The Beginning of the Occupation

AmerDoux

Senior member
Dec 4, 2001
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We have entered a new stage in the war with Iraq. As the Occupying force, we are required to protect the civilian population, hospitals and instill some sort of working order to the region. I am wondering what ppl's feelings are in regards to the outbreaks of looting and mob attacks?




Linky to BBC News Report

Edit to include quotes from article linked above:

"There have been serious incidents of looting right across the city with two key Baghdad hospitals and many smaller ones being ransacked, International Red Cross officials said."

"United Nations and international aide officials have criticised US and British troops for failing to curb the looting, saying it threatened to deepen the humanitarian crisis in Iraq and contravened the Geneva Conventions."

"Looters sacked the German embassy and a French cultural centre in the capital, carrying off furniture, fridges and electrical equipment."





 

Tab

Lifer
Sep 15, 2002
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The only lootings I have heard of where the civs raiding goverment buildings? I know their was a attempted bank robbery but was stopped by the brits.
 

CADsortaGUY

Lifer
Oct 19, 2001
25,162
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www.ShawCAD.com
It takes time to establish "control".

Did anyone expect that we'd just walk in and turn into police when THERE IS STILL A WAR GOING ON!!!? Baghdad still has fighting going on so our troops are in no position to effectively "police" the town. Could you imagine the uproar if our troops started to arrest civilians on a large scale basis because of looting? Cripes - you same whiners would then shout that we ARE imposing our rule on them.

Sure I'm concerned about the anarky but there isn't an effective way to keep the peace when we still have the enemy firing at us.

CkG
 

arcitech2

Member
Apr 1, 2003
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Originally posted by: AmerDoux
We have entered a new stage in the war with Iraq. As the Occupying force, we are required to protect the civilian population, hospitals and instill some sort of working order to the region. I am wondering what ppl's feelings are in regards to the outbreaks of looting and mob attacks?




Linky to BBC News Report

Edit to include quotes from article linked above:

"There have been serious incidents of looting right across the city with two key Baghdad hospitals and many smaller ones being ransacked, International Red Cross officials said."

"United Nations and international aide officials have criticised US and British troops for failing to curb the looting, saying it threatened to deepen the humanitarian crisis in Iraq and contravened the Geneva Conventions."

"Looters sacked the German embassy and a French cultural centre in the capital, carrying off furniture, fridges and electrical equipment."

We are only seeing what the news is providing us. Iraqi's sweeping up the rubble isn't as interesting as looters running through the streets. There will be repurcussions, especially from the religious leaders. Joy at Saddams demise is not an excuse to destroy your own city. They will need to rebuild, and it is easier if there are some foundations left to build on.
 

AmerDoux

Senior member
Dec 4, 2001
644
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"Did anyone expect that we'd just walk in and turn into police when THERE IS STILL A WAR GOING ON!!!? Baghdad still has fighting going on so our troops are in no position to effectively "police" the town. Could you imagine the uproar if our troops started to arrest civilians on a large scale basis because of looting? Cripes - you same whiners would then shout that we ARE imposing our rule on them."

Nobody is whining or shouting about anything. This was/is an expected outcome. Yes, there is still fighting going on, but there is a responsibility and need to prevent this from going way out of control. This is the beginning of the long haul. How quickly it is handled and how well it is handled will set the tone of the occupation.

 

ChicagoMaroon

Senior member
Dec 10, 1999
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"Looters sacked the German embassy and a French cultural centre in the capital, carrying off furniture, fridges and electrical equipment."

Awesome, looting German and French buildings. The Iraqis know what's up and who exactly was against their liberation. I say let them go for a time being, let them blow off steam and this gives them a sense of power and personal control after such a long period of oppression.
 

308nato

Platinum Member
Feb 10, 2002
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It will all settle down as soon as we build them their NASCAR track.
 

Martin

Lifer
Jan 15, 2000
29,178
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Originally posted by: ChicagoMaroon
"Looters sacked the German embassy and a French cultural centre in the capital, carrying off furniture, fridges and electrical equipment."

