Terry Schiavo allowed to die

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: BDawg
According to CNN.com, the tube has been removed.

I wish they could euthanize her instead of letting her starve.

Yep, slow death has begun:

Brain-Damaged Woman's Feeding Tube Removed

Outside Schiavo's hospice, about 30 people keeping vigil dropped to their knees in prayer when word spread of the judge's ruling calling for removal of the tube.

"What can wash away our sins? Nothing but the blood of Jesus," they sang. Messages on protest signs included "Impeach Greer.com," a reference to the judge, and "Execution ? It's Not Just for the Guilty Anymore."

House Majority Leader Tom DeLay, R-Texas, told reporters in Washington earlier Friday that removal of the tube amounted to "barbarism."

Fvcking loonies...Personally, if I were in this woman's shoes I'd welcome death and I would resent these idiots trying to keep me alive. Living like that is no kind of life for anyone and her parents choosing to not let her go does NOT count as a valid reason to keep her alive.

These "life first" religous nuts have even less of a valid reason. God damn, I usually vote conservative because the extreme left scares me more than the right but this fvcking crazy. I'm seriously considering abandoning these self righteous bastards and switching parties.

Her husband knew her best and knew what she would have wanted. They should have granted this request 15 years ago.

 

[totalcommand]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: BDawg
According to CNN.com, the tube has been removed.

I wish they could euthanize her instead of letting her starve.

Yep, slow death has begun:

Brain-Damaged Woman's Feeding Tube Removed

Outside Schiavo's hospice, about 30 people keeping vigil dropped to their knees in prayer when word spread of the judge's ruling calling for removal of the tube.

"What can wash away our sins? Nothing but the blood of Jesus," they sang. Messages on protest signs included "Impeach Greer.com," a reference to the judge, and "Execution ? It's Not Just for the Guilty Anymore."

House Majority Leader Tom DeLay, R-Texas, told reporters in Washington earlier Friday that removal of the tube amounted to "barbarism."

Fvcking loonies...Personally, if I were in this woman's shoes I'd welcome death and I would resent these idiots trying to keep me alive. Living like that is no kind of life for anyone and her parents choosing to not let her go does NOT count as a valid reason to keep her alive.

These "life first" religous nuts have even less of a valid reason. God damn, I usually vote conservative because the extreme left scares me more than the right but this fvcking crazy. I'm seriously considering abandoning these self righteous bastards and switching parties.

Her husband knew her best and knew what she would have wanted. They should have granted this request 15 years ago.

:thumbsup:

 

[Riprorin]

After Terri collapsed from unknown causes in 1990, she became profoundly cognitively disabled.
Michael filed a medical-malpractice lawsuit, during which he said he would care for her for the rest of her life, which, assuming proper care, would be a normal lifespan. He also presented at trial a medical-rehabilitation expert who had developed a plan to provide support for Terri to maximize her ability to respond to her environment.
A jury awarded $1.3 million in the malpractice case, of which $750,000 was put in trust to pay for the kind of care that Michael promised to provide Terri.
Michael never kept his promise.
Within months of the money being deposited in the bank, Michael ordered a do-not-resuscitate order placed on Terri's chart. He has also repeatedly denied her other forms of medical care, such as treatment for infections.
Once the money was in the bank, according to affidavits filed by nurses under penalty of perjury, Michael ordered that Terri be denied stimulation.
In the mid 1990s, according to another nurse's affidavit filed under penalty of perjury, Michael was overheard saying things such as, "When is she going to die," "Has she died yet?" and "When is that bitch going to die?" (This affidavit was only recently filed. Michael has not yet filed a response.)
Michael dated after the malpractice trial; he is now engaged to be married. He lives with his fiancé, with whom he has one child and another on the way. He reportedly plans to marry his fiancé as soon as his wife's death is induced.
Money that was intended to pay for Terri's treatment and rehabilitation has instead gone to lawyers Michael retained to obtain a court order to bring about her death.
If Terri dies, Michael will inherit what is left of the $750,000 (if any remains) and all other property they owned.
Michael moved Terri from a nursing home to a hospice three years ago even though Terri is not terminally ill. A hospice specializes in dying patients and is not as equipped to provide patients like Terri with proper care.

