Tank vs tankless hot water system?

[digiram]

My current hot water tank is leaking and I need to replace it. Was thinking about going with the tankless system. Anyone have experience going from one to the other? What are your thoughts? Worth the upfront cost?

Moved from OT.
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[shortylickens]

gramma has a tankless heater. it seems pretty nice. but my uncle paid for it and takes care of it for her, so neither she nor I know how it works nor how much maintenance it needs.

 

[Red Squirrel]

Been debating myself about that since my rental is at a point where I should be thinking of replacing it, and I want to break out of the contract and just own my own tank instead, otherwise I could call them and get a "free" one but then I keep having to pay per month. If you go tankless you may as well go with the dual pipe condensing type. closed loop combustion so it's not sucking your warm house air outside. It will be the most efficient. They are not exactly cheap though. For a professional installation you're looking at around 5 grand. If you buy it and install yourself maybe like 2 grand, but may still need to get a licensed pipe fitter to do the gas so that might be another grand (I got quoted like 2 but this really depends on the particular install).

Question to ask yourself is how long until the higher efficiency makes up for the extra cost and if it's worth it. They are also more complex so more likely to fail at some point while a simpler tank unit can last for a decade or more.

On the other extreme I'm even toying with just going with an old school electric tank instead. Kinda one extreme to the other. They are cheap and also don't involve any venting so nothing stops me from insulating the crap out of it so heat retention will be better for both the tank and the house too as no vents going outside. Vents essentially mean lot of your house's heat is lost since it's not like there's a damper that closes, especially with the old style tanks with pilot light.

I'm kind of leaning towards electric myself as it will be something super easy to install and technically 100% efficient. I could even get fancy by setting up scheduling so it does not continue keeping the water hot when I don't need it. But I heard of that being bad due to pathogens being able to build in it, so something I would need to look up more. Need 4 breaker spaces for those too so I'd have lot of cleaning up to do in my panel to free up that many spaces.

The thing to remember with tankless is if it's undersized it may not be able to heat the water hot enough especially in winter. With a tank, an undersized (BTU wise) unit just takes longer to heat the water but it eventually reaches the right temp.

 

[NutBucket]

gramma has a tankless heater. it seems pretty nice. but my uncle paid for it and takes care of it for her, so neither she nor I know how it works nor how much maintenance it needs.

Not anymore than a tank. They say you should drain/flush the tank yearly but does anyone ever do it? Same with replacing the anode every few years.

 

[vi edit]

I'm in a home now with a tankless. It's...eh. It's fine *once* you get hot water to the faucet/shower. But good lord is it painfully slow to get there. I may as well not even have hot water for hand washing. Trying to get water up to temp for dishes takes forever. I feel like I waste so much water trying to get it hot.

 

[Greenman]

It's all about use. Tankless sucks for small use like washing your hands. I only use them when there is no place to put a tank.

 

[digiram]

Thanks for all the input. Given the upfront cost and the fact that there isn’t a lack of space in my basement at all. I think I’ll just stick with replacing current tank with larger tank.

 

[Red Squirrel]

It's all about use. Tankless sucks for small use like washing your hands. I only use them when there is no place to put a tank.

That's actually good to know... seems a tankless would make less sense for me in that case.

 

[NutBucket]

Newer ones are fine when you don't have the faucet open full bore. I think older ones didn't work as well for light loads.

The issue of delayed hot water...while I get your point there is also a delay to flush the standing cold water out of the pipe. I think there are also hybrid "tankless" heaters that have small (like 2 gallon) tanks to alleviate this issue.

Other than space the real benefit is not keeping 40-90 gallons of water constantly hot. But then in a cold climate you really need A LOT of BTUs to heat the colder incoming water. In a hot climate, i would argue there is less benefit since it doesn't take as much energy to keep that tank heated.

 

[Micrornd]

Been debating myself about that since my rental is at a point where I should be thinking of replacing it, and I want to break out of the contract and just own my own tank instead

Am I the only one that just doesn't get this Canadian concept of renting a water heater
It just seems squirrelly to me

 

[NutBucket]

Aaron's comes to mind....

 

[Micrornd]

That's "rent to own", and they don't rent water heaters.

 

[herm0016]

we liked our tankless and put one in our rental unit to save space. gas or electric? tankless is only good if its gas or you have a huge electrical service. you also need to size it for the incoming water temperature and max gpm of use. some units will not handle an 80 degree temp increase at a reasonable gpm. incoming water temp depends on where you live.

 

[Greenman]

we liked our tankless and put one in our rental unit to save space. gas or electric? tankless is only good if its gas or you have a huge electrical service. you also need to size it for the incoming water temperature and max gpm of use. some units will not handle an 80 degree temp increase at a reasonable gpm. incoming water temp depends on where you live.

Some things just don't make sense. If you need a service upgrade to run the heater the total cost is significant.
I wonder is a Tesla power wall would put out enough amperage to run one?

 

[herm0016]

Some things just don't make sense. If you need a service upgrade to run the heater the total cost is significant.
I wonder is a Tesla power wall would put out enough amperage to run one?

nope. powerwalls are max 5kw and a tankless electric is in the 24 to 50+ kw range.

 

[Red Squirrel]

Am I the only one that just doesn't get this Canadian concept of renting a water heater
It just seems squirrelly to me

I don't get it either TBH. It's just a thing. Didn't realize it was only here though. It's very hard to get out of these contracts too that's why when you buy a house normally it's a rental by default.

I found out that I do have the option of getting out of it if I drop the tank off myself at a specified location though so when I decide to swap out the tank I will do just that. I have a truck now so I can actually bring it myself. If they come pick it up you still have to pay $100 to get out of the contract. If you keep the tank (even a 10 year old tank) it's like $600.

My sister got suckered into a contract for a furnace. Like $100/mo or something like that. She sold her house and the new owner made her break out of the contract, it was like 20 grand. I did not even realize that was an option when buying though, or I would have done the same with the water heater. That could potentially create a deal breaker situation where they don't take your offer though, so it's threading on dangerous waters if you make too many demands and you really want the house.

Going with a rental was a bad decision on her part and she realized it after. Even if you can't afford to replace your furnace you're better off putting it on credit than going with these companies. At least with credit, it will be paid off eventually and you own it.

 

[NutBucket]

Rental would only make sense if the renting company was responsible for all repairs (like renting an apartment/house).

 

[Greenman]

Rental would only make sense if the renting company was responsible for all repairs (like renting an apartment/house).

A water heater is $800, and will probably last 10 years. If the rent is more than 100 bucks a year it's a losing game.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

If heated by gas, tankless is the way to go just over size it a little
If electric heating do not go tankless, they can’t handle as much water and per 2 electricians and 1 plumber they have an alarming failure rate. Go with a hybrid electric heater instead.