Texas Judge Rules For Cheerleaders In Bible Banner Suit

[child of wonder]

I think we should all enjoy the irony of Christians displaying Bible verses in support of their FOOTBALL TEAM.

As if god cares who wins.

 

[WelshBloke]

I think we should all enjoy the irony of Christians displaying Bible verses in support of their FOOTBALL TEAM.

As if god cares who wins.

I was more enjoying the scantily clad women with Bible verses irony quotient myself.

 

[kage69]

I think we should all enjoy the irony of Christians displaying Bible verses in support of their FOOTBALL TEAM.

As if god cares who wins.

Just once, instead of the usual "I'd like to thank god" victory speech, I want to hear someone explain a loss with a "we didn't win because Jesus made me fumble."

 

[nehalem256]

1. Doesnt that imply that there are certain rules governing football games on public facilities and we must all follow them, even if free speech is not fully available?

2. Atheism is not a religion, so no.

1.) Nope its completely different. The school put into place a rule specifically to suppress religion. Not allowing you to run onto the field has nothing to do with speech. If you ran onto the field and were absolutely silent you will still be arrested.

2.) This is really just a problem with the English language. There is no word that encompasses both religion+atheism. And again the Constitution prohibits laws from preventing the free exercise of religion.

 

[shortylickens]

Since when do students on school property have free speech? They are barred from wearing all kind of stuff with messages on them already. I recall students being sent home to change their clothes when in school, they don't have all the right of citizens. I smell bias from the bench (Christian judge in Texas). Bad decision. Screw their free speech unless they are off school property on their own time.

Despite popular opinion to the contrary, kids in public high school DO have free speech, just not as much as when they are at home.

I would not knee-jerk react to any school situation until I had checked up on their state and local laws first.

 

[Moonbeam]

God said he helps those who help themselves. How about if the cheerleaders want to use that piece of Biblical right winded conservative wisdom and offend entitlement liberals?

 

[Todd33]

Despite popular opinion to the contrary, kids in public high school DO have free speech, just not as much as when they are at home.

So we are in agreement that to avoid controversy and the needless offending of anyone not of that one faith the school should be able to prohibit banners with religious quotes?

 

[halik]

"It is the individual speech of the cheerleaders and not in fact the government speaking," David Starnes, the cheerleaders' attorney said, according to KDFM television. "It is not just one girl or one person in the group that comes up with the quote, but it's on a rotating basis that each girl gets to pick the quote. That is their individual voices that are being portrayed on the banner."

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/10/1...se-banner-suit/?test=latestnews#ixzz29lgwJiUq

Don't really see the problem there. I don't see where the school is coercing anyone into/from religion.

 

[HomerJS]

For those in favor of cheerleaders displaying bible verses, let's change the players..

That town in Mi that has a heavy Muslim population some of their cheerleaders want to display signs "Alla akbar"

Can you imagine the human outcry by the right and Fox News?

 

[piasabird]

I think this is a joke. They are cheerleaders for a football team. Do people really believe they will see some reference to a bible quote and get baptized after the game? It is lie a sacrilegious act to use these quotes at football games. There is a time and place for everything.

 

[halik]

For those in favor of cheerleaders displaying bible verses, let's change the players..

That town in Mi that has a heavy Muslim population some of their cheerleaders want to display signs "Alla akbar"

Can you imagine the human outcry by the right and Fox News?

If it was the same set up, I don't see how anyone would/could bitch.

 

[tcsenter]

I think Hayabusa missed my point, which woolfe seems to get - in the role of cheerleaders, they don't *have* free speech - they're required to do what the school through adminstrators to coaches, etc., want them to do (provided that's within the law.)

Exactly. These aren't spectators in the bleachers hanging a banner from the side or displaying it on posters held in their hand (which everyone might be allowed to do). THAT would be permitted First Amendment speech. These are cheerleaders officially representing the school at a school-sponsored event, in school-approved or sponsored uniform, on a restricted area of the field or property where only those authorized as staff, participants, or others with some connection to the school or event are allowed.

But its Texas, it will take a federal court to teach them the limits of the law and free speech, like it took the US Supreme Court to tell them that they had to stop excluding Hispanics/Latinos from Texas juries.

 

[nehalem256]

But its Texas, it will take a federal court to teach them the limits of the law and free speech, like it took the US Supreme Court to tell them that they had to stop excluding Hispanics/Latinos from Texas juries.