Link

Quite a loving husband.

 

[Infohawk]

Originally posted by: Riprorin
Quite a loving husband.

IF he actually said that. You would believe he's a satanist if someone suggested it to you. Because you are a sheep-human hybrid.

 

[Darkhawk28]

I think making this terrible situation into a political ploy is just plain ugly.

Frankly, I don't know what I'd do in this situation (assuming the husband was on the up-and-up and a caring individual). I don't think anybody would know unless they face it, which I hope no one does.

One thing this has done and what should be the overriding message in all this is: make a living will. I'm drawing mine up tonight.

 

[Aegeon]

Originally posted by: Riprorin
After Terri collapsed from unknown causes in 1990, she became profoundly cognitively disabled.
Michael filed a medical-malpractice lawsuit, during which he said he would care for her for the rest of her life, which, assuming proper care, would be a normal lifespan. He also presented at trial a medical-rehabilitation expert who had developed a plan to provide support for Terri to maximize her ability to respond to her environment.
A jury awarded $1.3 million in the malpractice case, of which $750,000 was put in trust to pay for the kind of care that Michael promised to provide Terri.
Michael never kept his promise.
Within months of the money being deposited in the bank, Michael ordered a do-not-resuscitate order placed on Terri's chart. He has also repeatedly denied her other forms of medical care, such as treatment for infections.
Once the money was in the bank, according to affidavits filed by nurses under penalty of perjury, Michael ordered that Terri be denied stimulation.
In the mid 1990s, according to another nurse's affidavit filed under penalty of perjury, Michael was overheard saying things such as, "When is she going to die," "Has she died yet?" and "When is that bitch going to die?" (This affidavit was only recently filed. Michael has not yet filed a response.)
Michael dated after the malpractice trial; he is now engaged to be married. He lives with his fiancé, with whom he has one child and another on the way. He reportedly plans to marry his fiancé as soon as his wife's death is induced.
Money that was intended to pay for Terri's treatment and rehabilitation has instead gone to lawyers Michael retained to obtain a court order to bring about her death.
If Terri dies, Michael will inherit what is left of the $750,000 (if any remains) and all other property they owned.
Michael moved Terri from a nursing home to a hospice three years ago even though Terri is not terminally ill. A hospice specializes in dying patients and is not as equipped to provide patients like Terri with proper care.

Link

Quite a loving husband.

The basic argument is preposterous, the husband has recently declined huge amounts of money to let her live, far more than the money we're talking about here. The last point is also stupid, if she was able to recover, she would have done it to some degree before now. It also undermines the argument that exceptional means are not being used to keep her alive if they are arguing a hospice can't handle it. There's simply pretty much nothing left when you look at the brain scan. Without further information, the allegation that is bolded is worthless. The first obvious question is whether the nurse was even in a position to hear what was alleged? (A related question is whether the things heard came from more than one person and what exactly was said.) Another obvious question is whether the nurse might have any obvious potential interest in the case? Those who want to keep Terry Schiavo alive have clearly repeatedly lied about a variety of issues. Finally its worth noting that the penalty for perjury doesn't mean much in this case. The odds of someone being able to conclusively prove beyond a reasonable that a nurse didn't hear the husband say something are quite remote, especially if they can't pin her down to a specific data on when she supposedly heard that.

 

[Riprorin]

Terri has never had MRI or PET scan because Michael has repeatedly refused to consent to one even though they are standard tests for diagnosing PVS.

And how much more money can he make if he kills her and portrays himself as a principled, caring "husband"?

 

[Infohawk]

Originally posted by: Riprorin
Terri has never had MRI or PET scan because Michael has repeatedly refused to consent to one even though they are standard tests for diagnosing PVS.

