Those students are pretty stupid...they forgot the primary rule of debate, acting like an idiot is not ok no matter how stupid your opponents are. I am far from a Minuteman supporter (one look at the people who most loudly support that organization tells me everything I need to know...), but it's not ok to protest their stupid bullshit with your own stupid bullshit. And in this particular case there is even less cause, all the founder was doing was getting up and expressing his opinion. Just because you might disagree with it doesn't give you the right to do stupid stuff like this. Jeez people.
So? Is anybody who carries a gun a vigilante?
Anyway, I wouldn't blame them for carrying weapons -- they might stumble upon some drug smugglers.
And they MIGHT mow down some random "wetbacks" for the fun of it.
What matters is what they are actually doing out there, and information along those lines seems rather limited. If they are behaving in a professional manner, simply keeping watch and simply reporting what they see, I have very little problem with it. But large groups of random, personally involved people with no training hardly ever seem to act in a professional manner. Sometimes amateurs are just as good as the professionals, but that is usually the exception rather than the rule.
The irony is that if a minuteman did commit a crime, then the application of the law will be certain, unlike the situation with the illegal immigration.
Hey, you won't get any argument from me. I have no problem with enforcing immigration laws, I'm just not sure a bunch of random yahoos are the people to do it. Of course there is always the outside chance that random yahoos are effective, but that's not usually the case in my experience.
I guess it comes down to whether you want a bunch of yahoos patrolling the border, or having a much much greater bunch of yahoos crossing the border.
In any case, the politicians are pathetic for not allocating the funds to enforce the laws that already exist.
In any case, the politicians are pathetic for not allocating the funds to enforce the laws that already exist.
Agreed...what we REALLY need is trained professionals actually doing their jobs. We have all the laws we need in terms of immigration control, IMHO, and I actually think they could even be loosened a bit, but we need to ENFORCE them. Otherwise it makes no difference what the policy is.
These are racist individuals heading a project that terrorizes immigrants on the U.S.-Mexican border," Ryan Fukumori, a Columbia junior who took part in the protest, told The New York Sun. "They have no right to be able to speak here."
hmmm..so what rights do the illegals have? it seems they got more than the us citizens...free healthcare, instate tuition, immediate welfare qualification....citizens can't speak out , but illegals can...political correctness has killed the usa!
hmmm..so what rights do the illegals have? it seems they got more than the us citizens...free healthcare, instate tuition, immediate welfare qualification....citizens can't speak out , but illegals can...political correctness has killed the usa!
This is no different than any other crime. I think we can all agree that it is the obligation of each person to pay attention to the situations around them so that those that may cause harm can be stopped before other people are hurt.
True or false?
If true then the minutemen are no different than say those that activley police segemnts of a highway for drunk drivers or those that actively participate in a neighborhood watch.
If they see a crime being commited, then they call the authorities to handle it.
A vigilante would, in the case of a drunk driver call it in and then attempt to run him or her off the road. Or a neighborhood watch would catch someone breaking into a home and take physical action against the person when they emerged from the home in which they have broken into.
Neither case has happend with the minutemen. They have not shot anyone, they have not physically harmed anyone. (if there is evidence to the contrary please post) IF they were taking actions such as capturing immigrants and taking them to the desert and killing them buring the bodies or leaving them to rot THEN there could be a case for them not to be there.
They are simply performing a neighborhood watch on a very grand scale and I for one see no problem with that and have a difficult time understanding those that do.
If I was your neighbor and you went on vacation would you not want me to call the police if someone was breaking in? Would you not want me to call the fire dept. if your house was on fire? If so then how can you argue with what these people are doing?
If your answer is false to the begining question, then do not expect a helping hand when you might need it. Such as when an illegal takes your job, hurts a freind or family member or commits a crime against you.
True or false?
If true then the minutemen are no different than say those that activley police segemnts of a highway for drunk drivers or those that actively participate in a neighborhood watch.
