Sunday Sermon

[Nik]

Assembling isn't the same as church as we know it today. So what exactly is your stance on the matter?

the bible clearly defines what church is and it has nothing to do with a special building

that's just one cult-branch twisting scripture to meet their agenda

 

[Malak]

Just another matter of opinion.

Don't like grilled chicken?

 

[ch33zw1z]

Don't like grilled chicken?

Love me some grilled chicken, but not all Christian spin off's agree with your sentiment.

 

[ch33zw1z]

the bible clearly defines what church is and it has nothing to do with a special building

that's just one cult-branch twisting scripture to meet their agenda

 

[Nik]

Love me some grilled chicken, but not all Christian spin off's agree with your sentiment.

Oh, but how can Christians, who claim to be 100% right and that anyone who disagrees with them be wrong, disagree with one another and still be 100% right?

OH NOES PARADOX

 

[Ichinisan]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SFRve9vYfd8#t=9m15s
[changed the link]

 

[Nik]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6cspwzurwho#t=00m23s

lol

 

[Malak]

Love me some grilled chicken, but not all Christian spin off's agree with your sentiment.

Well, nobody has ever disagreed with me on this matter, but I don't usually call up the pope and ask him how he feels about pretty clear cut issues in the bible. Since he doesn't read it himself.

 

[classy]

The only thing the Bible tells Christians is not to forsake the gathering of the saints.

You're taking a legalistic approach to it, which the Bible says not to do, too. Hehe.

Assembling isn't the same as church as we know it today. So what exactly is your stance on the matter?

Nik I don't know where you get that from. The legalistic approach? Christians came to together as an organized body to worship together.

James 5:13-14
13 Is anyone among you suffering? Let him pray. Is anyone cheerful? Let him sing psalms. 14 Is anyone among you sick? Let him call for the elders of the church, and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord.

Obviously you can't have elders without some kind of organized body, James called it the church.

Here in Titus we have a clear definition of the elders in the church

Titus
5 For this reason I left you in Crete, that you should set in order the things that are lacking, and appoint elders in every city as I commanded you—
6 if a man is blameless, the husband of one wife, having faithful children not accused of dissipation or insubordination.
7 For a bishop must be blameless, as a steward of God, not self-willed, not quick-tempered, not given to wine, not violent, not greedy for money, 8 but hospitable, a lover of what is good, sober-minded, just, holy, self-controlled, 9 holding fast the faithful word as he has been taught, that he may be able, by sound doctrine, both to exhort and convict those who contradict.

I could post a at least a dozen more, but I just don't see the need, there is nothing legalistic about the physical church, attending a church, and assembling together with other believers.


ch33zw1z
I have no clue why you think assembling together back then is different than it is now. They called them temples then they referred to them as churches. The physical church is nothing more than a building for the people of God to come together on a regular basis to hear the word to do the will of God.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Well, nobody has ever disagreed with me on this matter, but I don't usually call up the pope and ask him how he feels about pretty clear cut issues in the bible. Since he doesn't read it himself.

You sure he doesn't? I thought he was like, God's right hand man and stuff...

 

[ch33zw1z]

Nik I don't know where you get that from. The legalistic approach? Christians came to together as an organized body to worship together.

James 5:13-14
13 Is anyone among you suffering? Let him pray. Is anyone cheerful? Let him sing psalms. 14 Is anyone among you sick? Let him call for the elders of the church, and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord.

Obviously you can't have elders without some kind of organized body, James called it the church.

Here in Titus we have a clear definition of the elders in the church

Titus
5 For this reason I left you in Crete, that you should set in order the things that are lacking, and appoint elders in every city as I commanded you—
6 if a man is blameless, the husband of one wife, having faithful children not accused of dissipation or insubordination.
7 For a bishop must be blameless, as a steward of God, not self-willed, not quick-tempered, not given to wine, not violent, not greedy for money, 8 but hospitable, a lover of what is good, sober-minded, just, holy, self-controlled, 9 holding fast the faithful word as he has been taught, that he may be able, by sound doctrine, both to exhort and convict those who contradict.

I could post a at least a dozen more, but I just don't see the need, there is nothing legalistic about the physical church, attending a church, and assembling together with other believers.


ch33zw1z
I have no clue why you think assembling together back then is different than it is now. They called them temples then they referred to them as churches. The physical church is nothing more than a building for the people of God to come together on a regular basis to hear the word to do the will of God.

