Stephen King talks about video game violence

[Bateluer]

Text

Nor am I some kind of raving political nutcase. But when I heard about HB 1423, which happens to be a bill pending in the Massachusetts state legislature, I still hit the roof. HB 1423 would restrict or outright ban the sale of violent videogames to anyone under the age of 18. Which means, by the way, that a 17-year-old who can get in to see Hostel: Part II would be forbidden by law from buying (or renting, one supposes) the violent but less graphic Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas.

 

[The Bakery]

I'm not saying that laws should or should not be passed, but I think that it's something that demands attention.
There are many myths and misconceptions about video game violence.

Personally, I think it's insanity to think that playing violent games won't affect someone's psyche. I'm not saying
that it will make them violent, that's a very dynamic and detailed assertion. However, I can't find a singe nerve
ending in my brain that says exposure to violence does not affect violent behavior in one way or another.

That's just too simple to not be true on some level.

Here's what a PHD psychologist has to say (references):
http://www.apa.org/science/psa/sb-anderson.html

 

[The Bakery]

Edited - sorry double post:::

I think Mr king hit the nail on the head:

''Could Massachusetts legislators find better ways to watch out for the kiddies? Man, I sure hope so, because there's a lot more to America's culture of violence than Resident Evil 4''

 

[TheVrolok]

Originally posted by: The Bakery
Edited - sorry double post:::

I think Mr king hit the nail on the head:

''Could Massachusetts legislators find better ways to watch out for the kiddies? Man, I sure hope so, because there's a lot more to America's culture of violence than Resident Evil 4''

Yep. Video games/movies/television is just quite a bit easier to point the finger at and blame.. and then legislate. Much tougher to deal with the socioeconomic issues and things like bad parenting.

 

[skace]

Originally posted by: The Bakery
I'm not saying that laws should or should not be passed, but I think that it's something that demands attention.
There are many myths and misconceptions about video game violence.

Personally, I think it's insanity to think that playing violent games won't affect someone's psyche. I'm not saying
that it will make them violent, that's a very dynamic and detailed assertion. However, I can't find a singe nerve
ending in my brain that says exposure to violence does not affect violent behavior in one way or another.

That's just too simple to not be true on some level.

Here's what a PHD psychologist has to say (references):
http://www.apa.org/science/psa/sb-anderson.html

Try and explain me. And when you realize that I was a little kid playing Doom and that I've played every violent game since (10 years in Quake, etc, etc, etc) then you realize I've never had a violent outburst in my life, try to explain it.

I'd argue exposure to violent media desensitizes us to violence in specific manners but also dulls any desire to act out and commit violence in real life. Makes us docile.

The fact is that most nerds play violent video games and most nerds are pussies. The media can't explain that point.

The rating system on video games is there and works, the only reason it isn't having the effect needed is because parents aren't utilizing it.

 

[Throckmorton]

Originally posted by: skace

Originally posted by: The Bakery
I'm not saying that laws should or should not be passed, but I think that it's something that demands attention.
There are many myths and misconceptions about video game violence.

Personally, I think it's insanity to think that playing violent games won't affect someone's psyche. I'm not saying
that it will make them violent, that's a very dynamic and detailed assertion. However, I can't find a singe nerve
ending in my brain that says exposure to violence does not affect violent behavior in one way or another.

That's just too simple to not be true on some level.

Here's what a PHD psychologist has to say (references):
http://www.apa.org/science/psa/sb-anderson.html

Try and explain me. And when you realize that I was a little kid playing Doom and that I've played every violent game since (10 years in Quake, etc, etc, etc) then you realize I've never had a violent outburst in my life, try to explain it.

I'd argue exposure to violent media desensitizes us to violence in specific manners but also dulls any desire to act out and commit violence in real life. Makes us docile.

The fact is that most nerds play violent video games and most nerds are pussies. The media can't explain that point.

The rating system on video games is there and works, the only reason it isn't having the effect needed is because parents aren't utilizing it.