If they see a crime being commited, then they call the authorities to handle it.
A vigilante would, in the case of a drunk driver call it in and then attempt to run him or her off the road. Or a neighborhood watch would catch someone breaking into a home and take physical action against the person when they emerged from the home in which they have broken into.
Neither case has happend with the minutemen. They have not shot anyone, they have not physically harmed anyone. (if there is evidence to the contrary please post) IF they were taking actions such as capturing immigrants and taking them to the desert and killing them buring the bodies or leaving them to rot THEN there could be a case for them not to be there.
They are simply performing a neighborhood watch on a very grand scale and I for one see no problem with that and have a difficult time understanding those that do.
If I was your neighbor and you went on vacation would you not want me to call the police if someone was breaking in? Would you not want me to call the fire dept. if your house was on fire? If so then how can you argue with what these people are doing?
If your answer is false to the begining question, then do not expect a helping hand when you might need it. Such as when an illegal takes your job, hurts a freind or family member or commits a crime against you.
Yep, you'ret totally correct Wheezer, and to add some more interesting information, Mexican police 'probed on drugs':
It's a good thing the minutemen are carrying.
It's a good thing the minutemen are carrying.
Does anyone know what the Arabic on the banner said? On the O'Really Factor some guy from the Minutemen said the banner read "The Holocaust Didn't Happen" or some such.
I wouldn't be surprised if that is disinformation, but if it actually said that I would not be surprised at all. Some on-campus left wing groups are verrrrrry strange in their twisted beliefs.
I wouldn't be surprised if that is disinformation, but if it actually said that I would not be surprised at all. Some on-campus left wing groups are verrrrrry strange in their twisted beliefs.
This isn't a liberal/conservative issue. This is a bunch of stupid college kids, who think they know something about the world, disrupting a peaceful speech by the Minutemen. I think Columbia should be ashamed of themselves for not providing better security. If your going to invite somebody as a guest to your university, the very least you can do is to give them protection to let them voice their opinion.
If the students disagree, then they can do what any intelligent dissident would have done....debate the points in a peaceful manner. I'm sure the Minutemen would have welcomed a civilized debate with the students on the issues. Instead these braindead students took matters into their own hands.
If the students disagree, then they can do what any intelligent dissident would have done....debate the points in a peaceful manner. I'm sure the Minutemen would have welcomed a civilized debate with the students on the issues. Instead these braindead students took matters into their own hands.
I don't see a picture
However that definitely sounds like absolute h*rse cr@p....but I expect nothing less than Oreily
We can agree Columbia is responsible, at least partly.
That said, I think we both know how much outrage there would have been if the speaker were a liberal and a "gang" of Conservative students pulled something like this on them.
ProfJohn
Lifer
- Jul 28, 2006
- 18,161
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So true...
Got to yahoo news and search "Columbia University" only 3 out of top 10 stories are about this. (search Foley and every story is about the scandal) that means that there are not a lot of stories being written about what happened at Columbia. I am sure many members of the media agree with some of the posters here, they deserved it, or it just isn't worth talking about.
ProfJohn
Lifer
- Jul 28, 2006
- 18,161
- 7
- 0
For the record these protests were lead by the student chapter of the "International Socialist Organization" I wonder if these people get school money for their little club?
And look who the college Republicans invited to speak next week
BTW: I guess that is the right group of people to get when you want to stand up for Israel. People who engaged in acts of terror to kill Jews and had a change of heart when they look at themselves and what they became. <am I starting to sound like moonbeam?>
Link on next weeks speakers
And look who the college Republicans invited to speak next week
Man they better get better security for this one, the anti-Israel left is going to be all over this.
BTW: I guess that is the right group of people to get when you want to stand up for Israel. People who engaged in acts of terror to kill Jews and had a change of heart when they look at themselves and what they became. <am I starting to sound like moonbeam?>
Link on next weeks speakers
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