Do you actually read that stuff, or just post it up? None of that actually tells you that church is necessary. Great, they had a church. Great, they had "elders". Nowhere does it state that you have to go to church at all! Wherever two or more are gathered my man, 2 or more...You're really missing my point, or you just don't care what my point is.

 

[Nik]

The "organized body" is the collective. It's the whole of the believers of christ. It's not a fucking building or a standard group of people.

Moses would have been an Elder. The apostles would have been elders.

Appointing elders in each city would make it easier to establish a foothold on the region so that others would come to trust a regular face and be more easily swayed into the brainwashing.

The "assemblies" you're referring to are completely out of context. First, you have to understand the person sending the message. Remember, what you're reading are basically nothing more than a letter mailed from one guy to another guy or a note written by one guy to a very small group of people. You also have to remember that these groups of people had specific issues to fix that other groups did not and that some groups needed to function one way or another that other groups did not.

Take it out of context all you want, but it's still a bunch of bullshit.

Christ didn't come to preach to the saved. He came to preach to the lost. The whole point of establishing a regular meeting place was to avoid death. Remember the whole "kill christians" thing? Remember the whole fish symbol used in secret to identify believers? Remember how they used to use that as a password of sorts to get in to their secret meetings so they could do their illegal religion thing while the Romans went on looking for silly christians to kill but couldn't find them?

Yeah, THAT's why christians developed the habit of sticking to one regular place of "worship."

 

[Nik]

Well, nobody has ever disagreed with me on this matter, but I don't usually call up the pope and ask him how he feels about pretty clear cut issues in the bible. Since he doesn't read it himself.

LOL?! The Pope doesn't read the Bible?

You're even more crazy than I thought you were.

 

[classy]

The "organized body" is the collective. It's the whole of the believers of christ. It's not a fucking building or a standard group of people.

Moses would have been an Elder. The apostles would have been elders.

Appointing elders in each city would make it easier to establish a foothold on the region so that others would come to trust a regular face and be more easily swayed into the brainwashing.

The "assemblies" you're referring to are completely out of context. First, you have to understand the person sending the message. Remember, what you're reading are basically nothing more than a letter mailed from one guy to another guy or a note written by one guy to a very small group of people. You also have to remember that these groups of people had specific issues to fix that other groups did not and that some groups needed to function one way or another that other groups did not.

Take it out of context all you want, but it's still a bunch of bullshit.

Christ didn't come to preach to the saved. He came to preach to the lost. The whole point of establishing a regular meeting place was to avoid death. Remember the whole "kill christians" thing? Remember the whole fish symbol used in secret to identify believers? Remember how they used to use that as a password of sorts to get in to their secret meetings so they could do their illegal religion thing while the Romans went on looking for silly christians to kill but couldn't find them?

Yeah, THAT's why christians developed the habit of sticking to one regular place of "worship."

Really? LOL
Well Paul didn't get that memo guy because is 1Timothy chapter 3 he wrote what the qualifications are for bishops and deacons. He finishes it off with


I Timothy 3:14-15

14 These things I write to you, though I hope to come to you shortly;
15 but if I am delayed, I write so that you may know how you ought to conduct yourself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.

So now if we don't have to go to church Rev Nik, Paul sure spent a lot of time in explaning how the house of God should be run.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Really? LOL
Well Paul didn't get that memo guy because is 1Timothy chapter 3 he wrote what the qualifications are for bishops and deacons. He finishes it off with


I Timothy 3:14-15

14 These things I write to you, though I hope to come to you shortly;
15 but if I am delayed, I write so that you may know how you ought to conduct yourself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.

So now if we don't have to go to church Rev Nik, Paul sure spent a lot of time in explaning how it should be run.

Wait, wasn't Paul the founder of the Catholic church? Are you catholic or Christian?

 

[classy]

Wait, wasn't Paul the founder of the Catholic church? Are you catholic or Christian?

Catholics believe in Jesus, they just got a bunch of other stuff. There is not one denomination of Christianity that doesn't have some flakiness in it. Peter not Paul, is the so called founder of catholicism, but I don't get that, because Peter was married. Go figure.........