Violent games have been proven to increase violent tendencies in kids.
Did you read that article?

Nerds have plenty of problems of their own, regardless of whether they are shooting up the school or torching kittens.

 

[EvilComputer92]

Originally posted by: Throckmorton

Originally posted by: skace

Originally posted by: The Bakery
I'm not saying that laws should or should not be passed, but I think that it's something that demands attention.
There are many myths and misconceptions about video game violence.

Personally, I think it's insanity to think that playing violent games won't affect someone's psyche. I'm not saying
that it will make them violent, that's a very dynamic and detailed assertion. However, I can't find a singe nerve
ending in my brain that says exposure to violence does not affect violent behavior in one way or another.

That's just too simple to not be true on some level.

Here's what a PHD psychologist has to say (references):
http://www.apa.org/science/psa/sb-anderson.html

Try and explain me. And when you realize that I was a little kid playing Doom and that I've played every violent game since (10 years in Quake, etc, etc, etc) then you realize I've never had a violent outburst in my life, try to explain it.

I'd argue exposure to violent media desensitizes us to violence in specific manners but also dulls any desire to act out and commit violence in real life. Makes us docile.

The fact is that most nerds play violent video games and most nerds are pussies. The media can't explain that point.

The rating system on video games is there and works, the only reason it isn't having the effect needed is because parents aren't utilizing it.

Violent games have been proven to increase violent tendencies in kids.
Did you read that article?

Nerds have plenty of problems of their own, regardless of whether they are shooting up the school or torching kittens.

Yes, because watching Hostel Part II is not nearly as bad as playing Halo 3.

Nowhere in that article was the issue of movies addressed. It's obvious that video games are scrutinized far more than equally violent movies, which have more widespread exposure to kids than most games.

People should focus on revamping the rating system for movies before they come after games.

 

[Throckmorton]

Originally posted by: EvilComputer92

Originally posted by: Throckmorton

Originally posted by: skace

Originally posted by: The Bakery
I'm not saying that laws should or should not be passed, but I think that it's something that demands attention.
There are many myths and misconceptions about video game violence.

Personally, I think it's insanity to think that playing violent games won't affect someone's psyche. I'm not saying
that it will make them violent, that's a very dynamic and detailed assertion. However, I can't find a singe nerve
ending in my brain that says exposure to violence does not affect violent behavior in one way or another.

That's just too simple to not be true on some level.

Here's what a PHD psychologist has to say (references):
http://www.apa.org/science/psa/sb-anderson.html

Try and explain me. And when you realize that I was a little kid playing Doom and that I've played every violent game since (10 years in Quake, etc, etc, etc) then you realize I've never had a violent outburst in my life, try to explain it.

I'd argue exposure to violent media desensitizes us to violence in specific manners but also dulls any desire to act out and commit violence in real life. Makes us docile.

The fact is that most nerds play violent video games and most nerds are pussies. The media can't explain that point.

The rating system on video games is there and works, the only reason it isn't having the effect needed is because parents aren't utilizing it.

Violent games have been proven to increase violent tendencies in kids.
Did you read that article?

Nerds have plenty of problems of their own, regardless of whether they are shooting up the school or torching kittens.

Yes, because watching Hostel Part II is not nearly as bad as playing Halo 3.

Nowhere in that article was the issue of movies addressed. It's obvious that video games are scrutinized far more than equally violent movies, which have more widespread exposure to kids than most games.

People should focus on revamping the rating system for movies before they come after games.

Kids can't get in to movies that they aren't old enough for, but video game nuts are always up in arms when similar laws are applied to games.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

I have no trouble accepting that TV, movie, and video game violence stimulate our propensity for it. But judging by the history of our species before their advent, their elimination would do little good/show little positive results. For some, it might even be a healthy outlet for their violent tendencies, allowing them to satiate their desire to be destructive and violent, while injuring no one, including themselves? While for others it is just pouring gasoline on the fire? Unless we are all going to start taking our equilibrium, I just don't see kids suddenly becoming peaceful and docile simply because of the absence of multimedia stimulus.

