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Question *STABLE* NVMe - USB Adapter?

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mervincm

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Oct 18, 2014
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I noticed considerably better (780MB/s to 980MB/sec) write performance on my test drive (Jmicron) after I swapped from the included A-C cable to the A-C cable that came with my Samsung t5. This was on an asmedia 3142 chipset A connector. Stable and no disconnect.
 

FDV

Junior Member
Jun 23, 2020
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I noticed considerably better (780MB/s to 980MB/sec) write performance on my test drive (Jmicron) after I swapped from the included A-C cable to the A-C cable that came with my Samsung t5. This was on an asmedia 3142 chipset A connector. Stable and no disconnect.
А визуально кабели отличаются?

Are the cables visually different?
 
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Last firmware 0208 sorts out problems with lower quality cables as reported. Just a note that usb 3.1 gen 2 disconnects I had on Intel 8gen desktop PC were not caused by cable but by my orico original firmware. Was using the orico usb orig cable during the whole test period. After the 583 firmware update no more disconnects when on standby.

Blue screen of death were caused by Toshiba firmware. That got resolved after updating Toshiba firmware. That is also documented by Dell.
 

mervincm

Junior Member
Oct 18, 2014
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А визуально кабели отличаются?

Are the cables visually different?
Yes they are visibly different. The A-C cable that TDBT included with my SuperC NVME enclosure is slightly thicker, stiffer, and shorter than the cable that samsung included with my T5-1TB external SSD.
 
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mervincm

Junior Member
Oct 18, 2014
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The included cables are definitely impacting my experience. TDBT replaced my unit + cables as they suspected it was defective, unfortunately, the replacement is the same. Less than stellar performance using the A-C cable, and unstable using the A-A cable. I tried using my Samsung T5 cables and it seems to really help. More stable performance on A-C cable, and overall more stable on the A-A cable. I am wondering if the issue all along was that they ship poor quality cables?
 
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My TDBT SuperC NVME enclosures are also JMS583 A0. I actually have two only a couple weeks old. They both came with newer firmware than 2.08. They are
Version 234.01.00.01
That is version 1.0.1.

234 is from manufacturer. Your version is not newer than version 2.0.8. Latest and best so far is version 2.0.8 and you have the initial firmware ever produced. How did you deduce that you have newer firmware than 2.0.8???? If you want to stay with problematic firmware A0 then you can do so. Mine has been firmware updated to A3 (2.0.8)

I can change the firmware number as well in the firmware config file with notepad. And write a number X and become a dealer with my own number...

Mine had a similar number prefix (orico) but I did not care because orico never provided a firmware to update thus no support. Disconnect Problems solved after the update. Now the standby kicks in instead of disconnect error on PC with SS usb 3.1 gen 2.

I believe I have disclosed all info one needs. Glad I have helped some that were on same situation I was few weeks ago. For others who want to debate please re-read.my posts. really it is your usb drive not mine. I took a risk doing this and I decided to disclose info to help others who are also left unsupported by their brand.

My sincere thanks to Jeyi who have supported our products indirectly with a stable better firmware. Good luck with your product. I am satisfied so time to move on.
 

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Andalu

Member
Jun 25, 2020
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Hi all,
I have an ORICO TCM2-C3 enclosure with the JMS583 chip and, thanks to the information found here, I upgraded to version 0.2.0.8. Unfortunately, sometimes the CrystalDisk Mark results are not adequate to the performance of a USB 3.1 Gen2 device and I would like to check if I get them anyway with the firmware 0.2.0.4 previously present. Where can I download this version?
In the 'Image2' the appropriate results with the same 970evo.
 

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Jun 10, 2020
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that was the firmware my original orico came with and I had disconnects. had.to remove from usb and reconnect.

Testing.my drive on a desktop pc with SS usb gen 2, I had similar performance results (or better) but with a 3x2 M.2 nvme drive. I would think that 3x4. Supported nvme card would have better results than mine ( even if Jmicron 583 is a PCIe Gen3x2 bridge controller).

Will test.my laptops which comes with Gen 1 USB 3.1 to compare with your low speed results.

Orico does not provide any firmwares. They did not reply to.me when I sent an email to them to provide firmware support

I had stable results with crystal test.

