Sub-Ambient Cooling Help

[DerwenArtos12]

Ok, for those of you not entirely familiar with me, I'm not quite right in the head and have a tendency to do things simply because I can. With that being said. I have a spare mini fridge that sits right next to my desk and is just around to hold my various forms of caffeine. I have for some time been considering drilling some holes in it and running a water cooling set-up through it to bring my system to sub-ambient temps.

I've already considered the electric bill side of things in that the fridge is more designed to keep things cold then constantly be cycling on to keep a computer cool but, what the heck, right?

I'm on to thinking about condensation and the such. If anyone can offer me any insight in how to stave off condensation so I can go ahead with my lunacy I'd be quite obliged.

 

[WoodButcher]

Grease and insulate just like phase, The reason for not doing as you suggest is not impracticality but impossibility. The compressor in a mini-fridge can't handle the load, this is one of the reasons when chillers are built small air conditioners are used. Check out the chillers section at xtreme

 

[DerwenArtos12]

It's not really a minifridge as I described, as that implies like a 1sq ft. This is actually a 6sq ft fridge. I drink a lot of caffeine. I do see what you mean though. It just so happens that I have a pair of small A/C units like one would put in the window, on hand.

 

[thecoolnessrune]

What about simply setting the radiator in the fridge with some loudass 200CFM fans?

Like this one?

Or this for 36mm?

 

[DerwenArtos12]

I'm pretty sure what woody is saying is that the cooling capacity of the compressor in the fridge wouldn't be able to keep up. Something I had thought about but, was hoping I wouldn't have to deal with.

 

[LOUISSSSS]

or why not put the reservoir in the fridge?

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Or why not just build a case that uses the A/C units as the intake fans and make the ambient temp in the case below the room temp? shouldn't have to do any special greasing or insulating that way.

 

[aigomorla]

Heres my 2 cents about what your doing.

I have some experience in sub ambient cooling. Later realized, preping the board, and the resell/offer value for your eq turns out useless.

My cousins wouldnt take my old DFI SLI-DR because the CPU socket area had greese all over the place.


Anyhow, you cant use a mini fridge. I already thought of the idea and presented it to many experienced phase builders. They will all tell you, fridges blow in spec to the compressor, unless your using a big fridge.

AC units offer far better compressors.

Now if you stick your radiator <which would be the best choice over a reservoir> you'll burn out your mini fridge's compressor in a matter of months. I give it 4-5 months b4 you hit a performance drop on the fridge, and other 3-4 months after until your fridge dies.

What you want is a post rad heat exchanger. Something to pull the heat out of the water after the radiator to help drop your coolant temps a little below ambients. These are mostly done with TEC's.


A chiller might also be another route for you. But these units need to be insulated from the tubing, and the entire board as well. Too much trouble if you ask me, unless your really into seeing your loaded temps in the sub degree ranges.

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Originally posted by: aigomorla
Heres my 2 cents about what your doing.

I have some experience in sub ambient cooling. Later realized, preping the board, and the resell/offer value for your eq turns out useless.

My cousins wouldnt take my old DFI SLI-DR because the CPU socket area had greese all over the place.


Anyhow, you cant use a mini fridge. I already thought of the idea and presented it to many experienced phase builders. They will all tell you, fridges blow in spec to the compressor, unless your using a big fridge.

AC units offer far better compressors.

Now if you stick your radiator <which would be the best choice over a reservoir> you'll burn out your mini fridge's compressor in a matter of months. I give it 4-5 months b4 you hit a performance drop on the fridge, and other 3-4 months after until your fridge dies.

What you want is a post rad heat exchanger. Something to pull the heat out of the water after the radiator to help drop your coolant temps a little below ambients. These are mostly done with TEC's.


A chiller might also be another route for you. But these units need to be insulated from the tubing, and the entire board as well. Too much trouble if you ask me, unless your really into seeing your loaded temps in the sub degree ranges.

Well then what do you think of my idea of building a custom case that uses one of the windows AC units to bring the ambient temps to below room temps. I'm not really looking for sub-freezing temps, just looking to get a little extra headroom out of my aging hardware.

 

[aigomorla]

Originally posted by: DerwenArtos12

Well then what do you think of my idea of building a custom case that uses one of the windows AC units to bring the ambient temps to below room temps. I'm not really looking for sub-freezing temps, just looking to get a little extra headroom out of my aging hardware.

my first and foremost comment about any DYO project.