Its Texas. Why shouldn't Texas be allowed to have cheerleaders use religious quotes on banners?

Is anyone experiencing any real harm from them doing so?

EDIT: And you wonder why conservatives want to give everyone vouchers to attend religious schools?

 

[CountZero]

It is a borderline case in many of the ways others have already pointed out but IMO it shouldn't be allowed at a football game by the official cheerleading squad of a public school.

As is frequently the case just flip the shoe on the other foot (use a verse from the koran for example) and I think most people would agree.

 

[SMOGZINN]

This opens the door for a huge can of worms - what if a non-religious student doesn't make it onto the squad - a claim of religious discrimination? What if a non-religious student is forced to hold up religious signs? A savvy parent in that district must be thinking "ka-ching!" over this decision.

I think this too. Schools fighting for this sort of thing is a blatant waste of taxpayers dollars. There is no legitimate reason for the school to want to fight this. It is only being fought because individual members of the school board is bringing their religious bias into it. If they looked at it logically they would see that even if they won it is just likely to cause expensive problems later down the road, and they have a duty to be responcable stewards of the tax monies allocated to them.

Assuming that I understand the situation correctly (and of course my argument hinges on this), this was entirely the decision on the part of the cheerleaders and that there was no suggestion that the school discriminated against someone who did not do what the others did.

Cheerleaders are an official symbol of that school, as are the banners they are displaying. It would be like Pepsi putting racist quotes on their bottles and then saying that it is not their company saying that but the individuals in marketing.

But explicitly prohibiting religious expression would seem to be worse that an implicit possibility of support.

Not when being done by a government institution. In that case religious endorsement becomes discriminatory of anyone not of that religion. The government must not

Couldn't prohibiting any religious expression be considered an implicit endorsement of Atheism?

No. Just because religion is not mentioned does not mean religious people are not accepted.
Explicitly anti-religious statements should probably be treated the same as religious speech for this sort of thing since it can give the appearance of fostering a discriminatory stance.
So, "Go Cougars!" would be okay.
But neither "Go Cougars! There is not god!" nor "Go Cougars! Corinthians 9:25" would be acceptable.

 

[piasabird]

Children at a school do not have freedom of speech. They are mostly minors.

 

[cybrsage]

The deal is that everyone gets a chance to create the sign they want - but then when it is religious it must be stopped. Either all or none...either allow both religious and non-religious or neither. Banning religious but allowing non-religious is wrong.

 

[Todd33]

Its Texas. Why shouldn't Texas be allowed to have cheerleaders use religious quotes on banners?

Is anyone experiencing any real harm from them doing so?

EDIT: And you wonder why conservatives want to give everyone vouchers to attend religious schools?

You are being a hypocrit. You only support it because it reflects your bias. What heppens when someone tries it with a group or religion you don't support?

Sura3 3:64: “Verily Allah has cursed the Unbelievers and has prepared for them a Blazing Fire to dwell in forever. No protector will they find, nor savior. That Day their faces will be turned upside down in the Fire.

That is fine for a public school cheerleader banner who is a Muslim right? Come on freedom of speech!

At least FFRF supporters are consistent - no religious quotes for any official school event. No harm done, no one offended.

 

[cybrsage]

No signs at all then, why only ban religion? Why only allow atheism?

 

[mchammer187]

No signs at all then, why only ban religion? Why only allow atheism?

Secular != atheism.

So a non-religious sign that says "Go Team" is atheist?

I don't think anyone is saying signs that say "There is no God" should be allowed and bible quotes not.

 

[Todd33]

No signs at all then, why only ban religion? Why only allow atheism?

Wow, I hope you are joking.

 

[cybrsage]

Nope. Why ban students from speaking/writing about religious things but allow them to speak/write about non-religious things? Why is a student not allowed to state a religious view but allowed to state a non-religious view?

Either both or none.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Cheerleaders are an official symbol of that school, as are the banners they are displaying. It would be like Pepsi putting racist quotes on their bottles and then saying that it is not their company saying that but the individuals in marketing.

Cheerleaders are officially people. They aren't a corporation, nor are they putting racist statements on anything. They aren't hired by the school, cheerleading is a social function, not one of business unless they are paid. Using your criteria if after a game victory a cheerleader thought it was a gift from God that they won, and a reporter asked her why she she thought her team won she'd have to reply "I'm sorry but I'm not allowed to tell you." What a joke that would be. I think you are going to have a hard time selling that gag order to any court.