 

[ch33zw1z]

Catholics believe in Jesus, they just got a bunch of other stuff. There is not one denomination of Christianity that doesn't have some flakiness in it. Peter not Paul, is the so called founder of catholicism, but I don't get that, because Peter was married. Go figured.........

"a bunch of other stuff" is putting it nicely.

 

[Nik]

Catholics believe in Jesus, they just got a bunch of other stuff. There is not one denomination of Christianity that doesn't have some flakiness in it. Peter not Paul, is the so called founder of catholicism, but I don't get that, because Peter was married. Go figure.........

Where in the Bible does it say that church elders cannot be married or cannot have sex?

How does that fit in with ALL the contradicting scripture that basically says be fruitful and multiply?

Oh, right, I forgot. Catholicism and Christianity specifically require logic and reason to be absent in order for them to "function."

 

[Malak]

You sure he doesn't? I thought he was like, God's right hand man and stuff...

Jesus explicitly says otherwise.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Jesus explicitly says otherwise.

oh, I know...

 

[Nik]

Really? LOL
Well Paul didn't get that memo guy because is 1Timothy chapter 3 he wrote what the qualifications are for bishops and deacons. He finishes it off with


I Timothy 3:14-15

14 These things I write to you, though I hope to come to you shortly;
15 but if I am delayed, I write so that you may know how you ought to conduct yourself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.

So now if we don't have to go to church Rev Nik, Paul sure spent a lot of time in explaning how the house of God should be run.

Let's say the US government writes a letter to all felons saying that they cannot vote and cannot own firearms.

That doesn't mean everyone else applies to that list of "thou shalt not."

Just because that one specific letter written to that one specific group of people says "this is how you should function" doesn't mean that it applies to everyone else in the church body.

You're foolishly falling into the same ignorant bullshit that most other religious nutjobs do: taking shit out of context.

Even shown, you still refuse to see it.

 

[classy]

Where in the Bible does it say that church elders cannot be married or cannot have sex?

How does that fit in with ALL the contradicting scripture that basically says be fruitful and multiply?

Oh, right, I forgot. Catholicism and Christianity specifically require logic and reason to be absent in order for them to "function."

The bible doesn't say a elder can't be married. But catholicism teaches that. I am not catholic. But hey we have just as much reason and logic and as an atheist. But hey be it from me to criticize. But I am waiting for the missing link and for ET to phone home, lol. Talk about delusional

 

[Nik]

I'll give you another example: if an alcoholic has a tough time with alcohol and makes alcohol his idol and worships it, that's a sin.

However, the guy sitting next to him having a drink who doesn't idolize alcohol is not committing the same sin, even though he's committing the same act.

An apostle would have (and did, basically) written to the first guy that he should abstain from all alcohol.

Morons, thousands of years in the future, who are too stupid to understand the concept of "context" will see that and immediately think that alcohol is the sin, which would be false.

 

[Nik]

The bible doesn't say. But catholicism teaches that. I am not catholic. But hey we have just as much reason and logic and as atheist. But hey be it from me to criticize. But I am waiting for the missing link and for ET to phone home, lol. Talk about delusional

You know who else used to add rules to god's law? The Jews. They even had the balls to do it when Jesus was still alive. Know what happened? Jesus turned the tables over in the temple because church tithe and taxes, something christ taught were good, turned into greed. The pharisees used to pray out on the street corner at the top of their lungs so others could see their (legalistic) prayers in an effort to make the pharisees look more holy and more godly because everyone could see them praying.

Blah blah blah.

It takes a hell of a lot more faith to believe in the judeo christian faith than it does evolution, as you were so clumsy to elude to.

 

[classy]

Let's say the US government writes a letter to all felons saying that they cannot vote and cannot own firearms.

That doesn't mean everyone else applies to that list of "thou shalt not."

Just because that one specific letter written to that one specific group of people says "this is how you should function" doesn't mean that it applies to everyone else in the church body.

You're foolishly falling into the same ignorant bullshit that most other religious nutjobs do: taking shit out of context.

Even shown, you still refuse to see it.

The bible is a complete book of the inspired word of God. Can't cherry pick it. I can't say I accept what Paul wrote, but reject what Peter wrote. I can't say its sin to commit adultery, but overlook all the other sexual sins. If I cherry pick it for one part, but throw away the rest of it, then none of its worth reading.