If you think your going to have loads of fun off it, there is no such thing as a bad project.

If you think you cant do it easily and can already think of roadblocks... your going to have hell with the project.


:]

If you think you can pull it off, then go for it. The response in having fun is always worth it in a project.


But radiators generally work better with a larger Delta of coolant to ambients. If you can reduce your ambients [I.E. AC] Then your cooling capacity of the radiator will be greater, and in turn lower your delta from idle to load.

 

[WoodButcher]

Aigo just hit on something I had never thought of "post rad cooling" If you use a rad out side the fridge then your only cooling room temp, I'm thinking maybe a "chiller coil" similar to this, but smaller, possibly just coiled copper tubing immersed in water inside the fridge?

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Thats very similar to what I was just thinking about. If I used the radiator to get my coolant close to ambient if not at ambient then the load on the fridge would be pretty minimal and a copper coil inside a vat of even, alcohol or antifreeze could drop my coolant another 8-10 degrees below ambient. I'm dealing with the same insulation issues again on this front though.

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Ok, here's my new predicament. I have $200 now and I'll have another $200 in two weeks. I could undertake this project on my existing 939 rig that performs well.

OR

I could upgrade to C2D, reusing a lot of my existing stuff, sell off what I don't dispense into my other rigs, and with that money upgrade my HTPC.

Any Thoughts?

 

[aigomorla]

Originally posted by: DerwenArtos12
Ok, here's my new predicament. I have $200 now and I'll have another $200 in two weeks. I could undertake this project on my existing 939 rig that performs well.

OR

I could upgrade to C2D, reusing a lot of my existing stuff, sell off what I don't dispense into my other rigs, and with that money upgrade my HTPC.

Any Thoughts?

Option 2, if you think you need the extra CPU power.

That should hold you off longer for neha. After that, its game overs for AMD. The cooling will be nice, but if you look at facts on a AMD vs C2D. Or even the new wolfdales and yorkie, it rolls down to this:

1. you upgrade the cooling on your AMD, your still caped at 3.0-3.2ghz max. Thats = 2 a C2D @ 2.4ghz?

2. You upgrade to the C2D on air, and drop a decient air cooler on it, you can easily get 3.2-3.5ghz on AIR. Maybe a bit more, which is considerably faster then your AMD @ any clock it can get.

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Originally posted by: aigomorla

Originally posted by: DerwenArtos12
Ok, here's my new predicament. I have $200 now and I'll have another $200 in two weeks. I could undertake this project on my existing 939 rig that performs well.

OR

I could upgrade to C2D, reusing a lot of my existing stuff, sell off what I don't dispense into my other rigs, and with that money upgrade my HTPC.

Any Thoughts?

Option 2, if you think you need the extra CPU power.

That should hold you off longer for neha. After that, its game overs for AMD. The cooling will be nice, but if you look at facts on a AMD vs C2D. Or even the new wolfdales and yorkie, it rolls down to this:

1. you upgrade the cooling on your AMD, your still caped at 3.0-3.2ghz max. Thats = 2 a C2D @ 2.4ghz?

2. You upgrade to the C2D on air, and drop a decient air cooler on it, you can easily get 3.2-3.5ghz on AIR. Maybe a bit more, which is considerably faster then your AMD @ any clock it can get.

Thats why I'm having such a hard time. Quite frankly I don't *need* more cpu but, I don't need to push my 3GHz A64 any higher. I'm just bored and in the mood for a project. So the more fun of the two is actually what I'm more interested in. I'm even leaning towards option 3, buy a car to play with. I've got a pair of 73 cutlasses but, I've got them to the point where I'm going to have to spend A LOT to find some of the rarer parts for the un-common year cutlasses. I've got an 06Z06 that takes care of my need, my need for speed but, I'm not about to go tinkering with it when I paid near $100K for(I had to have #442 in daytona sunset.) Maybe a Gen2 Camaro to tinker with...

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Thank you all for your replies, I do appreciate the indulgence. I think I'm going to upgrade my HTPC a little, get a newer case and a dual core for it and call it a day. Put that money thats burning my pocket up to use to FINALLY finish a couple of my more complex projects. For those of you that remember them, you will be seeing the completion of my cube and tower in the next month or so, two years on the bench is quite long enough.