And how much more money can he make if he kills her and portrays himself as a principled, caring "husband"?

Aegon made a great post. Can't you counter it rip?

 

[conehead433]

Jesus H. Christ folks,

Death with Dignity

 

[umbrella39]

Originally posted by: Infohawk

Originally posted by: Riprorin
Terri has never had MRI or PET scan because Michael has repeatedly refused to consent to one even though they are standard tests for diagnosing PVS.

And how much more money can he make if he kills her and portrays himself as a principled, caring "husband"?

Aegon made a great post. Can't you counter it rip?

No, but he is busily copying and pasting his next "opinion". Robosheep.

 

[preCRT]

Originally posted by: Riprorin
After Terri collapsed from unknown causes in 1990, she became profoundly cognitively disabled.

Baloney.

She had bulemia and her heart stopped because of the potassium imbalance as a result of the bulemia. Her parents and the right-wing religious wackos have been force-feeding what's left of this woman for the last 15 years. They didn't recognize her eating disorder 15 years ago, and they can't recognize the reality of her situation now.

Let her pass on with whatever shred of dignity can be salvaged from the drawn out mess caused by too many people butting into what should have been a strictly medical decision years ago.

 

[Red Dawn]

Frankly I believe that if sahe was Bulimic enough to cause this severe of a health problem I seriously doubt that any relationship her and her husband had was worthwhile. I can totally ubderstand why he would want to be done with her. Why doesn't the Husband just get a divorce and free himself of the burden and let her parents take over her care? She's their child, they should havce a say in the matter.

 

[preCRT]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Frankly I believe that if sahe was Bulimic enough to cause this severe of a health problem I seriously doubt that any relationship her and her husband had was worthwhile. I can totally ubderstand why he would want to be done with her. Why doesn't the Husband just get a divorce and free himself of the burden and let her parents take over her care? She's their child, they should havce a say in the matter.

The parents have no say, she was an adult married woman. Her parents' primary rights disappeared upon her marriage.

Did you ever consider that the husband loves/loved her enough to carry out her wishes and not his own selfish desires?




Isn't it sad that the same people who are screaming that her husband has no rights, that the parents' will should have the ultimate say, are generally the same people that claim that gays shouldn't be allowed to marry because marriage is a sacred bond, reserved only for a man and woman...:disgust:

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: preCRT

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Frankly I believe that if sahe was Bulimic enough to cause this severe of a health problem I seriously doubt that any relationship her and her husband had was worthwhile. I can totally ubderstand why he would want to be done with her. Why doesn't the Husband just get a divorce and free himself of the burden and let her parents take over her care? She's their child, they should havce a say in the matter.

The parents have no say, she was an adult married woman. Her parents' primary rights disappeared upon her marriage.

Did you ever consider that the husband loves/loved her enough to carry out her wishes and not his own selfish desires?

After readfing about his activities since she's been in a Coma ..NO!

Isn't it sad that the same people who are screaming that her husband has no rights, that the parents' will should have the ultimate say, are generally the same people that claim that gays shouldn't be allowed to marry because marriage is a sacred bond, reserved only for a man and woman...:disgust:

Well that's not the case with me.

 

[Gaard]

Originally posted by: preCRT
Isn't it sad that the same people who are screaming that her husband has no rights, that the parents' will should have the ultimate say, are generally the same people that claim that gays shouldn't be allowed to marry because marriage is a sacred bond, reserved only for a man and woman...:disgust:

It sure would be interesting to see the results of a quick search of the gay marriage threads and this one. I'm going to look at homes right now, but maybe when I get back...

 

[Buz2b]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Frankly I believe that if sahe was Bulimic enough to cause this severe of a health problem I seriously doubt that any relationship her and her husband had was worthwhile. I can totally ubderstand why he would want to be done with her. Why doesn't the Husband just get a divorce and free himself of the burden and let her parents take over her care? She's their child, they should havce a say in the matter.

