The clasic definition of a fool is somebody who, after 8 years of the worst disaster in American history,

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Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
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Chucky2 explains rationalizes his delusions thus:

"I'm glad to see you've made the turn and realized all those things happened with the blessing of your beloved Democrats, who are just as guilty and corrupt as their Republican counterparts.

You just need to keep going now and realize all our politicians are corrupt. When we all realize this, and finally do something about it, then we'll be better off.

If you are truly so delusional as to think Obama/Biden are going to serve your interests, you truly are out there in spaceland more than I thought - I don't think that's possible."

This is the case of a person who can't reason mathematically. He believes that the worst disaster in American history could be worse if we change course. It is expressed similarly throughout the thread. This is an example of a fool who remains a fool because he has no options. He simply is a fool.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
73,236
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lupi: Bad batch of mushrooms?

This is an example of a fool who is a fool because he can grapple with psychological questions. This is the kind of fool who is a fool because he deflects self recognition.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
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Originally posted by: kranky
This reply to one of your posts in another thread fits here given the topic.

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong
You know Moonie, I support Obama in this election also but your cynicism towards all others and blind partisanship (almost worship) of him is pretty much what you have railed against the Rs for over the last few years.

You are becoming what you have fought. Someone so blinded by your desire to have your candidate win that you are unable to see the chinks in the armor. I believe that he offers a lot of good options in a lot of areas for this country. But to blindly ignore his faults is akin to being a Bush apologist and never admitting that he has screwed the pooch on many occasions.

Both sides have serious problems. Both sides have good points as well. A more balanced view would give you some credibility.

Here we see a mind that requires purity of source before he will consider. His focus on the lint on your jacket cause him not to hear anything you say.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
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Originally posted by: cubeless
when u r left of riw then u know u r the man!!!

mb's new sig:

"You limit the scope of your hallucinogen intake you limit the findings.." Moonbeam

Here we have another brain dead lupi.
 

Xavier434

Lifer
Oct 14, 2002
10,373
1
0
Originally posted by: bamacre
Originally posted by: Xavier434
Originally posted by: bamacre
Originally posted by: Xavier434
....America needs to be blasted way back into the days of tiny government that people demanded more of continuously because of the problems it ended up presenting...

What you have said here is just totally ignorant of how much of big government has come into existence.

There is MUCH more truth in saying that it is not so much that big government has been demanded by people, but that much of what big government is has been SOLD to the American people. And sold using excuses, lies, and half-truths. And the motivations for all of this have come from power-driven politicians and big corporations.

Why do you believe that the exact same thing will not be sold to the people again and we will not end up exactly where we are now?

I don't believe that is the case. But all the better to cut now, rather than ignore and let it get even bigger and bigger. And it's not like, as you put it, that "we" would simply format the hard drive and start over. That's just illogical and dangerous. Cuts would need to be made, but gradually. "We" aren't out to hurt people who are, right now, dependent upon big government.

* more stuff *

I am not going to argue with you any more about this here because I just don't see the point. I don't agree with you and I don't believe that the Libertarians will ever be in power again for more than a very short time span and all of their efforts will be wiped out soon afterward.

I will leave you with one final thought though. Your biggest challenge is not the government even though that is what it may seem like. It is the people that you want to give all of this money and freedom too. They are the reason why Libertarianism failed in the first place. They are the reason why it will fail again should it ever come to pass. People are not and never will be responsible and smart enough to handle the kind of freedom you wish to give them. If you give it to them, they will misuse it and abuse it. They did it before and they will do it again. The result will be a demand for change. It will be a demand for someone to take control of the problem. It will be a demand for more government. I guarantee it. I also think that it is unfortunate, but that's the truth.



 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,529
3
0
Hey even the Republicans are throwing him under the bus by saying the McCain will not be as bad as Bush. IMO he doesn't have to be as bad to still be bad for America.
 

Onita

Golden Member
Feb 24, 2004
1,158
0
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Originally posted by: Wheezer
Originally posted by: heyheybooboo
Originally posted by: Wheezer
8 years of the worst disaster in American history

Really?

I think USA & World Report wold differ.

Perhaps a brush up on history might do some of you some good.

10 Worst Presidents

I don't see either Bush on there, but Carter made honorable mention.

If you click on this link you will find that the persons who read that article voted George W. Bush the worst president ever by a margin of 3.5-1 over Richard Nixon. Ol' Dubs captured over 70% of the vote :p

looks like a reader poll.

