Suprised by # of conversative here, thought most Tech geeks would be liberal!

[CPA]

First off, time and time again, it's been shown there are more liberal posters here than conservative.

Second off, that is one the most inane generalizations I've read in a long, long time.

 

[Svnla]

I am neither conservative or liberal. I am more into "middle of the road". Both D/liberal and R/conservative have some good idea and plenty of bad.

 

[Craig234]

That is still an improvement over liberalism, whose ideology promotes single motherhood, and then complains when they end up in poverty.

95% of what's said about liberals here is wrong or lies, I can't remember the other 5%.

The left doesn't "promote" single motherhood; one of the great myths of the right is to be ignorant of the horrible situations for large numbers of women in 'the good old days'.

Whether it was women trapped in terrible, abusive marriages, or young women with their lives destroyed when they got pregnant, it wasn't some utopia.

Rather, the left supports policies allowing single mothers and their children to not suffer horribly - which is both the humane thing to do and good for society.

The right has no practical policies to suggest - only hate and scorn and disastrous policies.

How productive are the children later without their basic needs being met? You would simply cause suffering, and many people without education, poor, criminals for no reason.

No reason but the satisfaction of wagging your finger at them satisfied for no aid.

 

[CallMeJoe]

Im sure that is why it is was the Democrats who decided to recall the governor of Wisconsin... and then complain that he was spending time on the recall instead of job creation :\

A non sequitur response to a parody reply...
you might want to tend to your nutrition and mental exercises lest you become even more prematurely "conservative".

 

[Craig234]

Isn't a strict Democrat or Republican the most likely person to be brainwashed?

No. While some are bette suited to the ignorant, any member of any of the main groups can be pretty brainwashed or not. It's not a boolean, either - there are degrees.

This is where history is useful because any example I use to show one group brainwashed and not another, is talking to the people who are brainwahsed - they'll disagree.

But historical examples are useful to show big parts - often majorities - holding views that today was are happy to criticize.

I can't remember the source, but I recall it said that cold war leaders tended to view 'communists and homosexuals as the same thing'. Both were treated as suspiciois, and ineligble/unsuited for trust in the government (remember before Don't Ask Don't Tell for one example).

Ironically, according to Wiki:

"In the 1930s under Joseph Stalin, homosexuality... [was] recriminalised in the nation. Article 121 explicitly criminalised male same-sex intercourse and with five years of hard prison labor as a penalty. The law was condemned by several communists operating in Britain. The law remained intact until... 1993. Although the Nazis persecuted homosexuals during the Holocaust, Joseph Stalin regarded fascists and homosexuals as the same, and part of a far-right homosexual conspiracy."

Now, today, we might point to 'brainwashing' as affecting many of people with the harder anti-gay views historically (the great Alan Turing who did so much to help Britain win the war was repaid by charges involving sodomy driving him to kill himself - that's just how the issue was then).

So we can talk about extreme anti-gay views historically as an example of 'brainwashing' with less controversy, as the US and Britain, Stalin, Hitler all ran around persecuting gays and blaming each other as being allied with them, for an idea how irrational and nutty the situation was, taking advantage of a basic bigotry for their own political gain.

We can find many other examples of even more intentional 'brainwashing' for political gain.

I don't see any TV news station shoving Libertarian ideology down people's throats.

That's partly just an issue of power - very wrong things are 'pounded' because they have the money to get that to happen - and party wrong, there's a lot of libertarianism mixed in.

I don't see any TV news stations shoving 'leftist' views down people's throats either - and only a niche market for even 'progressive' views.

But there's plenty of shoving 'conservative' views. Name even the most liberal national TV show that doesn't repeatedly have right-wing guests expressing their views.

It seems like the third party/moderates would be the least brainwashed and people like yourself who parrot the party line (that they're fed from watching FOX/MSNBC/CNN/whatever) would be the most brainwashed.

First, I'm not 'fed' anything - my views are my views. I get some information from all kinds of courses including some from the networks - which I might agree with or not.

So, you can forget your lie on that issue you included.

Second to your larger point, that might seem like common sense, if you treat all shows with any point of view as all lying to 'brainwash' people - but that's a false assumption.

And in my opinion, the people in 'the middle' are typically not 'the best informed, agreeing and disagreeing with some from each side', but the least informed.

People who hold rational views can agree with 'one side' generally, a large amount of the time - that is not precluded by reaching their own views. What if one side is mostly right?