Questions
Did you add the thermal pads on your nvme EVO970 chip/heatsink???

Did your run tests with power cord connected (in case of laptop)???

Do you have power settings on performance??

In few mins will upload diskmark from Gen 1 USB 3.1 laptop.


For gen 2 USB results (10Gbps) will upload results on Monday when I am at work but most probably double the results than the photo attached (usb 3.1 gen 1 5Gbps),
 

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Andalu

Member
Jun 25, 2020
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@apoelistasaudi
I didn't apply the thermal pads but I pulled out the adapter from the enclosure. I'm testing it so on a desktop system without any particular power setting. The configuration is the same for all my benchmarks.

With the Ugreen USB 3.1 Gen2 enclosure mod. CM238 (ASM2362 chip) the benchmarking results have never been as low as those I sometimes get for the Orico TCM2-C3. I still haven't been able to figure out if it could depend on the adapter or on some USB3.1 gen.2 port of my asus Q370 motherboard that sometimes goes wrong.
Below the results with the ASM2362.

What about the Hardware ID "USB\VID_152D&PID_0583&REV_2101"? Is it an older version of the 0.2.0.8?
 

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@apoelistasaudi
I didn't apply the thermal pads but I pulled out the adapter from the enclosure. I'm testing it so on a desktop system without any particular power setting. The configuration is the same for all my benchmarks.

With the Ugreen USB 3.1 Gen2 enclosure mod. CM238 (ASM2362 chip) the benchmarking results have never been as low as those I sometimes get for the Orico TCM2-C3. I still haven't been able to figure out if it could depend on the adapter or on some USB3.1 gen.2 port of my asus Q370 motherboard that sometimes goes wrong.
Below the results with the ASM2362.

What about the Hardware ID "USB\VID_152D&PID_0583&REV_2101"? Is it an older version of the 0.2.0.8?
there is no version
21.0.1
2.10.1
2.1.01

the only version the above can be is 1.0.1
The prefix 2 must be manufacturers signature.
USB\VID_152D&PID_0583&REV_0208

The manufacturer may have added a different standby timer on his version 1.0.1 and named it 2101 is a second possibility. Better ask them.

Apply thermal pads and heatsink is a good idea
 
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Andalu

Member
Jun 25, 2020
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@apoelistasaudi
thanks for the clarification ;)
The indicated Hardware ID is not mine but of another person I asked him to but I don't know who is the manufacturer.
Before the firmware upgrading, mine was the original from Orico USB\VID_152D&PID_0583&REV_0204 (now_0208).
 
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Charlie22911

Senior member
Mar 19, 2005
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Techpowerup has a review of a new Icydock enclosure that is using hardware revision A2 of the JMS583 controller.

 
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Techpowerup has a review of a new Icydock enclosure that is using hardware revision A2 of the JMS583 controller.
That article says ".. could handle full-speed USB 3.2 Gen 2 10 Gbps. It supports USB 3.2 Gen 2 on the USB side and PCI-Express x2 3.0 for attached devices."

I am sure that USB 3.2 Gen 2 is X2 the performance of USB 3.1 Gen 2 (10Gbps) so that should be capable of 20Gbps.

In that case makes sense to me that two JMS583 controllers exist for dual lane operation.
 

Andalu

Member
Jun 25, 2020
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I connected my two enclosures (JMS583 and ASM2362) into two USB3.1 Gen.2 ports of my Q370 board mounting the same model of nvme disk (970evo) and using the same type of cable for both. After a few attempts where everything was as expected, it happened once again that the benchmarking results for the JMS583 device are really poor:

Image4.png
 

Charlie22911

Senior member
Mar 19, 2005
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That article says ".. could handle full-speed USB 3.2 Gen 2 10 Gbps. It supports USB 3.2 Gen 2 on the USB side and PCI-Express x2 3.0 for attached devices."

I am sure that USB 3.2 Gen 2 is X2 the performance of USB 3.1 Gen 2 (10Gbps) so that should be capable of 20Gbps.

