The Derek Chauvin / George Floyd Trial

[s0me0nesmind1]

I mean he killed an unconscious handcuffed man on camera. And it absolutely wasn't definite that he'd be convicted!
That is crazy.

Sadly we don't have a salem witch trial court system. You actually get the same thing regardless of how obvious one might perceive it to be. Crazy, I know...

 

[FireMarshallBill]

Anyone got a link to the look on his face when the verdict came in? Should have taken a plea deal instead of putting the nation through all this but I expect nothing less from someone who clearly enjoyed his power trip.

I don’t have the link anymore but wanted to say that I too really wanted to see it. Think I rewinded the live feed from CNN. You can really see the “oh fuck” kick in when the judge has the jurors affirm their verdicts one by one. Good shit and almost enough for empathy to kick in and feel bad for watching the guy realize his life is over. Then you remember he’s a colossal prick and got what he deserves.

The link should skip ahead to the sentencing, but if not - skip forward to the ~86-minute mark

 

[Tweak155]

manslaughter is a lesser included offense of murder 3 (that is, if the requirements of murder 3 are X and Y, you've also met all the requirements for manslaughter which is just X) and murder 3 is a lesser included offense of murder 2 (which would be X and Y and Z here).

so, this goes up on appeal, and chauvin says that the evidence doesn't actually meet the requirements for any of it. the appellate court says the evidence is enough for the jury to have found on X and Y, but not Z. so they don't have to hold a whole new trial on whether you did X and Y, and then the punishment is for Y.

chauvin can only be punished for one of them.

Thanks, I thought prosecutors stacked charges to see what best sticks... didn’t put much thought as to when it is ultimately whittled down which this would make sense.

 

[ondma]

Does the judge sentence or is there another jury involved?

I believe Chauvin waived the right for the jury to determine sentence, so it is solely in the hands of the judge. My question is will the sentences run concurrently or successively.

 

[ewdotson]

We'll wait and see. Again, many lawyers are talking about it and have been for awhile.

You also said that "[t]he general consensus I am seeing from almost every lawyer talking about this case is that it isn't going well for the prosecution" and that 'The prosecution never proved [2dm] IMO and to the opinions of many many many legal scholars, and lawyers that I know of. It is a good thing the manslaughter charge is still on the list of charges and not just 2nd. Otherwise I seriously think he would be completely acquitted."

"Wait and see" is obviously a perfectly reasonable approach, but perhaps you should consider the possibility that the lawyers you're listening to don't have the best handle on this case?

 

[WelshBloke]

Sadly we don't have a salem witch trial court system. You actually get the same thing regardless of how obvious one might perceive it to be. Crazy, I know...

Did I suggest that there shouldn't have been a trial?

 

[Lost_in_the_HTTP]

Remember that in ANY of these cases, there are no winners.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

Did I suggest that there shouldn't have been a trial?

The fact that you said:

This is crazy

Quite obviously suggests that it is "outside the normal means and/or protocols of what society should accept"

So yes - you did

 

[Torn Mind]

Remember that in ANY of these cases, there are no winners.

The store clerk is the biggest sufferer of them all. Scammed by Floyd, then traumatized by a cop murder. And somewhere, he deserves a $20 compensation.

 

[WelshBloke]

The fact that you said:



Quite obviously suggests that it is "outside the normal means and/or protocols of what society should accept"

So yes - you did

Man you've moved on from alternative facts to an apparently alternative reality.

 

[JEDIYoda]

How soon before Fox News claims Chauvin was found guilty because jurors were afraid of the mobs?

I saw an article about this....and then I saw the video....It is just sickening the narrative that has happened among some FOX News hosts concerning this trial....in fact one FOX News host TODAY -- stated he is glad the verdict was guilty because that mean there would not be looting tonight and then he interjected -- even if Chauvin is NOT guilty of all charges!! What has our country turned into?? But there was pushback and I was glad to see it came from some who I would have thought would have agreed with this persons take on the trial!

 

[emperus]

I mean he killed an unconscious handcuffed man on camera. And it absolutely wasn't definite that he'd be convicted!
That is crazy.

What's crazy is that there were people who saw the same thing you and I did and still thought the officer did nothing wrong.

 

[dank69]

The link should skip ahead to the sentencing, but if not - skip forward to the ~86-minute mark

Thanks for that. I didn't read any oh fuck on his face at all. To me he just looked confused, almost like he had no idea at all what was going on. The eyes darting back and forth non-stop, like he was searching for something. Strange.

 

[dainthomas]

manslaughter is a lesser included offense of murder 3 (that is, if the requirements of murder 3 are X and Y, you've also met all the requirements for manslaughter which is just X) and murder 3 is a lesser included offense of murder 2 (which would be X and Y and Z here).

so, this goes up on appeal, and chauvin says that the evidence doesn't actually meet the requirements for any of it. the appellate court says the evidence is enough for the jury to have found on X and Y, but not Z. so they don't have to hold a whole new trial on whether you did X and Y, and then the punishment is for Y.

chauvin can only be punished for one of them.