Being bulimic doesn't translate into marital problems or cast any "serious doubt" about the relationship between her and her husband. And he doesn't seem to want to be "done with her" either. If that were the case he could have divorced her long ago; especially after the million dollar payoff for medical malpractice. Instead that money has gone for care of Terri and is now essentially gone. Yet he is still there. He has been offered millions by the family and others to divorce her; yet he stays. I think the pattern shows someone that cares deeply about his wife's wishes not to be kept alive like this. The parents, as witnessed by the court's decisions, don't have any more "rights" to control their daughters care; it's the husbands. That's what marraige is all about.
To others that say she is a viable life and is entitled to live on, what gives you the right to make decisions for her? How do YOU claim to know what is best for Terri?
She needs to be allowed to die, as the courts have ruled were her wishes, according to the husband. My wife and I have talked about our wishes on a few occasions but I/we don't really discuss them in detail with our family. Instead, we put them down on paper in an Advanced Health Care Directive. If that would have been done in this case, we wouldn't be arguing. Try to put yourself in the husbands situation. Suppose he and Terri had just such discussions where she made it plain that she DID NOT wish to merely "exist" in a vegetative state with no real chance of any quality of life. Suppose she DID tell hm to NEVER let that happen? If you were in his place would you do any different?
Rip, as to that article you so proudly quoted, it was both one-sided and very dated; written back in 2003. Since that time the courts have gone through numerous reviews, entertained various motions and made their decisions. If there had been any validity to those claims, the outcome would have been different.

 

[preCRT]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Frankly I believe that if sahe was Bulimic enough to cause this severe of a health problem I seriously doubt that any relationship her and her husband had was worthwhile. I can totally ubderstand why he would want to be done with her. Why doesn't the Husband just get a divorce and free himself of the burden and let her parents take over her care? She's their child, they should havce a say in the matter.

As was stated above, bulemia, or any illness, is not correlative with the state of their marriage, any more than saying if she had cancer it was a worthless marriage.


Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: preCRT

Did you ever consider that the husband loves/loved her enough to carry out her wishes and not his own selfish desires?

After readfing about his activities since she's been in a Coma ..NO!

His activities? She's been in a vegetative state for 15 years, should he have become a monk? He found love and a life; I sure as heck wouldn't want my spouse to spend the rest of his life alone and without love after I'm gone.


Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: preCRT

Isn't it sad that the same people who are screaming that her husband has no rights, that the parents' will should have the ultimate say, are generally the same people that claim that gays shouldn't be allowed to marry because marriage is a sacred bond, reserved only for a man and woman...:disgust:

Well that's not the case with me.

I said 'generally', not ALL.

 

[Buz2b]

Originally posted by: preCRT

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Frankly I believe that if sahe was Bulimic enough to cause this severe of a health problem I seriously doubt that any relationship her and her husband had was worthwhile. I can totally ubderstand why he would want to be done with her. Why doesn't the Husband just get a divorce and free himself of the burden and let her parents take over her care? She's their child, they should havce a say in the matter.

The parents have no say, she was an adult married woman. Her parents' primary rights disappeared upon her marriage.

Did you ever consider that the husband loves/loved her enough to carry out her wishes and not his own selfish desires?




Isn't it sad that the same people who are screaming that her husband has no rights, that the parents' will should have the ultimate say, are generally the same people that claim that gays shouldn't be allowed to marry because marriage is a sacred bond, reserved only for a man and woman...:disgust:

Where the heck did that come from? Why are you trying to link two obviously differing subjects? Whether or not someone supports gay marriage has nothing to do with supporting a husband's right to control the care of his ill wife according to her wishes. Debate the issue at hand. Don't try to pollute it by bringing in other unrelated arguments. There is nothing inconsistent with supporting a sacred bond of marriage between a man and a woman and opposing gay marriage. The issue here isn't marriage, gay or otherwise; it's about the patients right to die with the dignity they reportedly made plain clear to their spouse. Give it a break and stick to the issues. Talk about a witch hunt.

