look. No exist is possible until you realize there is none you can possibly imagine.

And then imagine that what is behind that door isn't even socialism but rather intelligent social safety nets and well-thought-out social investments.

 

[HomerJS]

I just found article about the 7 main tenets of Marxism. I'm waiting to see which one of these was promoted by BLM. You could make a obscure reference to #7 but it's a real stretch. A lot worse things with this country we need to address first before we get overrun by Marxism and Sharia Law. Remember that boogeyman? Conservatives invent a new one every year.

7 Basic Premises of Marxism | Communist Thought

The seven basic premises of Marxism are as follows: 1. Dialectical Materialism 2. Historical Materialism 3. Stages of History 4. Labour theory 5. Class Struggle 6. Socialist Society 7. Withering Away of the State. 1. Dialectical Materialism: The idea of dialectical materialism is one term which...

www.yourarticlelibrary.com

 

[nickqt]

I just found article about the 7 main tenets of Marxism. I'm waiting to see which one of these was promoted by BLM. You could make a obscure reference to #7 but it's a real stretch. A lot worse things with this country we need to address first before we get overrun by Marxism and Sharia Law. Remember that boogeyman? Conservatives invent a new one every year.

7 Basic Premises of Marxism | Communist Thought

The seven basic premises of Marxism are as follows: 1. Dialectical Materialism 2. Historical Materialism 3. Stages of History 4. Labour theory 5. Class Struggle 6. Socialist Society 7. Withering Away of the State. 1. Dialectical Materialism: The idea of dialectical materialism is one term which...

www.yourarticlelibrary.com

They don't invent a new boogieman every year.

They simply take out of mothballs a previously used boogieman and place it back into their "scare our voters" campaign they use every voting cycle.

And when that boogieman yet again shows itself to be a fraudulent construct of conservative fear and paranoia, they'll mothball it for a bit, until they can bring it out to scare their voters with it later down the line.

Rinse repeat.

 

[Vic]

It's coded racist BS. Black people, other minorities, and even liberals call for their Constitutional rights, and they're 'marxists' or 'socialists.' But white Republicans do the exact same and they're 'patriots.'
While I just want everyone to enjoy the same rights and freedoms as everyone else, just like the Constitution is supposed to guarantee.
Floyd had his rights (along with his life) taken from him by an agent of the government of the State of Minnesota. That govt agent chose to murder Floyd purely for his own convenience and because he knew he could get away it. Because every govt seeks to expand its powers, and the ability to kill its own citizens arbitrarily and with impunity is the greatest power of all. One would think that 'patriotic freedom loving small govt strict constitutionalist' conservatives would know this, and would be calling for Chauvin's conviction for his crime, in order to protect their own rights and freedoms from the abuse of govt power. The reason they don't is because they don't believe that the same thing could happen to them. And the reason they believe that (even though it isn't true) is the obvious one.
And this, folks, is how all of our rights and freedoms are eroded. This is a threat to all of our freedoms greater than any marxism.

 

[HumblePie]

Vic, you seem to unaware of what political constructs and definitions are.

LEFT-WING

Left-wing politics - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The base definition of left-wing ideology is that all people are all exactly equal.

RIGHT-WING

Right-wing politics - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Right wing is the exact opposite. That all people are not equal.

Communism and socialism are government structural "end-goals" at realizing the left-wing ideology of making everyone exactly equal. It is equity in basis. Equity is equality in everything. Equality of opportunity is NOT equity. Marxism is a method system to bring about socialism and communism. There are certainly other ways to do so, but since those other ways tend to be similar it is easy to lump it all together these days as Marxist.

Marxism - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Since Marxism is a method of conversion from a one government structure to the structure of socialism and then communism, any agency that attempts to reach those outcomes in a society with a different governmental structure is by nature defined as Marxist when basing the change through the lens of an oppressed fighting an oppressor for equity. For example, the changes to socialism in some nordic countries was not done through a Marxism movement. There has to be a struggle movement and if there isn't one it isn't orthodox Marxism. Entities seeking to create a struggle or pursue one for the expressed purpose of leading to socialism are by definition Marxist. Hence BLM is Marxist. It's a simple definition to apply. BLM sees the classes not as mostly socio-economic as orthodox Marxism is typically rooted in, but along racial categorical divisions. If BLM just sought ONLY equal administration of the current legal system regardless of race then they wouldn't be Marxist. That is not their only stated goal. Where I linked above one other goal of seeking medicare for all for racial justice is legit Marxism. That is just one example. There are others. Either way this is way off topic of the current topic of the Chauvin case. If you are going to troll, name call, and project positions on others you'd like them to hold then I'm done. If you want a serious conversation about what Marxism is or isn't and further details of BLM being viewed by almost everyone as a Marxist organization, I am happy to have those conversations in PMs or another thread.