It's the lazy answer to try to say you have to be in 'the middle' to not be 'brainwashed' - the middle like anyone else has to have good reasons for their views. Fewer do IMO.

The question now is whether you can discuss rationally why you would argue based not on a rational view but assumption that a side is 'wrong' - your own 'bias' or 'brainwashing'.

'Moderates' are the main 'know-nothing' faction IMO; Republicans the 'know-wrong'.

You know something I can't remember ever hearing any response to from the 'right'? The fact of the multi-billion dollar industry aimed at the creation and distribution of propaganda.

Because you're too much the victims of that propaganda to discuss it.

 

[davmat787]

Any of this is irrelevant to me. I ask if a thing is right, if it is well considered, if it is proper. Left and right are meaningless constructs.

Which is what I think dwell meant by his definition of centrist. When I hear someone is a centrist or moderate here in the US, at least in relation to recent politics, I take that to mean they are neither R or D, right or left, but rather pick and choose as they see fit. They vote per issue, and not along any party line, and they vote for the candidate, not their party.

 

[Craig234]

The only proper position is what's 'right'.

Many 'centrists' make the basic mistake of thinking that a 'Democrat' or 'Republican' adopts positions of that party simply because they follow the party.

That is wrong and indefensible when it unfortunately does happen - but no more so than a 'centrist' holding that view that that's the only reason people hold such opinions.

If you think a minimum wage protects wages in general and prevents exploitation of workes and a sustinence slave labor market, fine - the fact that it happens to be the position of the Democrats, the fact you might join the Democrats to support the group who agrees with you doesn't mean you hold the view for anything but good reasons.

The fact there are people who stand to make a lot of money by slashing the cost of labor to sustience slave wages, and who pay propagandists to come up with arguments that will fool the more gullible to the wrong position - means that a lot of people are fooled tohave the wrong position. Even they don't just 'say it because Republicans do', necessarily.

And 'centrists' can have a position for good or bad reasons as well. But having some view that's just 'between the two parties' to be between them is wrong.

And thing usually aren't black and white - there are pros and cons. There is SOME negative side to a minimum wage - but do you understand good and bad?

Even if you support one - should it be $2 or $5 or $10 or $20? I rarely see any 'rational' discussion - only straw men, 'if you support any minimum wage you should support $1000 an hour then!' which I've seen countless times in this forum (lower than $1000 though) which shows nothing but the ignorance of the poster, that to THEM any minimum wage and an absurdly high one are the same, because they don't understand the need for one.

But the only acceptable standard for people is not to 'follow a party' for positions - that's bad whether it's any party or 'centrist'.

However, forming an opinion for good reasons that happens to agree with a party is not a bad thing, contrary to what many centrists claim.

 

[Matt1970]

95% of what's said about liberals here is wrong or lies, I can't remember the other 5%.

The left doesn't "promote" single motherhood; one of the great myths of the right is to be ignorant of the horrible situations for large numbers of women in 'the good old days'.

Whether it was women trapped in terrible, abusive marriages, or young women with their lives destroyed when they got pregnant, it wasn't some utopia.

Rather, the left supports policies allowing single mothers and their children to not suffer horribly - which is both the humane thing to do and good for society.

The right has no practical policies to suggest - only hate and scorn and disastrous policies.

How productive are the children later without their basic needs being met? You would simply cause suffering, and many people without education, poor, criminals for no reason.

No reason but the satisfaction of wagging your finger at them satisfied for no aid.

That's right baby, just give them their $800/Month and tell them to remember to vote Democrat.

 

[Matt1970]

If you think a minimum wage protects wages in general and prevents exploitation of workes and a sustinence slave labor market, fine - the fact that it happens to be the position of the Democrats, the fact you might join the Democrats to support the group who agrees with you doesn't mean you hold the view for anything but good reasons.

The fact there are people who stand to make a lot of money by slashing the cost of labor to sustience slave wages, and who pay propagandists to come up with arguments that will fool the more gullible to the wrong position - means that a lot of people are fooled tohave the wrong position. Even they don't just 'say it because Republicans do', necessarily.

That's right Craig, the factory owners can just wave their magic wand and pay skilled labor $7.50 w/no bennies and people will still line up for the jobs all day long.....


You really are an idiot.

 

[blankslate]

Many techies also seem to really like guns.