The original link was based more on factual information rather than emotion.

I am not saying Bush has not has some major fuck-ups, but there have been much worse
in the past.

Introduction

It's too soon to judge the current one, but for past presidents, the verdict is in. U.S. News has averaged the results of five polls to make a gallery of the worst chief executives. The years before the Civil War produced an era of failure: Six of seven presidents who served from 1841 to 1861 made the list. Learn More | Poll
 

chucky2

Lifer
Dec 9, 1999
10,016
36
86
Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Chucky2 explains rationalizes his delusions thus:

"I'm glad to see you've made the turn and realized all those things happened with the blessing of your beloved Democrats, who are just as guilty and corrupt as their Republican counterparts.

You just need to keep going now and realize all our politicians are corrupt. When we all realize this, and finally do something about it, then we'll be better off.

If you are truly so delusional as to think Obama/Biden are going to serve your interests, you truly are out there in spaceland more than I thought - I don't think that's possible."

This is the case of a person who can't reason mathematically. He believes that the worst disaster in American history could be worse if we change course. It is expressed similarly throughout the thread. This is an example of a fool who remains a fool because he has no options. He simply is a fool.

First, you've been pawned so many times in your own (young) thread it's not even funny.

Second, you keep saying 'worst disaster'. Can you point out which 'worst disaster' here has affected you 'personally', other than destroying your drug high? I'm betting you can't. Therefore, you're whole premise is already wrong.

The fool comments are just icing on the cake...you prove yourself a fool - worse than the usual fools here, and that's saying something - regularly each time you post. Maybe in whatever dimension you're posting from things are clear and make sense...the problem is when they make it here in posted form, they have all the meaning of the dog pile that's out in the neighbors yard across the street. If it looks like it, smells like it......it's a Moonie post.

Worse, you actually think you have options. It's just so preposterous...you actually believe - and I truly believe you believe what you post - that Obama/Biden is better than McCain/Palin. Or Bush/Cheney. Or any of the others.

The true people we so desperately need running this country either a.) won't run for a variety of reasons, or b.) aren't able to run because of the massive costs of doing so. So we get the same from each party each election. Rinse, Repeat.

Chuck
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
73,236
6,338
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Originally posted by: NaughtyGeek
If you support either of the main stream candidates, you're guilty of exactly what you're accusing others of. Until we as a people decide that the "lesser of two evils" isn't good enough, we will continue to be ruled by evil.

Here we have a case of the mind of the ideological purist who wishes to be free of the change of guilt. He will not get his hands dirty even if the country goes down the drain. This is the paralysis and prison of those who demand moral rectitude. They live in fantasy land.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
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Xavier434: "Ya, this is basically how I feel. Both parties have their strengths and they have their weaknesses. Both are corrupt but just in a different way. Each are better at solving certain problems in certain areas while creating larger problems in other areas. Given the current state of today's country and the problems which I deem of greatest importance, it is my opinion that democrats are better at fixing those problems.

4 years from now, it is very possible that the majority of problems which I deem most important will change. The solutions to these problems might lie within the strengths of the Republicans. If that is the case, then you will see me vote for a Republican candidate.

The point is that standing behind your party just because the definition of what your party should stand for is very attractive to you is very stupid. The reality of what your party can do given a current situation is often very different. Vote for who you think will be able to best solve the majority of the problems that we have now and really be objective when you consider which candidate is able to do so. Don't do it the half assed way by just siding with the party which usually appeals to you the most."

Here is an example of a person who has the mental freedom to reason.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
73,236
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Originally posted by: NaughtyGeek
If you support either of the main stream candidates, you're guilty of exactly what you're accusing others of. Until we as a people decide that the "lesser of two evils" isn't good enough, we will continue to be ruled by evil.

Another ideological purist absolutist dreamer. He is waiting to vote for the Messiah. He will wait forever while the world itself rots from his inaction. But he will be above active blame. His will be the sin of inaction.
 

chucky2

Lifer
Dec 9, 1999
10,016
36
86
Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Xavier434: "Ya, <snip>

Here is an example of a person who has the mental freedom to reason.

You realize this is called 'Common Sense' by most other people right?

Is this thing called "Common Sense' so new and amazing to you that you equate it to psycho babble induced phrases like 'mental freedom'???

Chuck
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
73,236
6,338
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Originally posted by: MikeyLSU
first off, things won't be the same under MCCain.