 

[nakedfrog]

It's like McCarthy seeing commies everywhere, isn't it?

 

[HumblePie]

It's like McCarthy seeing commies everywhere, isn't it?

Any entity advocating for socialism or communism (even constructs) through struggle of classes is Marxism. Period. Sorry you don't like the definition as has been defined before you were born. A communist doesn't have to be a Marxist either. I already stated that.

 

[Vic]

Lol at the idea that left-wing and right-wing must be completely black-and-white. Seriously, lol.
In a country where the right-wing believes in and fights for inequality from birth, then the belief in equality of opportunity for all becomes very much left-wing.

 

[Vic]

Any entity advocating for socialism or communism (even constructs) through struggle of classes is Marxism. Period. Sorry you don't like the definition as has been defined before you were born. A communist doesn't have to be a Marxist either. I already state that.

Still waiting on you to actually quote Marx on any of this. I mean FFS you're taking ideas that have existed long before Marx was born and calling them Marxism. You realize that, yes?

 

[nickqt]

It's like McCarthy seeing commies everywhere, isn't it?

More like, seeing justified homicides everywhere, as long as it's a minority being killed. But don't take my word for it, just read our white supremacists' posts.

 

[MrSquished]

White supremacist righties conflate justice, both criminal and economic, with Marxism. Like I said, until BLM starts promoting a command economy, it's just propaganda.

 

[Viper1j]

I'm kinda assuming the following based on previous events
Chauvin gets off
Chauvin gets hired by a small police department elsewhere and gets a nice side hustle doing interviews with right wing outlets. Attends rallies and stuff and has his hand shaken.

OR

Leaving one of his "side hustles" one night, he catches a .224 magnum from a sniper with a Weatherby Mark V® with a 20x sniper-scope.



Remember Dallas?

 

[killster1]

More like, seeing justified homicides everywhere, as long as it's a minority being killed. But don't take my word for it, just read our white supremacists' posts.

Whats strange is white people are shot the most by police.. why is it people dont think other races get killed too? the police just suck outright doesnt matter what race you are. Im white and have had the police pull guns on me MANY MANY Times. (prob would have been blown away if i didnt comply and tried to dance around saying you cant do that )

People shot to death by U.S. police, by race 2024| Statista

The trend of fatal police shootings in the U.S. seems to only be increasing each year, with Black civilians having the highest rates of being killed by police.

www.statista.com

but when you look at

Arrests by offense, age, and race

it shows murder rate teh same for black and white arrests.

here is another who kills the police by race of black and white

There were 511 officers killed in felonious incidents and 540 offenders from 2004 to 2013, according to FBI reports. Among the total offenders, 52 percent were white, and 43 percent were black.

The FBI provided The Fact Checker a detailed database of victim officers and offenders in felonious incidents, accidental deaths and assaults with injury, from the early 1980s.
From 1980 to 2013, there were 2,269 officers killed in felonious incidents, and 2,896 offenders. The racial breakdown of offenders over the 33-year period was on par with the 10-year period: 52 percent were white, and 41 percent were black.
..

 

[brycejones]

Whats strange is white people are shot the most by police.. why is it people dont think other races get killed too? the police just suck outright doesnt matter what race you are. Im white and have had the police pull guns on me MANY MANY Times.
..

Strawman, dishonest presentation of the stats, and an unbelievable claim.

we have a trifecta of dishonesty from killster1.