That's why they bother sentencing serial killers to hundreds of years in prison or multiple life sentences. If one or more of the convictions is overturned for whatever reason, he's still not going anywhere.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

Government is slow? Is this news to you?

They moved pretty fucking quick to evacuate the senate a few months ago.

 

[HumblePie]

You also said that "[t]he general consensus I am seeing from almost every lawyer talking about this case is that it isn't going well for the prosecution" and that 'The prosecution never proved [2dm] IMO and to the opinions of many many many legal scholars, and lawyers that I know of. It is a good thing the manslaughter charge is still on the list of charges and not just 2nd. Otherwise I seriously think he would be completely acquitted."

"Wait and see" is obviously a perfectly reasonable approach, but perhaps you should consider the possibility that the lawyers you're listening to don't have the best handle on this case?

They did do a poor job imo logically with the case. They were doing an excellent job though with the emotional appeal. Seems the later won out with the jury as it tends to be the case more often than not.

 

[Torn Mind]

You also said that "[t]he general consensus I am seeing from almost every lawyer talking about this case is that it isn't going well for the prosecution" and that 'The prosecution never proved [2dm] IMO and to the opinions of many many many legal scholars, and lawyers that I know of. It is a good thing the manslaughter charge is still on the list of charges and not just 2nd. Otherwise I seriously think he would be completely acquitted."

"Wait and see" is obviously a perfectly reasonable approach, but perhaps you should consider the possibility that the lawyers you're listening to don't have the best handle on this case?

It's two classic HumblePie-isms. Appeal to his cadre of "authorities". and hope you have a bad memory.

Wouldn't be surprised he's buddy-buddy with a cop or two and thinks he's the only logic geek on this planet.

 

[NWRMidnight]

I believe Chauvin waived the right for the jury to determine sentence, so it is solely in the hands of the judge. My question is will the sentences run concurrently or successively.

I would expect them to run concurrently as they are all crimes committed at the same time, with the same victim. Where as if they where separate crimes with separate victims I would expect them to run successively. But I am not a judge or a lawyer, so who knows.

 

[Torn Mind]

They did do a poor job imo logically with the case. They were doing an excellent job though with the emotional appeal. Seems the later won out with the jury as it tends to be the case more often than not.

Nope. The re-directs put back into perspective the defense's attempts to distort perspective.

The video itself is evidence and hard logic supports the prosecutions narrative over the defense's zooming in and Jackson Pollocking what actually went on.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

They moved pretty fucking quick to evacuate the senate a few months ago.

Of course. They always move fast when it's in their self-interest. This is news to you?

 

[woolfe9998]

I believe Chauvin waived the right for the jury to determine sentence, so it is solely in the hands of the judge. My question is will the sentences run concurrently or successively.

I've never heard of a jury being involved in sentencing except in capital cases.

 

[sportage]

Great verdict. However we’ve just seen why Donald Trump will now run in 2024. You see, there are two sides to this story, those that agree and those that do not agree. This will feed the fuel for Trump to run under the promise I WILL DEFEND LAW ENFORCEMENT AND I WILL DEFEND THE POLICE AND I WILL DEFEND LAW AND ORDER. This will be their battle cry. So expect that. Pro Trump right wing will inject division once again, claiming that Joe Biden stood with the anti law enforcement crowd while Donald Trump will stand with the pro law enforcement America. And yes, righties, Fox News, Hannity, Trump, all of them will make this an issue of Americanism. Of patriotism. 2024 is a long way off, but the Trump loyalists will not let this go. They and Trump will use this to divide and to further the hate. How do I know this? I hear this from my Trumpie relatives who demonized George Floyd from the very beginning as a drug addict, a criminal, a crook, and as simply “”a really bad dude””. They, Trump, Fox will be outraged that a cop was found guilty while a black man was not. And that was why George Floyd and Derek Chauvin were both on trial here from the very beginning. By the way, Fox News is so trying to turn this into a them vs us thing. There were no riots and Fox just can not handle that. Poor Fox.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

Of course. They always move fast when it's in their self-interest. This is news to you?

Someone's extra touchy. In a bad mood?

 

[HurleyBird]

Yeah, it's being called "felony murder" by some commentators but it differs considerably from felony murder in other states. That is because Minnesota doesn't apply the merger doctrine, whereby an assault cannot be the predicate felony under the rule.

I recall some legal commentator saying that the lack of merger doctrine in Minnesota is because there are specific exceptions in the statutes that mostly serve the same purpose (iirc there was something with rape), but those weren't applicable in Chauvin's case.

 

[MrSquished]

Expect to see lots of rioting links by pcgeek and nobodysmind posted here shortly. Not some sporadic isolated incidents of punks, but full-fledged rioting.