Besides, you are also grouping people in a stereotypical manner. Just to throw water on your perceived fire, I'm a conservative (just like those ones you claim want her to live) but I am against trying to perserve her "life" as it is. I support the husband's rights in this case, in wanting her to die with dignity. Oh, but I also oppose gay marraige. Oops! I guess you can't group us all together like you wanted, now can you? But I digress as you did. Let's just get back to the subject at hand. If you want to start another thread (among the many) about gay marriage, go ahead; just don't start it here.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Buz2b

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Frankly I believe that if sahe was Bulimic enough to cause this severe of a health problem I seriously doubt that any relationship her and her husband had was worthwhile. I can totally ubderstand why he would want to be done with her. Why doesn't the Husband just get a divorce and free himself of the burden and let her parents take over her care? She's their child, they should havce a say in the matter.

How do YOU claim to know what is best for Terri?
q]

I don't claim to know what's best. I wouldn't want to be in a position to make a decision like this, either as a husband or a judge ruling on the matter.

 

[Starbuck1975]

Quite a loving husband.

Kind of hard to love a vegetable.

I do not blame the husband for any of this, especially considering what his in-laws have put him through for the last 15 years...for 15 years he has been unable to move on with his life because of this entire fiasco...Terry Schiavo has been dead for some time now...what her parents are trying to save is a memory, nothing more.

 

[classy]

Originally posted by: Riprorin
Terri has never had MRI or PET scan because Michael has repeatedly refused to consent to one even though they are standard tests for diagnosing PVS.

And how much more money can he make if he kills her and portrays himself as a principled, caring "husband"?

She is already DEAD. Don't you understand that?

 

[catnap1972]

Originally posted by: classy

Originally posted by: Riprorin
Terri has never had MRI or PET scan because Michael has repeatedly refused to consent to one even though they are standard tests for diagnosing PVS.

And how much more money can he make if he kills her and portrays himself as a principled, caring "husband"?

She is already DEAD. Don't you understand that?

Ignore him--he's in a vegitative state of his own

 

[GoPackGo]

Originally posted by: classy

Originally posted by: Riprorin
Terri has never had MRI or PET scan because Michael has repeatedly refused to consent to one even though they are standard tests for diagnosing PVS.

And how much more money can he make if he kills her and portrays himself as a principled, caring "husband"?

She is already DEAD. Don't you understand that?

No she is not...she can laugh, cry, smile and recognize people...she is not in a coma...she just cant talk or move...but I guess she has tried to communicate and might be able to with the right treatment...show me a brain scan that shows NO activity.

 

[CaptnKirk]

No she is not...she can laugh, cry, smile and recognize people...she is not in a coma...she just cant talk or move...but I guess she has tried to communicate and might be able to with the right treatment...show me a brain scan that shows NO activity[/b]

No she can't - although there are some that say thet she appears to do these things,
they are grasping for things that they think they see, but the doctors say it's not really happening, he parents are looking for some - any, indication.

She's in a Hydroponic state - kept alive only because of a automatic reflex called
breathing, and she's feed throuh a service tube in her abdominal wall, hydrated through
intraveneous soultions, and evacuated with a cathater & bedpan.

There's no way she can sustain any sembalance of a quasi-normal life function without
the continued intervention by medical life support mechanisms.

Even Franco has stayed dead for 20 years, despite medical intervention.

 

[Riprorin]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Frankly I believe that if sahe was Bulimic enough to cause this severe of a health problem I seriously doubt that any relationship her and her husband had was worthwhile. I can totally ubderstand why he would want to be done with her. Why doesn't the Husband just get a divorce and free himself of the burden and let her parents take over her care? She's their child, they should havce a say in the matter.

She's in the state she's in now because of medical malpractice.

Her "husband" has witheld physical therapy which has caused her body to become contorted.

He has also refused MRI and PET brain scans which would help diagnose the extent of her brain injury.

What a guy.

The nurse who signed the sworn affadavit that he said "when's the bitch going to die?" seems quite beleiveable given his behavior.