Stock E6600 at 51C Idle!!

HighDef

Junior Member
Aug 1, 2007
19
0
0
Moved from stock cooler to a V1 Thermaltake. Applied thin layer or artic silver, checked all push pins...I am at a loss and it does not look like these temps can be good for my computer at all. Maybe im just crazy but some insight would be nice especially since I have the nine hundred I would think I could run it pretty cool and get some OC'n going on

Ambient Room Temp is 28-30C

These are the idle temps I have had for about 6 hours since I got speedfan

Temp 1 - 40C
Temp2 - 36C
Temp3 - 24C
HD0 - 35C
HD1 - 37C
Temp1 - 40C
Core 0 - 52C
Core 1 - 50C


Thanks for any help!



Antec Nine Hundred Case (extra side fan attached)
Asus P5N-E SLI Nvidia 650i chipset
E6600 Core 2 Duo W/ Thermaltake V1 Cooler
2X512 and 2X1GB Corsair XMS2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400)
PNY 7900GS PCIE X16
300GB SATA Seagate 7200RPM
Samsung Lighscribe 18x DVD Burner
Soundbalster X-Fi XtremeGamer
Antec True Power Trio 650W
 

Acanthus

Lifer
Aug 28, 2001
19,915
2
76
ostif.org
Although your temps are on the high range, they arent that far out of the norm, and certainly arent dangerous to the CPU.

Are your load temps breaking 65C?

You could also be getting an inaccurate reading from speedfan, try coretemp.
 

QuixoticOne

Golden Member
Nov 4, 2005
1,855
0
0
Did you upgrade the CPU and heatsink at the same time?

What were your temperatures with the stock heatsink and same CPU / case / motherboard.

Maybe you put on the Arctic Silver too thick or too thin or maybe the coating got
torn / messed up when the HS was going down onto the CPU.

Did you change your software thermal monitoring program at the same time?
Some programs out there can be like 15C incorrect depending on the version and
the CPU and all that. So it'd help if you knew that the ONLY thing that changed
was the Heatsink.

Anyway if you have no reason to suspect the temperature monitoring s/w accuracy,
and you have no reason to suspect your case ventilation or CPU
frequency/voltage increased to cause higher temperatures, you should
unplug the system and pull the heatsink.

If/when you pull the heatsink, look at how evenly the existing AS5 is spread
on the CPU and HS, and if there's a square mark where the CPU makes contact
with the heatsink.

Sometimes the CPU and heatsink are a little warped at manufacture or
tilted by installation. So you should be able to see unevennes in the print the
CPU IHS makes in the AS on the heatsink and get an idea if there's been uneven
contact more in some areas than others etc.

Also if you pull the heatsink, when you wipe off the old AS5
put a straight razor blade or credit card edge or straight ruler edge flat across the
heatsink base at a few different angles and see if the bottom of the heatsink
has any significant curvature or uneven contact with the straight edge.
Ideally it'll be flat and in very close contact with only a tiny or zero gap from
edge to edge end to end.

If you see a gap, you'll either need to apply a thicker layer of AS5 at LEAST
the thickness of the gap all over the CPU surface, or you could use
a glass block covered with sandpaper to 'lap' the heatsink base
until it's dead flat from edge to edge and that can help a lot if there was a lot
of curvature before.

Check the air cooling forum on xtremesystems.org for some links and pictures
about how to lap the heatsink flat with sandpaper if you're going to do that.

It can make like a 15C improvement to lap it if it was pretty non-flat before.

To apply AS5 to the Heatsink:
Wipe a little all around the heatsink base but then wipe most of that OFF
the heatsink so you have only a see through thin 'haze' of AS5 on the heatink.

AS5's instructions tell you to apply a line or dot of it in the middle and let the heatsink
to CPU contact weight spread it out, but that's not necessarily the best way for
dual core CPUs, and definitely not the best if you have a warped heatsink to CPU
contact.

Another way to apply AS5 is to draw a line of it along the CPU IHS spreader
IN THE DIRECTION OF THE WIDTH OF YOUR ACTUAL CPU CORES IN THE PACKAGE.
There are photos of the right direction somewhere, check the xs air cooling forums,
and the Intel forum I've seen them recently somewhere.

The other way to apply it is just use a credit card as a squegee and lay down about
a 0.5mm thick flat layer to the CPU IHS heatspreader. That may be the best
plan if you have warpage between the CPU IHS and Heatsink.