 

[EvilComputer92]

Originally posted by: Throckmorton

Originally posted by: EvilComputer92

Originally posted by: Throckmorton

Originally posted by: skace

Originally posted by: The Bakery
I'm not saying that laws should or should not be passed, but I think that it's something that demands attention.
There are many myths and misconceptions about video game violence.

Personally, I think it's insanity to think that playing violent games won't affect someone's psyche. I'm not saying
that it will make them violent, that's a very dynamic and detailed assertion. However, I can't find a singe nerve
ending in my brain that says exposure to violence does not affect violent behavior in one way or another.

That's just too simple to not be true on some level.

Here's what a PHD psychologist has to say (references):
http://www.apa.org/science/psa/sb-anderson.html

Try and explain me. And when you realize that I was a little kid playing Doom and that I've played every violent game since (10 years in Quake, etc, etc, etc) then you realize I've never had a violent outburst in my life, try to explain it.

I'd argue exposure to violent media desensitizes us to violence in specific manners but also dulls any desire to act out and commit violence in real life. Makes us docile.

The fact is that most nerds play violent video games and most nerds are pussies. The media can't explain that point.

The rating system on video games is there and works, the only reason it isn't having the effect needed is because parents aren't utilizing it.

Violent games have been proven to increase violent tendencies in kids.
Did you read that article?

Nerds have plenty of problems of their own, regardless of whether they are shooting up the school or torching kittens.

Yes, because watching Hostel Part II is not nearly as bad as playing Halo 3.

Nowhere in that article was the issue of movies addressed. It's obvious that video games are scrutinized far more than equally violent movies, which have more widespread exposure to kids than most games.

People should focus on revamping the rating system for movies before they come after games.

Kids can't get in to movies that they aren't old enough for, but video game nuts are always up in arms when similar laws are applied to games.

Yes, and a 10 year old kid can't walk into gamestop and buy GTA4. Obviously they have other means of getting their hands on games, the same applies to movies.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

Originally posted by: EvilComputer92


Yes, and a 10 year old kid can't walk into gamestop and buy GTA4. Obviously they have other means of getting their hands on games, the same applies to movies.

Precisely. Some of those children that can't see the movie in theaters, and have responsible parents, just go to a friend's, who's parents are too lazy, ignorant, whatever, to use the vchip or lock away their DVD collection, or control the PCs at home, and get exposure to it anyways.

That study pointed out

However, experimental studies with college students have consistently found increased aggression after exposure to clearly unrealistic and fantasy violent video games. Indeed, at least one recent study found significant increases in aggression by college students after playing E-rated (suitable for everyone) violent video games.

So even fairly innocuous titles can stimulate us and make us more aggressive. I see this as a classic slippery slope, where does it end? Do people think they can legislate away violence and aggression in humans? We are inherently violent, and not the only Hominidae that are. We may evolve to a point where we have subdued that part of us, but that day is far off. These band-aid ideas for curbing violence in our youth are doomed to failure, and only further deprive us of our personal liberties for "our own good" IMO.

EDIT: Some age old reasons for violence among our species that have nothing to do with multimedia stimulus include, but are not limited to: Avarice, jealousy, lust, love, and rivalries for alpha male status. The less sophisticated and/or immature will resort to violence, if need be, and sometimes as a primary option, to further any one of the aforementioned agendas.

 

[Anubis]

Originally posted by: Throckmorton
Kids can't get in to movies that they aren't old enough for, but video game nuts are always up in arms when similar laws are applied to games.

umm yes they can

 

[Thetech]

I don't mean to take a stance on guns (let's not open up that can of worms, PLEASE!)

But why is it ok to teach hunting classes in schools, and why is it ok to encourage kids to hunt, but not ok for them to play violent video games? Or I should say games labeld as being violent?