Second, you sound stupid by calling him McSame. How would you view someone who always called Obama, Osama? exactly.

And it is quite easy to vote for McCain when you think Obama would hurt the country pretty badly and very quickly if he gets his way.

Here is another example of the lack of mathematical reasoning. The 10% McSame differs from Bush will be the source of change while Obama is vastly different than Bush. Naturally a mind this feeble will attack others to bolster its own insecurity. 90% McSame as Bush, America's greatest disaster, and Obama will be worse. Hehe. This can't be anything other than brain dead.
 

Mursilis

Diamond Member
Mar 11, 2001
7,756
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Originally posted by: Xavier434
I will leave you with one final thought though. Your biggest challenge is not the government even though that is what it may seem like. It is the people that you want to give all of this money and freedom too. They are the reason why Libertarianism failed in the first place. They are the reason why it will fail again should it ever come to pass. People are not and never will be responsible and smart enough to handle the kind of freedom you wish to give them. If you give it to them, they will misuse it and abuse it. They did it before and they will do it again. The result will be a demand for change. It will be a demand for someone to take control of the problem. It will be a demand for more government. I guarantee it. I also think that it is unfortunate, but that's the truth.

History suggests the truth of these words. I'd only change it to say, "If you give it to them, they will give it back to the first charismatic charlaton promising to solve all their unsolvable problems."
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
73,236
6,338
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Originally posted by: bamacre
I think when you look, not just at the last 8 years, but at the last 50 or 60 years, you should begin to wonder why anyone would vote for either McCain or Obama.

What drives one to either of these guys is fear. Fear that the other would win. The lesser of two evils.

The problem is the lesser of two evils keeps getting more evil. Eventually we'll be choosing a Chavez over a Hitler.

Another ideological purist who can't face reality. The simple fact that if one's options are either the lesser or the greater of two evils with no other real options, one always works for the lesser is lost on such a mind. It's an attachment to an ideal of principal that precludes rational action. One may as well pray.
 

bamacre

Lifer
Jul 1, 2004
21,029
2
61
Originally posted by: Xavier434
Originally posted by: bamacre
Originally posted by: Xavier434
Originally posted by: bamacre
Originally posted by: Xavier434
....America needs to be blasted way back into the days of tiny government that people demanded more of continuously because of the problems it ended up presenting...

What you have said here is just totally ignorant of how much of big government has come into existence.

There is MUCH more truth in saying that it is not so much that big government has been demanded by people, but that much of what big government is has been SOLD to the American people. And sold using excuses, lies, and half-truths. And the motivations for all of this have come from power-driven politicians and big corporations.

Why do you believe that the exact same thing will not be sold to the people again and we will not end up exactly where we are now?

I don't believe that is the case. But all the better to cut now, rather than ignore and let it get even bigger and bigger. And it's not like, as you put it, that "we" would simply format the hard drive and start over. That's just illogical and dangerous. Cuts would need to be made, but gradually. "We" aren't out to hurt people who are, right now, dependent upon big government.

* more stuff *

I am not going to argue with you any more about this here because I just don't see the point. I don't agree with you and I don't believe that the Libertarians will ever be in power again for more than a very short time span and all of their efforts will be wiped out soon afterward. I will leave you with one final thought though. Your biggest challenge is not the government even though that is what it may seem like. It is the people that you want to give all of this money and freedom too. They are the reason why Libertarianism failed in the first place. They are the reason why it will fail again should it ever come to pass. People are not and never will be responsible and smart enough to handle the kind of freedom you wish to give them. If you give it to them, they will misuse it and abuse it. They did it before and they will do it again. The result will be a demand for change. It will be a demand for someone to take control of the problem. It will be a demand for more government. I guarantee it. I also think that it is unfortunate, but that's the truth.

Well, I agree, looking at the way Americans perceive government and its roll, and their depth of knowledge of the issues, the LP certainly will not hold much power in government. It's not that people are dumb, but ignorant, and the media and politicians are mostly to blame.

But one thing I failed to point out in my last reply to you was that eventually, there will very likely be major cuts in spending, not so much because people will demand it, but simply because the government will not be able to afford the spending. They'll either need to raise taxes to a level we have never seen before, or destroy the currency printing the money. Both of those will be unacceptable. But there will be a point where something MUST have to give. What we have now is completely unsustainable, not to mention what Obama and McCain would likely pile on top. And when, not if, but when, we get to that point, do you think the cuts are going to be gradual? Not likely. So, it is not that "we" want to get out a pair of scissors and start cutting now, it is that we would prefer to do it gradually (and keep it that way, I admit), rather than waiting until the government has to do just that.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
73,236
6,338
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Originally posted by: Duwelon
Originally posted by: MikeyLSU
first off, things won't be the same under MCCain.