It's possible for the CPU's IHS to be warped non-flat just like the heatsink base
can be, and you can check how much in the same way. Some people lap sand the
CPU IHS flat too, but you lose your warranty that way, but it can help if your
IHS is really warped... but most of them are flat enough already.

 

HighDef

Junior Member
Aug 1, 2007
19
0
0
I appreciate the help.....I went and got Coretemp the reading is

Tjunction 85C
Core #0 52C
Core #1 48C

QuixoticOne thanks for the major input I am going to remove the HSF today and check it but I am pretty sure it is not warped at all....I used a CC to apply the paste is there a way to tell the right thickness at all? Also don't know if I am quite ready to do the sanding thing that is a little much for now....the antec nine hundred has soo many fans that is one reason I assumed I would have lower temps. Unfortunatly I dont think I was getting an accuarte reading w/ the stock HSF but when I used speedfan the overall temps I remember were lower I just was not reading it right until after I made the change ...I have always used speedfan also

Couple hours and I am off work and will re-apply the paste .....whole situation just sucks I guess i am just not confident I am applying the paste at the right thickness although I know there should not be much
 

HighDef

Junior Member
Aug 1, 2007
19
0
0
what if I want to try any overclocking I dont have much room to move there then do I?
 

QuixoticOne

Golden Member
Nov 4, 2005
1,855
0
0
Yeah I saw you had an Antec 900 and should have excellent
idle temperatures unless you're majorly ovrclocking the idle speed or
the BIOS is overvolting Vcore or something.

Oh another possibility -- check to see if you're using some kind of
automatic thermal management on the CPU fan RPM. It's possible
the CPU fan isn't spinning at full speed (or at all!). I'd always set the BIOS
or fan control program to run the CPU fan at at least 2200 RPM if not full
speed of whatever it can do that's higher.

Unfortunately there's only two ways to tell what the best thickness and application
technique of thermal paste is:

a) Try it, check your load temperatures, take it all apart, retry with a different
thickness, and keep doing that until you get the low temperature you expect.

b) You can sort of tell how much thermal paste is right by looking at the
imprint shape and thickness in the thermal paste residue left over after you
take the heatsink off the CPU.

Basically ideally you want to see a thick 'crater wall' of paste around PAST the
edge of the area where the border of the CPU IHS prints on the heatsink
assuming the heatsink is bigger than the CPU IHS size.

Then in the middle of the HS where the CPU IHS was in contact you want
to see a thinner "pressed down" layer of paste where you can tell that
it was actually pressed and deformed by physical contact between the
CPU IHS and the HS. Like leaving a foot print in soft mud. But if the
mud is too shallow (the paste is too thin), you'll see a print of your
heel and toe but the arch of your foot won't leave as much or at all of
a print in the mud because that's higher than the thickness of the mud where
it curves up and so it doesn't really disturb / imprint the mud where it's
too high in the tread / arch to make contact.

So if you first apply a really thin layer of paste, assemble, tighten, then remove
the HS without ever firing up the PC, you'll see that it only might make contact
in a few spots and not at all in a few other spots unless it's all dead flat and
totally in contact (which would be GOOD but doesn't always happen!).

Then if you put the paste on thicker it'll spread out more and more and more
parts of the CPU IHS and HS will imprint to each other in the paste and then
it'll be as thick as you want it.

That's probably one advantage of using the method of application where you
apply a very thick 'line' of paste across the IHS top and then just let the
CPU to IHS pressure spread it out across the space between them.
Only problem is if you have any really thick gaps in places between the
CPU IHS and HS in which case it'll be unlikely to even go into or past those
areas of relative warpage. But in those cases you really pretty much need
to sand them flatter for best results.

Anyway try putting them together a few times, look at the imprints, and then
you'll have a better idea of if they can make good contact with thin paste
or not.

Good luck.


Originally posted by: HighDef
I appreciate the help.....I went and got Coretemp the reading is

Tjunction 85C
Core #0 52C
Core #1 48C

QuixoticOne thanks for the major input I am going to remove the HSF today and check it but I am pretty sure it is not warped at all....I used a CC to apply the paste is there a way to tell the right thickness at all? Also don't know if I am quite ready to do the sanding thing that is a little much for now....the antec nine hundred has soo many fans that is one reason I assumed I would have lower temps. Unfortunatly I dont think I was getting an accuarte reading w/ the stock HSF but when I used speedfan the overall temps I remember were lower I just was not reading it right until after I made the change ...I have always used speedfan also

Couple hours and I am off work and will re-apply the paste .....whole situation just sucks I guess i am just not confident I am applying the paste at the right thickness although I know there should not be much
 

HighDef

Junior Member
Aug 1, 2007
19
0
0
Will do here after 7AM EST thanks again for the help I'll update and let ya know how things go.
 