 

[killster1]

Strawman, dishonest presentation of the stats, and an unbelievable claim.

we have a trifecta of dishonesty from killster1.

did i make something up? just used google and chose the first 3 and looked at them. i guess they make up the data right? Love how facts are called false but wait how are they called facts then?

you think the police never pulled guns on me and forced me to lay on my belly on the concrete with a shotgun 6" from my head? Guess you are the one grasping at straws , when first hand testimony is disputed and said to be unbelievable.. yup we already know what you think, only one race gets mistreated by the police right? Only one race kills the police? Police dont have power trips knees on the necks of white people? 10000% wrong (tho drugs are usually involved either way)

 

[Jaskalas]

The "I can't breath" statement is not going to help the prosecution either way, but not for the reasons the attorney on the radio said. It won't help because Floyd said that exact thing at least 5 times before the officers kneeled on him. The defense is going to argue that they had no reason to take it seriously.

Constricting and crushing a person until they die is murder. It is no less direct cause and effect as shooting or stabbing.

That is very obviously what occurred here. An unarmed and subdued person, handcuffed and on the ground, was then viciously snuffed out by a group of murderous thugs. If he was in medical distress, why did they contribute to his death as opposed to seeking medical assistance? They in fact actively prevented medical assistance as the EMT on scene testified. Close closed. I am pissed.

 

[killster1]

Constricting and crushing a person until they die is murder. It is no less direct cause and effect as shooting or stabbing.

That is very obviously what occurred here. An unarmed and subdued person, handcuffed and on the ground, was then viciously snuffed out by a group of murderous thugs. If he was in medical distress, why did they contribute to his death as opposed to seeking medical assistance? They in fact actively prevented medical assistance as the EMT on scene testified. Close closed. I am pissed.

how can you say obviously unless are the one performing the autopsy? i think its atrocious, he was already in cuffs he wasnt trying to run but i dont know what killed him unless i do the autopsy myself, i will only know what someone else has portrayed to me which is not me knowing anything just assuming taking their word on it.

 

[nickqt]

Whats strange is white people are shot the most by police.. why is it people dont think other races get killed too? the police just suck outright doesnt matter what race you are. Im white and have had the police pull guns on me MANY MANY Times. (prob would have been blown away if i didnt comply and tried to dance around saying you cant do that )

People shot to death by U.S. police, by race 2024| Statista

The trend of fatal police shootings in the U.S. seems to only be increasing each year, with Black civilians having the highest rates of being killed by police.

www.statista.com

but when you look at

Arrests by offense, age, and race

it shows murder rate teh same for black and white arrests.

here is another who kills the police by race of black and white

There were 511 officers killed in felonious incidents and 540 offenders from 2004 to 2013, according to FBI reports. Among the total offenders, 52 percent were white, and 43 percent were black.

The FBI provided The Fact Checker a detailed database of victim officers and offenders in felonious incidents, accidental deaths and assaults with injury, from the early 1980s.
From 1980 to 2013, there were 2,269 officers killed in felonious incidents, and 2,896 offenders. The racial breakdown of offenders over the 33-year period was on par with the 10-year period: 52 percent were white, and 41 percent were black.
..

I wasn't addressing you, but it's hilarious that you responded to me. Nice own goal, champ.

Additionally, nothing you said is relevant to what I said, not that I expect someone like you to care about anything other than, "white people get killed, why should black people care that they're getting killed too" or whatever nonsense passes as reasoned thought in your brain.

Thanks for self-identifying though!

 

[killster1]

I wasn't addressing you, but it's hilarious that you responded to me. Nice own goal, champ.

Additionally, nothing you said is relevant to what I said, not that I expect someone like you to care about anything other than, "white people get killed, why should black people care that they're getting killed too" or whatever nonsense passes as reasoned thought in your brain.

Thanks for self-identifying though!

ur right i don't know who McCarthy is, i don't know what white supremacists posts you are talking about and of course you could not have been talking to me since my first post in this thread was replying yours. i never said anything is OK i just said loads of people are dying and the police suck. You said its justified if its minority shooting.. /eye roll... white people are the minority where I live 😉

 

[Vic]

Whats strange is white people are shot the most by police.. why is it people dont think other races get killed too? the police just suck outright doesnt matter what race you are. Im white and have had the police pull guns on me MANY MANY Times. (prob would have been blown away if i didnt comply and tried to dance around saying you cant do that )

People shot to death by U.S. police, by race 2024| Statista

The trend of fatal police shootings in the U.S. seems to only be increasing each year, with Black civilians having the highest rates of being killed by police.

www.statista.com

but when you look at

Arrests by offense, age, and race

it shows murder rate teh same for black and white arrests.

here is another who kills the police by race of black and white

There were 511 officers killed in felonious incidents and 540 offenders from 2004 to 2013, according to FBI reports. Among the total offenders, 52 percent were white, and 43 percent were black.