The winner of the 4th season of Top Shot (a reality t.v. in which contestants compete in shooting challenges) worked in the IT field.

Pretty cool show. About the only reality t.v. series I can stand.

 

[dmcowen674]

First off, time and time again, it's been shown there are more liberal posters here than conservative.

Let's say that was true.

Then obviously looking at the posts the Conservatives make they are Radical, Dangerous and hate the U.S.

 

[dwell]

Which is what I think dwell meant by his definition of centrist. When I hear someone is a centrist or moderate here in the US, at least in relation to recent politics, I take that to mean they are neither R or D, right or left, but rather pick and choose as they see fit. They vote per issue, and not along any party line, and they vote for the candidate, not their party.

Exactly. Judge with logic, not emotion.

 

[xj0hnx]

The subject at hand, that you responded to, is conservatives and interest in high tech/computers. Are you opposed to that? Or are you hijacking a thread to rant against conservatives, an opportunity you rarely fail to miss even if it leads to derail?

YOu kidding? I can't even count how many threads Fail234 has posted something completely unrelated to the topic at hand just to get in some criticism of conservatives. His shilling checks must be getting smaller.

 

[Craig234]

Exactly. Judge with logic, not emotion.

'Centrists' are far from the 'logic, not emotion' group. Far from it.

By the way, I don't want to write a long post on propaganda and bias and such here, but the issue usually isn't 'emotion'. I'll just quote Kennedy:

The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie, deliberate, contrived and dishonest, but the myth, persistent, persuasive and unrealistic.

 

[her209]

The technically minded have a good chance of being conservative politically: Engineering and the hard sciences tend to appeal to those who believe strongly in a rule-based, measurable universe.

A common misconception. Conservatives think creationism (intelligent design) is legit.

 

[cubby1223]

It is the love of money that corrupts.

IMO, the very purpose of money is to better the lives of others around you. Once your own life becomes comfortable, the extra money is to be used to help others reach that same point.

Sponsoring children in impoverished nations, for example, not only has the immediate effect of helping that child, but will also help the offspring that child has one day. It helps the family of that child care for the siblings of that child, since they now have more resources to use on the others.

Money is not evil, it is not bad. It is a gift once can give to others if one chooses to love something other than money.

Except that far too often, donated money only rewards and encourages the act of begging.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

A common misconception. Conservatives think creationism (intelligent design) is legit.

A common misconception. Some might say that Liberals tend to think their bigoted stereotypes are legit.

 

[soulcougher73]

I think my biggest complaint with the GOP and die hard conservatives who support them are the fact they are the biggest hypocrits around. That alone is what makes me distance myself from ever getting on board with them.

 

[Craig234]

I think my biggest complaint with the GOP and die hard conservatives who support them are the fact they are the biggest hypocrits around. That alone is what makes me distance myself from ever getting on board with them.

That's about the least of my concerns with them. Bad policies are my concerns.

Strom Thurmond had a black mistress - hypocritical and the least of his problems.

 

[nehalem256]

A common misconception. Conservatives think creationism (intelligent design) is legit.

I will take people with quaint notions of the age/origin of the universe over people whose "values" promote single motherhood, while at the same time complaining about how hard single mothers have and that they need more of my tax money in support.

 

[cybrsage]

A common misconception. Conservatives think creationism (intelligent design) is legit.

It is sad that liberals still pretend creationism (which requires a god) is the same as intelligent design (which does not require a god). This is why we need to focus on reading skills in public schools.

 

[Jaskalas]

A common misconception. Conservatives think creationism (intelligent design) is legit.

I dare you to do a pole here on creationism. It'll be blown out of the water.

 

[darkewaffle]

Outside of the tech specific forums, it's always seemed to me like most people here really don't know much about tech at all.

But I don't really see a relationship between "tech" and conservative/liberal either way.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally Posted by her209
A common misconception. Conservatives think creationism (intelligent design) is legit.

I dare you to do a pole here on creationism. It'll be blown out of the water.

Well I'm sure a Poll would show how the radical religious right support Creationism/ID while rejecting Science.

As far as a pole goes there is the North Pole and South Pole but since that is Science as well that they don't believe they exist either.

 

[BoberFett]

In my opinion, people who are 'brainwashed' generally have no idea they are...

Case in point...

See my sig, 'ideology is the enemy'.

That would certainly explain your staunch adherence to your own ideology.