QuixoticOne

Golden Member
Nov 4, 2005
1,855
0
0
Originally posted by: HighDef
what if I want to try any overclocking I dont have much room to move there then do I?

Well assuming you're getting correct temp, readings, yeah, you want to be
idle at something under 40C (ideally more like 30 to 35C if your case air
temperature is in the 28 to 30C range which should be true in a cool room
given your nice Antec 900).

You'd want to overclock until no more than around 55 to 65C max. sustained CPU temp
under stress.

However the bright side is that heatsinks often get 'more effective' under load
than at idle, so it's possible to have high idle temperatures and load temps. that
aren't that bad.

Also when you freshly apply paste, especially if you use the dot / line method,
or especially if it's on thick in a flat layer, it'll take a while to "settle in" and
in fact your temperatures will probably drop several degrees C as you
use the PC for a couple hours, alternate idle for a couple hours, stress it
for a half hour, go back to idle, stress it, back to idle, let it idle over night,
turn it off for a couple hours, etc.

Usually you can drop at least 2C more like 5-6C during the settling in time.

But if you are starting out like 15C too high, and it stays that way for
more than a few minutes, then you probably have an installation problem.

 

HighDef

Junior Member
Aug 1, 2007
19
0
0
Is there anyway to tell whcih speedfan reading is case temperature or if it is even read?
 

HighDef

Junior Member
Aug 1, 2007
19
0
0
Alright here is the update I just took HSF off cleaned off old stuff (looked like it was too thin actually) and applied a new bit and repositioned some fans and the HSF exhaust and intake position to correspond with the new fan setup. Also moved many wires around for a little wire managment. Checked HSF w/ razor blade and it was almost perfectly level, also everything was attached w/ careful precision. Now my temps are as follows

TEMP1 39C
TEMP2 35C
TEMP3 24C
HD1 35C
TEMP1 40C
CORE 0 50C
CORE 1 47C

So didnt see much improvment but there was some.......I just booted up and will let it run while I head to bed and hopefully as you said it will kind of wear in and the temp will go down at least 2 C but there is a lot more air flowing over the V1 area now there really is no reason it should be this high in my opinion.
 

n7

Elite Member
Jan 4, 2004
21,281
4
81
Ambient temps make a huge difference on CPU temps.

An example is my extremely hot apartment vs. the cool air conditioned LAN party i was at last weekend.

My idle temps with the best air cooler out there have been around 55C due to my insanely hot apartment many days this summer.
At the LAN, i was seeing around 32C.
This morning, it's nice & cool still (at least for my apartment), & i'm at 43C.

IOW, your temps are likely just fine...
 

QuixoticOne

Golden Member
Nov 4, 2005
1,855
0
0
Sounds like you've done all the right things, and I'm glad to hear it's
a little better now and that your HS is flat.

Hopefully after another couple of days and a few thermal cycles it'll settle in to lower values.

I'm not sure which of your temps is 'case temperature' or how hot your ambient
motherboard sensor tends to run on your particular M/B design. On my new one
the motherboard temp sensor is near the hot MOSFETS so it reports pretty hot
temperatures moreso than being reflective of the air temperature in the case.

I know some people say that certain CPUs have a different
TJunction temperature versus other Core2 CPUs so depending on
which version of the temperature reading S/W you have and which CPU
stepping and model you have the results can be 15C off in one direction or other.

Then again if TEMP3 is real and actually corresponds to any sensor in your setup
as opposed to being an empty reading (who knows), 24C is probably right
and nothing would be 15C colder than that if that's an ambient value.

Or even 39C or 35C nothing would be 15C colder than those unless it's very cool
in your room and case (20C), though I guess 39C-15 could be believed...

You could double check the BIOS CPU voltage to see if it's overvolting you.

Otherwise hopefully things are fine and see if it cools down as the paste settles
and see if your loaded temps. are reasonable.



