• Guest, The rules for the P & N subforum have been updated to prohibit "ad hominem" or personal attacks against other posters. See the full details in the post "Politics and News Rules & Guidelines."

The consolidated New Hampshire primary results thread (let's try this again)

Page 13 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
46,408
5,739
126
Just look at Europe or what our Republicans campaign on (e.g. Balanced-the-budget Kasich and Balanced Budget Amendment Ted).

Austerity in practice for our Republicans is weaponized Keynesian policy. And Democrats fecklessly play along in part because they're not that liberal to begin with.
If it mattered what politicians campaigned on, Trump would have built that wall and reformed immigration law while the Republicans controlled all 3 branches of the federal govt. Similarly, balanced budget promises are just red meat for people too ignorant to know how important the govt bond market is to the US economy, or that govt absolutely should be able to borrow money when necessary.

Your 2nd paragraph is nonsense. I suspect you have no idea what liberalism is. Your paranoid conspiracy theories are certainly not in line with liberal values of rationality and inclusiveness.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ivwshane

Maxima1

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2013
3,003
542
126
Similarly, balanced budget promises are just red meat for people too ignorant to know how important the govt bond market is to the US economy, or that govt absolutely should be able to borrow money when necessary.
This is just silly. While Mulvaney largely copy pasted the Obama budget, it's painfully obvious they want to cut a lot into social programs, but they're still busy trying to consolidate power to do so more effectively, and they've sucessfully had the Democrats doing their work for them (remember the pledge "end welfare as we know it"?, haha). Hell, they almost got a deal with Obama to cut into SS and Medicare, even though it's significantly less generous than the subsidies and advanced funding Democrats advocated for government workers.

If it mattered what politicians campaigned on, Trump would have built that wall and reformed immigration law
He is getting money for the wall, and he is going through with some of the immigration stuff. I don't know what the expectation is here when the GOP decided to keep the filibuster. Obviously there is division among the right course of action here for them, since Latinos are growing in number and GOP business has benefited from low wage labor. But entitlements and social programs? 'Course they want to screw the poors. You act like it's all no big deal.

Your paranoid conspiracy theories are certainly not in line with liberal values of rationality and inclusiveness.
i don't even know what you're talking about here.

Your 2nd paragraph is nonsense. I suspect you have no idea what liberalism is.
I'll let Krugman take it from here, haha.

 
  • Like
Reactions: DarthKyrie

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
46,408
5,739
126
This is just silly. While Mulvaney largely copy pasted the Obama budget, it's painfully obvious they want to cut a lot into social programs, but they're still busy trying to consolidate power to do so more effectively, and they've sucessfully had the Democrats doing their work for them (remember the pledge "end welfare as we know it"?, haha). Hell, they almost got a deal with Obama to cut into SS and Medicare, even though it's significantly less generous than the subsidies and advanced funding Democrats advocated for government workers.



He is getting money for the wall, and he is going through with some of the immigration stuff. I don't know what the expectation is here when the GOP decided to keep the filibuster. Obviously there is division among the right course of action here for them, since Latinos are growing in number and GOP business has benefited from low wage labor. But entitlements and social programs? 'Course they want to screw the poors. You act like it's all no big deal.



i don't even know what you're talking about here.



I'll let Krugman take it from here, haha.

You do know that appeal to authority is the most irrational of logical fallacies, right? But you just keep doing it.
 

Blackjack200

Lifer
May 28, 2007
15,632
1,514
126
To put a finer point on it, this sudden pivot to the deficit is a signal to wealthy donors. The bargain is that they keep the grease flowing long enough to flush out Biden, Klobuchar, and Warren, and then Pete gets to consolidate the anti-Bernie vote without actually offering anything that anybody wants. He's going to run as not-Bernie in the primaries, and then as not-Trump in the general. How inspiring.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DarthKyrie

Maxima1

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2013
3,003
542
126
You do know that appeal to authority is the most irrational of logical fallacies, right? But you just keep doing it.
lol Saying it's wrong just because you think it meets "appeal to authority" is a fallacy. I'm not claiming it's true because Krugman said it. I'm posting it because both of those points are true. Have evidence against them? Then show it.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
46,408
5,739
126
lol Saying it's wrong just because you think it meets "appeal to authority" is a fallacy. I'm not claiming it's true because Krugman said it. I'm posting it because both of those points are true. Have evidence against them? Then show it.
Why should I bother when you're doing such a good arguing with yourself? And anyway, it's not my job to prove your points are false, but it is your job to prove to people that you're not full of shit.
But if what you're really trying to do here is to convince Democrats to be against Bernie while pretending to be a Bernie supporter, gotta say you are excelling at that one.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
46,408
5,739
126
To put a finer point on it, this sudden pivot to the deficit is a signal to wealthy donors. The bargain is that they keep the grease flowing long enough to flush out Biden, Klobuchar, and Warren, and then Pete gets to consolidate the anti-Bernie vote without actually offering anything that anybody wants. He's going to run as not-Bernie in the primaries, and then as not-Trump in the general. How inspiring.
Or maybe they're signaling that massive deficit spending during an economic expansion tends to exacerbate the boom and bust cycle. Or even more maybe they're just concerned that Trump is using deficit spending to buy the election with the public's money.
Both of those seem much more plausible and rational than your reality TV-inspired conspiracy theories.
 