The FBI provided The Fact Checker a detailed database of victim officers and offenders in felonious incidents, accidental deaths and assaults with injury, from the early 1980s.
From 1980 to 2013, there were 2,269 officers killed in felonious incidents, and 2,896 offenders. The racial breakdown of offenders over the 33-year period was on par with the 10-year period: 52 percent were white, and 41 percent were black.
..

How many of those involved police kneeling on the suspect's neck for 9 minutes with the whole thing caught on video?
To be clear, I don't care what color their skin is, police should not be murdering suspects who are no longer resisting. Much less smiling for the camera while they do it. That's a level of oppressive big govt as bad as any communism, but I guess that doesn't bother you.

 

[killster1]

How many of those involved police kneeling on the suspect's neck for 9 minutes with the whole thing caught on video?
To be clear, I don't care what color their skin is, police should not be murdering suspects who are no longer resisting. Much less smiling for the camera while they do it. That's a level of oppressive big govt as bad as any communism, because I guess that doesn't bother you.

five seconds of searching lead to this

Disturbing video shows Dallas officers joking as they restrain man who died

Tony Timpa yelled "You're gonna kill me!" and "Help me!" as he was restrained by a Dallas officer for nearly 14 minutes

www.cbsnews.com

Man dies after police kneel on his neck for nearly 5 minutes, family says in wrongful death claim | CNN

A 30-year-old Northern California man undergoing a mental health episode died days after police officers kneeled on the back of his neck for nearly five minutes to subdue him, lawyers for his family said.

www.cnn.com

so i wonder what a whole min of searching might find. wait wait its prob just made up right? it only happens to minorities!

 

[Vic]

True story: last summer I was enrolling my young daughter at her new school (not public), touring the classrooms, and I picked up the 5th grade social studies textbook and started thumbing the pages. The textbook was probably at least 10 years old, but a couple pictures near the front caught my eye. It was at the start of the chapter discussing the different types of govts. To illustrate a democracy, they showed a picture of a large crowd of people protesting in front of the US Capitol. And to illustrate an authoritarian govt, they showed a picture from Tiananmen Square, with 4 Chinese police officers on top of a protester, one of them with his knee on the protester's neck.
Thank you, Republicans, for turning America into fucking communist China.

 

[Vic]

five seconds of searching lead to this

Disturbing video shows Dallas officers joking as they restrain man who died

Tony Timpa yelled "You're gonna kill me!" and "Help me!" as he was restrained by a Dallas officer for nearly 14 minutes

www.cbsnews.com

Man dies after police kneel on his neck for nearly 5 minutes, family says in wrongful death claim | CNN

A 30-year-old Northern California man undergoing a mental health episode died days after police officers kneeled on the back of his neck for nearly five minutes to subdue him, lawyers for his family said.

www.cnn.com

so i wonder what a whole min of searching might find. wait wait its prob just made up right? it only happens to minorities!

"To be clear, I don't care what color their skin is, police should not be murdering suspects who are no longer resisting. Much less smiling for the camera while they do it. That's a level of oppressive big govt as bad as any communism, but I guess that doesn't bother you."

What part of that was unclear to you? You're not going to see me going around excusing and apologizing for something like this, when it happens to black people, because hey it happens to white people too. Because it's wrong either way.

 

[killster1]

"To be clear, I don't care what color their skin is, police should not be murdering suspects who are no longer resisting. Much less smiling for the camera while they do it. That's a level of oppressive big govt as bad as any communism, but I guess that doesn't bother you."

What part of that was unclear to you? You're not going to see me going around excusing and apologizing for something like this, when it happens to black people, because hey it happens to white people too. Because it's wrong either way.

YOU are the one that clearly said "How many of those involved police kneeling on the suspect's neck for 9 minutes with the whole thing caught on video? " if you didnt want to me to reply why ask me a question? MMMHMMMMM YUPPPPP