 

HighDef

Junior Member
Aug 1, 2007
19
0
0
ok....heres the latest.....I went into BIOS and checked on the voltage settings (b/c I know I had to manually set the RAM in order to get it to work right) and the VCORE was on Auto. I had read that could be where the overvolting is occuring. So I read around and found that it looks like it runs stock at about 1.2V. So i set it to 1.2V and am in XP running now with the following temps


TEMP1 39C
Temp2 36C
TEMP3 24C
HD1 38C
TEMP1 40C
CORE 0 46C
CORE 1 45C

Ambient Room Temp 86F

So those are looking better, but am I underpowering my CPU or is this a good area to start w/ OC'ing. Also if anyone could point me to a good OC guide for my related system specs that would be great.

Thanks again

 

AlucardX

Senior member
May 20, 2000
647
0
76
two things i can recommend.

1. get a thermalright ultra-120 extreme. its a PIA to install but worth it.
2. follow AS' directions on applying thermal paste. you didn't specify what type of AS you're using, i'm assuming AS5 (i don't know why anyone would use anything different).

for AS5 or equivalent (thick shin-etsu stuff) you apply a line down the middle of the C2D heatspreader. if the triangle/indicator of the CPU is on your bottom left, you put the line down top to bottom down the heatspreader. pictures are on AS' website.

no credit card or spreading around. just one line down the middle, then sit the heatsink down evenly ontop of the CPU, then mount.
 

HighDef

Junior Member
Aug 1, 2007
19
0
0
I wish i could get the temp down but the upstairs does not cool erally at all.......got a ceiling fan in here so it does not seem teribly hot but it is! just gotta live with it but i am sitting at 47C on core 0 so that is better ..........one thing is i have been duped i asked for artic silver 5 at microcenter he handed me what i thought was it but apparently it is some generci stuff it says Cooler Paste on side in a purple stripe and it says for CPU-cooler GR-005....thermal conductivity:>7.5W/m-k
Thermal resistance <0.06C-in2/w

it has a blue cap and a mostly silver body......this kills me I am going to have to reapply with some artic silver unless you guys are aware of this product and it is actually OK


Thanks
 

Cutthroat

Golden Member
Apr 13, 2002
1,104
0
0
I have the same problem with ambient temps, today for a few hours I actually had to shut down the PC the heat was unbearable and having the PC on just creates a vicious circle. However, I have a really good window fan which helps most of the time until it gets ridiculously hot. The fan is the type with two individual fans which fit right into the window and seals around it kinda like an air conditioner. The fan is reversable so it can suck the hot air out of the house during the day and blow in cool air at night. It was a great investment for $30 or so considering the ambient temps can easily reach 40C or 100F during the day here, last year before I had this fan, or this current PC, I could not even run it during the daytime in the summer.
 

HighDef

Junior Member
Aug 1, 2007
19
0
0
I have set my voltage to 1.25 actually, and it is running at about 46-47C idle havnt had time to load it yet but with the good cooler it usually only ever goes up about 3C.......i am going to go to Microcenter tomorrow and get artic silver 5 and reapply with the spoken method in hopes of a little better performance
 

zephyrprime

Diamond Member
Feb 18, 2001
7,512
2
81
Even my Pentium D 925 runs a lot cooler than that.

Reseat the heatsink. Practice doing it a few times to make sure you know how to do it. Is the heatsink completely fastened? Sometimes those things use weird attachments that aren't so obvious.

Apply more heatsink paste. Less is more but don't be too frugal or you may not have coverage.

You may want to consider lapping the cpu and heatsink.
 

HighDef

Junior Member
Aug 1, 2007
19
0
0
Update:

Went and got the artic silver 5 this morning got home and applied just as directed at the artic silver website. Running now at 45C idle on Core 0. Thanks again for all the help everyone has been really cool. Also I dont necassairily believe that these temps are still very good...and it is a little dissappointing....but the ambient temp in this room will not go below 83F so I think I am screwed till I get a basement anyhow. Also under load from orthos I only jumped about 2-3C when under 100% so i thought that was pretty good and could show that the system is cooled well it is just that ambient temperature that is killing me. heres the rest of my temps from speed fan and coretemp

SF

temp1 37C
temp2 35C
temp3 24C
HD1 36C
Temp1 40C
Core 0 45C
Core 1 43C

Coretemp

Tjunction 85C (this is a constant i believe)
Core 0 45C
Core1 43C



Thanks again