Second, you sound stupid by calling him McSame. How would you view someone who always called Obama, Osama? exactly.

And it is quite easy to vote for McCain when you think Obama would hurt the country pretty badly and very quickly if he gets his way.

I hope he is the same as Bush in his resolve to confront evil in this world. We haven't had a terrorist attack on US soil now since 9/11 because of Bush. Freedom isn't free, if it takes another Bush to purchase our freedom through my own sweat and blood i'll gladly step up. Hopefully though, the Republicans learned their lessons about fiscal spending.

There are fools who are disaster blind.
 

bamacre

Lifer
Jul 1, 2004
21,029
2
61
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Hey even the Republicans are throwing him under the bus by saying the McCain will not be as bad as Bush. IMO he doesn't have to be as bad to still be bad for America.

Now you understand why I won't vote for Obama. ;)
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
73,236
6,338
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Originally posted by: Donny Baker
The best argument for voting for McCain is a democratic congress. With a growing democratic congress during this election cycle, if Obama wins, can we say 'rubberstamp'?

There are fools who believe the disaster of paralysis is cured by cutting off ones legs.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
73,236
6,338
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Originally posted by: CycloWizard
I climb a mountain and come to a cliff directly ahead of me. Does that mean turning in any other direction will prevent me from plummeting to my death?

Hehe, as if that were the obvious question. I guess if you go straight ahead we'll never know the answer.
 

bamacre

Lifer
Jul 1, 2004
21,029
2
61
Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Originally posted by: bamacre
I think when you look, not just at the last 8 years, but at the last 50 or 60 years, you should begin to wonder why anyone would vote for either McCain or Obama.

What drives one to either of these guys is fear. Fear that the other would win. The lesser of two evils.

The problem is the lesser of two evils keeps getting more evil. Eventually we'll be choosing a Chavez over a Hitler.

Another ideological purist who can't face reality. The simple fact that if one's options are either the lesser or the greater of two evils with no other real options, one always works for the lesser is lost on such a mind. It's an attachment to an ideal of principal that precludes rational action. One may as well pray.

Sorry, Moonie.

I will sit down and watch you two destroy this country before I'll stand up and help you do it.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
73,236
6,338
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Originally posted by: Jaskalas
When the platforms of Stalin, Mao, and Castro are the only alternative presented for opposing the last eight years - then Bush/McCain begin to appear less horrible. Doesn't mean I'll vote for them, once was enough, but you need to understand how disgusting the alternative to them is.

Some fools are psychotic from imaginary fears.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
73,236
6,338
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Originally posted by: MikeyLSU
Originally posted by: Excelsior
Originally posted by: bamacre
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Yes, I am sad to see the U.S. go by the way of the Roman Empire.

You say that as if the Democrats are anti-war. They aren't.

Please convince the republicans of this, because they still think Democrats are weak on the military or some such bullshit.

Clinton crippled the military during his 8 years.

Some fools are such fools they defy categorization. 'You have a wart so I'll shoot myself in the foot' kind of fools.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
73,236
6,338
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Originally posted by: andy04
What choice do ppl have, vote Oblahblah... that would be a even bigger disaster. BHO has no clue about how to fix energy economy or anything. No credible ideas from him yet just bhal bhal blah blah. Looking at his past i wont be surprised if he comes up with some socialist ideas to fix things and the lobbyists in w'ton will tear him apart and we will be in even deeper shit. Wife hates america, himslef has very strong association with white terrorists...

Another imbecile who doesn't understand statistics.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
73,236
6,338
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Mursilis:

"No, I believe the definition of a fool is one who believes things will be all that different under the D's. They'll just violate different constitutional rights (they don't seem to care much for guns, or private property based on the Kelo decision), and run up the debt in different ways (less money wasted abroad, more money wasted at home). When you stop believing gov't is your savior, you'll stop being a fool."

Another ideological purist who can't do math and other simple forms of reasoning. This kind of fool thinks he might be an even bigger fool if he changed. He lives in terror of his imagination and the monsters the money interests put under his bed.