 

[skace]

Originally posted by: Throckmorton
Violent games have been proven to increase violent tendencies in kids.
Did you read that article?

Nerds have plenty of problems of their own, regardless of whether they are shooting up the school or torching kittens.

I read it and I thought it was bullshit. Explain to me how it makes sense? What the hell is "increased aggressive behavior, thoughts, and affect; increased physiological arousal; and decreased prosocial (helping) behavior"?

Now let's take Exhibit A:
- I play BF2
- BF2 is an extremely violent "ultra realistic" war sim (some tongue in cheek sarcasm for how the media would depict it)
- In BF2, I often play the medic class because I enjoy helping my team mates by saving them.

Why isn't the violent game decreasing my prosocial behavior? Why am I helping people? Hell, based on whatever the hell "prosocial" behavior is (heh firefox keeps underlining this retarded word), should I even be playing online?

Now, my next point is, how do sports such as basketball and baseball affect our aggressive behavior in comparison to video games? If it is in a similar manner, who gives a shit? I would expect interactive and competitive exercises to affect our aggressive behavior in similar manners but I obviously don't have the Phd to back it up.

And last but not least, the rating system for video games is stricter than movies. Games with even the tiniest hint of sex get an M or A rating. Yet when the sex is analyzed it is often about as revealing as daytime soaps. In addition to this, many stores won't even carry an Adult game, treating it like something rated XXX even though the 2 are not the same. Just look at GTA which got pushed to an Adult rating and is tame even by rated R movie standards.

And what the hell is with your comment about nerds shooting up schools and torching kittens? Wow, talk about a making up conclusions.

 

[Xavier434]

The bottom line is that if one does not have enough emotional self control and awareness when it comes to distinguishing fiction of reality and how exposure to fiction should be applied to real life then they are screwed anyways. Banning/Censoring/Restricting video games will result in nothing positive. People who are that vulnerable by being exposed to any kind of outside influence such as video games and then reacting in a negative manner can not be shielded enough by any form of rules or government involvement. The "real world" and how it has an influence on us beyond the entertainment industry will expose their weaknesses. These kinds of people are already screwed.

Besides, look at the time line and history of what we are dealing with here. Before video games, movies were being primarily blamed in the 80's and 90's. Before movies, music was in the spotlight during the later 60's, the 70's, and early 80's. Before music.....are you ready for this one? IT WAS BOOKS! Yes, books. You know? Those things that everyone is astonished to find kids and young adults taking part in anymore unless they are graphic novels featuring the latest anime trends. Eevryone is praised for reading these days no matter what the content is with exception of maybe pornography or something which highly promotes bigotry. It didn't used to be that way by any means. One can only wonder what the next form of entertainment will be blamed for people's natural violent behavior.

 

[Thetech]

:thumbsup:

Originally posted by: skace

Originally posted by: Throckmorton
Violent games have been proven to increase violent tendencies in kids.
Did you read that article?

Nerds have plenty of problems of their own, regardless of whether they are shooting up the school or torching kittens.

I read it and I thought it was bullshit. Explain to me how it makes sense? What the hell is "increased aggressive behavior, thoughts, and affect; increased physiological arousal; and decreased prosocial (helping) behavior"?

Now let's take Exhibit A:
- I play BF2
- BF2 is an extremely violent "ultra realistic" war sim (some tongue in cheek sarcasm for how the media would depict it)
- In BF2, I often play the medic class because I enjoy helping my team mates by saving them.

Why isn't the violent game decreasing my prosocial behavior? Why am I helping people? Hell, based on whatever the hell "prosocial" behavior is (heh firefox keeps underlining this retarded word), should I even be playing online?

Now, my next point is, how do sports such as basketball and baseball affect our aggressive behavior in comparison to video games? If it is in a similar manner, who gives a shit? I would expect interactive and competitive exercises to affect our aggressive behavior in similar manners but I obviously don't have the Phd to back it up.

