Texas school district suspends transgender teacher

[Texashiker]

300 physicians commit suicide every year.

Is practicing medicine is a sign of mental illness?

From the numbers I heard a decade ago, dentist have the highest rates of suicide of all professionals.

Those people chose to be a dentist.

Transgenders are choosing to cross dress.

Those groups are making a willful decision that may lead to their own demise.

 

[Jaskalas]

From the numbers I heard a decade ago, dentist have the highest rates of suicide of all professionals.

Those people chose to be a dentist.

Transgenders are choosing to cross dress.

Those groups are making a willful decision that may lead to their own demise.

How does this suicide rate compare to Gays or Lesbians? I had not considered the distinction before, but it occurs to me that it is made for a reason and that opens the door to your reasoning.

 

[pauldun170]

India court recognises transgender people as third gender
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-27031180

 

[Oyeve]

India court recognises transgender people as third gender
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-27031180

This is what it should be. They should have bathrooms for Men, Women and Other. Problem solved.

 

[shira]

Which body part is cut off through tattooing?

Also:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...rs-tattooed-on-face-after-falling-asleep.html

Many women have their perfectly healthy breasts cut off to reduce their chance of getting breast cancer. Other women have portions of their breats cut off because their breasts are too large and are causing a strain on their bodies. Are these women mentally ill?

Also, many women have tissue ADDED to their breast areas, to make their breasts larger. Are these women mentally ill?

Or do you agree that there are "rational" reasons for having body parts removed or added? And if you DO agree that there are rational reasons for having body parts removed or added, who are you and TH to spout to the world which reasons are rational and which are irrational? Who are you to declare that it's "impossible" for a totally rational person to decide that their life will be happier if they do or don't have a penis or vagina or breasts?

 

[nehalem256]

Many women have their perfectly healthy breasts cut off to reduce their chance of getting breast cancer. Other women have portions of their breats cut off because their breasts are too large and are causing a strain on their bodies. Are these women mentally ill?

Pretty sure that cancer and back pain count as physical ailments.

Also, many women have tissue ADDED to their breast areas, to make their breasts larger. Are these women mentally ill?

Quite possibly.

Or do you agree that there are "rational" reasons for having body parts removed or added? And if you DO agree that there are rational reasons for having body parts removed or added, who are you and TH to spout to the world which reasons are rational and which are irrational? Who are you to declare that it's "impossible" for a totally rational person to decide that their life will be happier if they do or don't have a penis or vagina or breasts?

Who are you to say that it is "impossible" for a totally rational person to decide that their life would be happier if they didn't have legs anymore?

 

[smackababy]

Who are you to say that it is "impossible" for a totally rational person to decide that their life would be happier if they didn't have legs anymore?

If a person really wants to do that, I am all for it. However, unlike sexual reassignment surgery, there is really no way to "simulate" or transition into being an amputee. Transgenders don't just wake up one day and go "well, I want my penis chopped off!" and then get it done a week later. There are requirements (psychiatric evaluations, hormone treatment, living as the opposite gender full time for at least 1 year prior to surgery). It isn't some decision made lightly. If someone who wanted to be an amputee (or any other kind of major elective surgery) could meet all those requirements and the result has no impact on the rights of others, I am all for it.

 

[shira]

Pretty sure that cancer and back pain count as physical ailments.

So the only possible "rational" reason that someone can want to change their physical body is an "ailment?"

Who are you to say that it is "impossible" for a totally rational person to decide that their life would be happier if they didn't have legs anymore?

I never said this would be impossible. It definitely IS possible.

Now answer my own question: Who are you to tell us that it's "impossible" for someone to be fully rational and decide that they would be much happier if they had a penis, vagina, or breasts removed from or added to their body?

 

[Oldgamer]

I haven't read all the posts on this thread, but didn't this guy / girl get reinstated? I think so... in fact I remember there were parents who supported this teacher and pitched a fit and got the teachers job back.

 

[nehalem256]

If a person really wants to do that, I am all for it. However, unlike sexual reassignment surgery, there is really no way to "simulate" or transition into being an amputee. Transgenders don't just wake up one day and go "well, I want my penis chopped off!" and then get it done a week later. There are requirements (psychiatric evaluations, hormone treatment, living as the opposite gender full time for at least 1 year prior to surgery). It isn't some decision made lightly. If someone who wanted to be an amputee (or any other kind of major elective surgery) could meet all those requirements and the result has no impact on the rights of others, I am all for it.

Sure there is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=crIlBVCSPjg

And it would seem you agree then that wanting to cut off your penis is basically the same thing as cutting off your leg.

So the only possible "rational" reason that someone can want to change their physical body is an "ailment?"

I never said this would be impossible. It definitely IS possible.

The only rational reason to want to cut of a body part is an ailment. That seems pretty simple.

Now answer my own question: Who are you to tell us that it's "impossible" for someone to be fully rational and decide that they would be much happier if they had a penis, vagina, or breasts removed from or added to their body?