Awesome, looting German and French buildings. The Iraqis know what's up and who exactly was against their liberation. I say let them go for a time being, let them blow off steam and this gives them a sense of power and personal control after such a long period of oppression.

Don't be a dumbass. No one cared who the embassy belonged too as long as it could be looted. Iraqis have been looting everything, including neighbourhood food stores and hospitals.




 

ChicagoMaroon

Senior member
Dec 10, 1999
403
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Originally posted by: MartyTheManiak
Originally posted by: ChicagoMaroon
"Looters sacked the German embassy and a French cultural centre in the capital, carrying off furniture, fridges and electrical equipment."

Awesome, looting German and French buildings. The Iraqis know what's up and who exactly was against their liberation. I say let them go for a time being, let them blow off steam and this gives them a sense of power and personal control after such a long period of oppression.

Don't be a dumbass. No one cared who the embassy belonged too as long as it could be looted. Iraqis have been looting everything, including neighbourhood food stores and hospitals.

I detect a severe malfunction in your "Not really a serious statement, but funny because there's some truth to it." detector.

Chill out Mr. Maniak, maniak, on the floor, and he'll dance like he's never danced before... you'll live longer.

As reported by a French news agency:

- 11 h 39 : Pillage de l'ambassade allemande
L'ambassade d'Allemagne et le centre culturel français à Bagdad ont été mis à sac par des pillards, selon un journaliste de l'AFP. Les pillards sont rentrés dans la cour intérieure de l'ambassade d'Allemagne en voiture et même à cheval. Ils ont démonté tout ce qu'ils ont trouvé, le mobilier, les néons, les réfrigérateurs, les appareils vidéo. La scène est la même dans le centre culturel français. Un groupe de sept Français employés par la chancellerie était resté à Bagdad pour assurer la protection des locaux, le personnel diplomatique ayant évacué la capitale irakienne.

(The German embassy and the French cultural center in Baghdad have been sacked by looters, according to a journalist with Agence France Presse. The looters entered into the interior court of the German embassy in vehicles and even on horses. They dismantled everything they found, the furniture, the neon lights, the refrigerators, and the video apparatus. The scene was the same at the French cultural center. A group of seven French chancellor employees had stayed in Baghdad to protect these localities, the diplomatic personnel having been evacuated from the Iraqi capital.)
 

HappyGamer2

Banned
Jun 12, 2000
1,441
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it's hard to say what's going to happen in Iraq in the short run or long run, they are not used to or ready for true democracy, they may just keep fight amongst themselves, controlling iraq and keeping it stable maybe a much bigger task than the actual war, but then again maybe not
 

Ornery

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
20,022
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81
Thanks for clearing that up.
rolleye.gif
 

Dudd

Platinum Member
Aug 3, 2001
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Let em get it out of their system now. When the fighting dies down, then we can start the long rebuilding process.
 

exp

Platinum Member
May 9, 2001
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Restoring law & order is currently very low on the military's to-do list, as it should be. Sure, the looting is bad but in the vast majority of these cases no one is being killed or even injured. Hunting down the remaining Saddam loyalists and hidden weapons caches, bringing in humanitarian aid such as food and medicine, and repairing critical infrastructure such as water and power plants are all FAR more important right now, since accomplishing those tasks will actually save lives.

 

charrison

Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
17,033
1
81
Originally posted by: exp
Restoring law & order is currently very low on the military's to-do list, as it should be. Sure, the looting is bad but in the vast majority of these cases no one is being killed or even injured. Hunting down the remaining Saddam loyalists and hidden weapons caches, bringing in humanitarian aid such as food and medicine, and repairing critical infrastructure such as water and power plants are all FAR more important right now, since accomplishing those tasks will actually save lives.

And before law and order can be put into place, it has to determined what law and order is. Looting is no doubt wrong, but what are the penalties for it and who is the judge right now?