  • Like
Reactions: hal2kilo

Blackjack200

Lifer
May 28, 2007
15,632
1,514
126
Or maybe they're signaling that massive deficit spending during an economic expansion tends to exacerbate the boom and bust cycle. Or even more maybe they're just concerned that Trump is using deficit spending to buy the election with the public's money.
Both of those seem much more plausible and rational than your reality TV-inspired conspiracy theories.
Yeah, that definitely explains why he discovered the issue like 12 minutes ago when we've had deficit spending in an expanding economy for more than a decade. Go on Pete, get that money!
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
46,408
5,739
126
Yeah, that definitely explains why he discovered the issue like 12 minutes ago when we've had deficit spending in an expanding economy for more than a decade. Go on Pete, get that money!
How exactly is speaking out against deficit spending right after the latest budget has been released helping Pete to get money from wealthy donors? Did you miss that Trump's latest budget just came out, which is what spurred all this deficit talk? Did you miss how those deficits were decreasing the last decade, until 2017? Are you under the mistaken impression that rich people, who can usually borrow money quite easily, don't like low interest rates and loose monetary policy? You think 'the Elites' are going to throw money at Pete so he can reign in the deficit spending that's fueling their investment gains in the stock market? Really?
 

Maxima1

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2013
3,003
542
126
Why should I bother when you're doing such a good arguing with yourself? And anyway, it's not my job to prove your points are false, but it is your job to prove to people that you're not full of shit.
But if what you're really trying to do here is to convince Democrats to be against Bernie while pretending to be a Bernie supporter, gotta say you are excelling at that one.
You weren't ever going to support him if some nobody being rude to you was going to change your vote.

Or maybe they're signaling that massive deficit spending during an economic expansion tends to exacerbate the boom and bust cycle.
lol The Great Recession was the result of massive credit expansion. Do you know what the remedy was? More spending! We could have preempted it obviously before the shit hit the fan. The most innocuous interpretation is they don't have a clue, but a lot of this arguably is them being in a bubble trying to find rationales why we don't need to spend the money of the richest Americans or via deficit spending on social programs that broadly help people.


The economic team went round and round. Geithner would hold his views close, but occasionally he would get frustrated. Once, as [then chairwoman of the Council of Economic Advisers Christina] Romer pressed for more stimulus spending, Geithner snapped. Stimulus, he told Romer, was “sugar,” and its effect was fleeting. The administration, he urged, needed to focus on long-term economic growth, and the first step was reining in the debt.

How exactly is speaking out against deficit spending right after the latest budget has been released helping Pete to get money from wealthy donors? Did you miss that Trump's latest budget just came out, which is what spurred all this deficit talk? Did you miss how those deficits were decreasing the last decade, until 2017? Are you under the mistaken impression that rich people, who can usually borrow money quite easily, don't like low interest rates and loose monetary policy? You think 'the Elites' are going to throw money at Pete so he can reign in the deficit spending that's fueling their investment gains in the stock market? Really?
This kind of talk is how they limit discussion on liberal policies. Poo pooing everything like Broom Hilda.

“Noting that his plans didn’t add up, that they would inevitably mean raising taxes on middle-class families, or that they were little more than a pipe-dream — all of this could be used to reinforce his argument that I wasn’t a true progressive. My team kept reminding me that we didn’t want to alienate Bernie’s supporters. President Obama urged me to grit my teeth and lay off Bernie as much as I could. I felt like I was in a straitjacket.”
 

mect

Golden Member
Jan 5, 2004
1,904
755
136
You do know that appeal to authority is the most irrational of logical fallacies, right? But you just keep doing it.
Referencing Krugman in support of an economics claim is not an appeal to authority fallacy.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
66,636
14,113
136
It's going to be a great election. Right wing Trump vs left wing Trump.
I wonder if Bernie Twitter realizes how much damage they are doing to Bernie the candidate by acting just like the Trump supporters the rest of the Democrats hate.

It’s all the same irrationality, conspiracy lingering, childish screaming, etc.
 
  • Like
Reactions: hal2kilo

nakedfrog

Lifer
Apr 3, 2001
49,354
2,278
126
I wonder if Bernie Twitter realizes how much damage they are doing to Bernie the candidate by acting just like the Trump supporters the rest of the Democrats hate.

It’s all the same irrationality, conspiracy lingering, childish screaming, etc.
I'm pretty sure they don't :(
 

Maxima1

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2013
3,003
542
126
I wonder if Bernie Twitter realizes how much damage they are doing to Bernie the candidate by acting just like the Trump supporters the rest of the Democrats hate.

It’s all the same irrationality, conspiracy lingering, childish screaming, etc.
lol They weren't going to vote for him anyway if somebody on the internet being rude to them made them not vote for Bernie. This is pretty hysterical considering you were just telling someone here that they were insane for not trying to get Trump out.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DarthKyrie

hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
12,198
1,953
126
lol They weren't going to vote for him anyway if somebody on the internet being rude to them made them not vote for Bernie. This is pretty hysterical considering you were just telling someone here that they were insane for not trying to get Trump out.
Wrong. I'll vote for whoever is nominated. But, keep it up, you are doing a great job of making friends. Funny if he lost because of his supporters.
 

ASK THE COMMUNITY