So the only thing that determines mental illness is "happiness"?

So if a person is "happy" hearing voices in their head then they aren't mentally ill?

 

[smackababy]

Sure there is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=crIlBVCSPjg

And it would seem you agree then that wanting to cut off your penis is basically the same thing as cutting off your leg.

Can't see the youtube link, but I hardly think any technology exists that simulates not having an arm or a leg.

And, cutting off an appendage is "technically the same thing" from a basic standpoint, however, the transition from male to female is a far more complex change than simply the sexual reassignment surgery. So, while the surgery itself might be similar (one being far more reconstructive and complicated, though), I don't see them as the same. That doesn't mean I take it upon myself to be the "moral police" and say people shouldn't be able to do it though.

Also, I like your example of people hearing voices in their head as a mental illness. So, everyone who has spoken to and gotten a response from God suffers from mental illness? How about Jesus himself? Andrea Yates? She heard a voice from God that told her to drown her 5 children.

 

[nehalem256]

Can't see the youtube link, but I hardly think any technology exists that simulates not having an arm or a leg.

And, cutting off an appendage is "technically the same thing" from a basic standpoint, however, the transition from male to female is a far more complex change than simply the sexual reassignment surgery. So, while the surgery itself might be similar (one being far more reconstructive and complicated, though), I don't see them as the same. That doesn't mean I take it upon myself to be the "moral police" and say people shouldn't be able to do it though.

The video shows a man who wants to amputate his leg. In order to simulate not having his leg he ties it up and uses crutches. Not exactly advanced technology.

Also, I like your example of people hearing voices in their head as a mental illness. So, everyone who has spoken to and gotten a response from God suffers from mental illness? How about Jesus himself? Andrea Yates? She heard a voice from God that told her to drown her 5 children.

So we are clear are you saying that Andrea Yates was not mentally ill when she heard a voice telling her to drown her children?

 

[smackababy]

The video shows a man who wants to amputate his leg. In order to simulate not having his leg he ties it up and uses crutches. Not exactly advanced technology.

That doesn't really simulate not having a leg, simply not using one.

So we are clear are you saying that Andrea Yates was not mentally ill when she heard a voice telling her to drown her children?

I'm saying your distinction on who hears the voice of God and who is mentally is is pretty arbitrary. Was Abraham mentally ill? He heard a voice that told him to kill his own son.

 

[nehalem256]

That doesn't really simulate not having a leg, simply not using one.

The point wasn't to simulate "not having a leg" literally. It was to simulate living as an amputee.

However, unlike sexual reassignment surgery, there is really no way to "simulate" or transition into being an amputee.

So tying up your leg so it is unusable as a leg and hopping a round on your remaining leg with crutches would seem to accomplish that.

I'm saying your distinction on who hears the voice of God and who is mentally is is pretty arbitrary. Was Abraham mentally ill? He heard a voice that told him to kill his own son.

That would depend on your religious faith now wouldn't it?

And the distinction is not arbitrary at all. If God really is talking to you then you are not mentally ill.

 

[shira]

Sure there is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=crIlBVCSPjg

And it would seem you agree then that wanting to cut off your penis is basically the same thing as cutting off your leg.

No. I wrote that wanting to cut off one's penis can be rational. And wanting to cut off one's legs can also be rational. That doesn't mean that anyone who wants to cut off their penis also wants to cut of their legs.

But do try to keep up. And thanks for your intellectually dishonest attempt at oversimplification.

The only rational reason to want to cut of a body part is an ailment. That seems pretty simple.

OK. Then if the "ailment" is that the existence or lack of a penis is causing a person great suffering, and a mental health practitioner with extensive training in this area evaluates the mental state of the person and determines that the person's suffering is caused by a rational and unalterable perception that the person is of a different gender than their physical body, you agree that wanting to add or remove the penis is completely sane. Because as you've stated, an "ailment" is justification for removing (or adding) a body part.

So the only thing that determines mental illness is "happiness"?

No. You've conveniently removed the word "rational."

Again, thanks for the intellectual dishonesty.

So if a person is "happy" hearing voices in their head then they aren't mentally ill?

If a person hearing voices in their head is diagnosed with schizophrenia, then they're mentally ill. But if a thorough diagnosis determines that the voices in their head are caused by an implanted radio receiver, then they're not mentally ill.

The problem you're having is a lack in imagination. You're unable to imagine that there are many, many possible causes for a person's thoughts and beliefs. You're unable to understand that your inability to imagine a rational and compelling reason that a completely sane person might want to remove their penis (or other body part) doesn't mean that everyone with that desire is mentally ill. In your universe, there are only a few possible explanations for human behavior, so you label people "A" or "B" simply because you aren't smart enough to understand that "C," "D," and "E" also exist.

To put this another way, you're guilty of circular reasoning. You're assuming that anyone who wants to add or removed a sexual body part MUST be mentally ill. Yet pretty much all of the major mental health bodies now recognize that being a transgender person is not a mental illness. But of course you know better.