And last but not least, the rating system for video games is stricter than movies. Games with even the tiniest hint of sex get an M or A rating. Yet when the sex is analyzed it is often about as revealing as daytime soaps. In addition to this, many stores won't even carry an Adult game, treating it like something rated XXX even though the 2 are not the same. Just look at GTA which got pushed to an Adult rating and is tame even by rated R movie standards.

And what the hell is with your comment about nerds shooting up schools and torching kittens? Wow, talk about a making up conclusions.

Dude! ::thumbsup: So right on.

I've seen some racy stuff in R rated movies that I still have yet to see in games (nor want to but that's beside the point).

 

[thraashman]

I actually read the article posted later in the thread. And my favorite is one of his points in his myth vs fact comparisons. He basically says as a way to discount a myth "others do it so it's ok". This was in the causation vs correlation. He doesn't prove that the method is accurate, he just says that other studies that do it exist and are often used in other sciences, so it's ok here.

He basically spends a whole bunch of time trying to say that violent video games are the cause of violence. Then at the end admits that they're not even a significant factor even though he already tried to discount that argument. Is he even reading his own study?

 

[Xavier434]

Originally posted by: Throckmorton

Violent games have been proven to increase violent tendencies in kids.
Did you read that article?

Nerds have plenty of problems of their own, regardless of whether they are shooting up the school or torching kittens.

Read my above post. What you need to realize is that video games and other forms of entertainment are not the problem. Thus, trying to control/censor them is not the solution. The problem is that some people are far too susceptible to outside influences. One needs to ask why they are like that while other people are not if they truly wish to come up with a solution that has an impact. Having kids of my own and comparing them to other kids of today, I can tell you that the vast majority of it is based upon how they were raised. That is the problem. Shitty parenting. One can never hope to achieve even a partial solution to this problem by attempting to control the exposure of violent entertainment such as video games. There will always be things in life which influence these people poorly. On top of that, those who are so easily influenced and truly cause problems that are due to these influences are so few in number compared to everyone who is exposed. Therefore, it really is a waste to censor and limit the entire population based on these few bad apples. The cost is some of our freedoms and the benefit is nothing. Violence is not going to be reduced even if all video games, movies, music, books, etc are completely taken out of everyone's life permanently.

 

[Throckmorton]

Originally posted by: skace

Originally posted by: Throckmorton
Violent games have been proven to increase violent tendencies in kids.
Did you read that article?

Nerds have plenty of problems of their own, regardless of whether they are shooting up the school or torching kittens.

I read it and I thought it was bullshit. Explain to me how it makes sense? What the hell is "increased aggressive behavior, thoughts, and affect; increased physiological arousal; and decreased prosocial (helping) behavior"?

Now let's take Exhibit A:
- I play BF2
- BF2 is an extremely violent "ultra realistic" war sim (some tongue in cheek sarcasm for how the media would depict it)
- In BF2, I often play the medic class because I enjoy helping my team mates by saving them.

Why isn't the violent game decreasing my prosocial behavior? Why am I helping people? Hell, based on whatever the hell "prosocial" behavior is (heh firefox keeps underlining this retarded word), should I even be playing online?

Now, my next point is, how do sports such as basketball and baseball affect our aggressive behavior in comparison to video games? If it is in a similar manner, who gives a shit? I would expect interactive and competitive exercises to affect our aggressive behavior in similar manners but I obviously don't have the Phd to back it up.

And last but not least, the rating system for video games is stricter than movies. Games with even the tiniest hint of sex get an M or A rating. Yet when the sex is analyzed it is often about as revealing as daytime soaps. In addition to this, many stores won't even carry an Adult game, treating it like something rated XXX even though the 2 are not the same. Just look at GTA which got pushed to an Adult rating and is tame even by rated R movie standards.

And what the hell is with your comment about nerds shooting up schools and torching kittens? Wow, talk about a making up conclusions.

Are you a kid?

 

[PingSpike]

Originally posted by: Anubis

Originally posted by: Throckmorton
Kids can't get in to movies that they aren't old enough for, but video game nuts are always up in arms when similar laws are applied to games.

umm yes they can

People always bring that non-point up, and then vanish when its revealed to be false. Its not illegal for kids to get rated R movies or go see them at a theatre. Its just that most theatres choose to not let them in. Video games already have the same laws applied to them as movies, which IIRC is almost nothing at all? They're self regulated industries, its just that video games are the popular whipping boy to hate on because old people don't care about them.

 

[jonks]

Video games don't make people psychotic.

Video games make psychotics more creative

 

[Xavier434]

Originally posted by: PingSpike

People always bring that non-point up, and then vanish when its revealed to be false. Its not illegal for kids to get rated R movies or go see them at a theatre. Its just that most theatres choose to not let them in. Video games already have the same laws applied to them as movies, which IIRC is almost nothing at all? They're self regulated industries, its just that video games are the popular whipping boy to hate on because old people don't care about them.

I generally agree with you here. However, I will say this. First, most theaters let any kid in to any R movie provided the parents are with them or at least buy them the ticket. They do this because it is legal and money > censorship. Second, video game ratings are no where close to being equal to movie ratings. Video game ratings are much stricter and they most definitely should not be considered almost nothing at all. All one really needs to do is compare PG-13 and R movies with a bunch of rated M video games. The difference is substantial when it comes to what is commonly considered "inappropriate content" for kids.




To be honest, I feel the most parents really don't care much about this stuff once their kids are at the age when they enter middle school. They are already exposed to so much crap every day and their parents know it. They just do what they can to teach them and steer them in the right direction. If a kid wants a rated M game then the parent buys it for them in most cases. There are some parents which are more anal retentive than others, but they are becoming fewer and fewer these days. The only thing the rating system really does is restrict the developers from making games which get an A rating and that sucks for us adults who wish to play these games.

I say let the parents decide what is best. Screw the government and agencies deciding for us. If the parents are doing such a crappy job at raising their kids that they cannot prepare them to be exposed to such things without negative consequences then I can guarantee that video games are just the tip of the iceberg. It's not like any young teenager these days hasn't watched porn or extremely violent movies. Most probably see it regularly and we are doing just fine.

 

[Fingolfin269]

Originally posted by: Xavier434
I say let the parents decide what is best. Screw the government and agencies deciding for us. If the parents are doing such a crappy job at raising their kids that they cannot prepare them to be exposed to such things without negative consequences then I can guarantee that video games are just the tip of the iceberg. It's not like any young teenager these days hasn't watched porn or extremely violent movies. Most probably see it regularly and we are doing just fine.

:thumbsup:

The government needs to stay out of this.

 

[Xavier434]

Originally posted by: Fingolfin269

Originally posted by: Xavier434

Originally posted by: PingSpike
I say let the parents decide what is best. Screw the government and agencies deciding for us. If the parents are doing such a crappy job at raising their kids that they cannot prepare them to be exposed to such things without negative consequences then I can guarantee that video games are just the tip of the iceberg. It's not like any young teenager these days hasn't watched porn or extremely violent movies. Most probably see it regularly and we are doing just fine.

:thumbsup:

The government needs to stay out of this.

I appreciate the support. Fix your quote though.

 

[Fingolfin269]

Originally posted by: Xavier434

Originally posted by: Fingolfin269

Originally posted by: Xavier434
I say let the parents decide what is best. Screw the government and agencies deciding for us. If the parents are doing such a crappy job at raising their kids that they cannot prepare them to be exposed to such things without negative consequences then I can guarantee that video games are just the tip of the iceberg. It's not like any young teenager these days hasn't watched porn or extremely violent movies. Most probably see it regularly and we are doing just fine.

:thumbsup:

The government needs to stay out of this.

I appreciate the support. Fix your quote though.

I've got some kind of Monday morning issues when it comes to quoting.