In that case makes sense to me that two JMS583 controllers exist for dual lane operation.
No, that’s just the poor naming confusing things.
USB 3.2 gen 2 is 10gbps (used to be 3.1 gen 2).
USB 3.2 gen2x2 is 20gbps (used to be USB 3.2)

It’s the same chip as we have, just a new hardware revision to correct any erratum in the earlier revisions that couldn’t be corrected in firmware.
 
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Honestly I dont believe there is a hardware difference. Just naming to correspond to newer software (firmware).

  • JMS583 A0 – Original production release
  • JMS583 A1 – Internal version used for testing and validation that was never released
  • JMS583 A2 – Released Q3 2019 w/ AMD Stability Issues Fixed & Improved Signal Quality for Low Quality USB 10G Cables
  • JMS583 A3 – OEM version to support custom features; will gradually replace A2 starting in early 2021
A2 revision (and A3) features are included with latest firmware 0208.

So yes my hardware should be the same as A2 (or A3) because the firmware was released and I have updated. The firmware solves what is described above.

Probably Orico and others have not paid support fees or have a strategy to sell you same product with different firmware revision by using newer JMS583 bridge A2 or A3 due to newer firmware (as provided by manufacturer) and to add to the confusion, to market their product as USB3.2 Gen 2 x1 lane compatible which is a new name for USB 3.1 Gen 2.
 
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Charlie22911

Senior member
Mar 19, 2005
613
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Features can certainly be added via firmware, but if there is something in hardware that causes issues, you'd need a hardware revision for that. I think you are confusing firmware and hardware revisions, as any hardware revision can almost certainly run any firmware since the functional blocks will be the same. but that doesn't mean the firmware makes the hardware that new revision when you update it.

Lets say the USB transceivers or MUX\DEMUX (or whatever) are sensitive to poor signaling. Or maybe the drive transistors aren't capable of driving a signal back to the host for whatever reason. Maybe the opamps are super noisy or subject to interference and cause dropouts. Not saying any of these are the issue here, but as an example you'd need to re-spin your chip to fix things like that, as firmware would be very limited (if at all) in its ability to compensate.

Companies don't typically spin chip revisions unless improvements are made to reliability or cost, and this is already pretty cheap. JMicron is on their 4th revision, probably because they rushed a product out to be the first USB <-> NVMe bridge to market.

Or I'm totally wrong. It happens.
 

aigomorla

Cases and Cooling Mod PC Gaming Mod Elite Member
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Sep 28, 2005
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Thank you so much on the firmware update for the Orico....
The enclosure works great now, and i have no yet had a random disconnect.
 
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Andalu

Member
Jun 25, 2020
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I have done other tests with the JMS583 and ASM2362 enclosures trying them with the same NVMe disks, using the same usb-c to usb-a cable and always the same USB3.1 Gen.2 port of my asus Q370 with an i5-8400 Coffee Lake and 64GB of ram (and nothing else).

Here the benchmarks with the JMS583 chip:
JMS583 1.png JMS583 2.pngJMS583 3.pngJMS583 4.png

and here those with the ASM2362 chip:
ASM2362 1.pngASM2362 2.pngASM2362 3.pngASM2362 4.png


I must also report that during one of the benchmarks with the JMS583 enclosure I also had a sudden disconnection as shown in the image below:
JMS583 (sudden disconnection).png

Therefore, in my case, the firmware 0.2.8 did not solve all the issues. Moreover, if I remember correctly, I never had such performance degrade with the firmware v2.0.4. So I'm always looking for a way to downgrade from version 2.0.8 to 2.0.4 in order to make the appropriate checks. So far it has only been possible to downgrade to version 1.0.1 thanks to another manufacturer software but I got the same bad performance. Downgrading from the v2.0.8 to the versions available here (2.0.5 and 2.0.6) was not allowed.
 
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In my case
1. Random disconnects have been resolved when running on full 10Gbps with usb 3.1 gen 2
2. Speed is pretty reliable and stable about X2 the usb 3.1 gen 1, 5Gbps results tomorrow will post my reults

Will say few precautions again
1. Before flashing Jmicron 583 remove nvme card 2230 2242 2260 2280 from enclosure, otherwise you can get in trouble
2. Apply heatsink pads on nvme card to heatsink. Otherwise bad results due to overheat. In this case I would think that full body aluminium case is preferred compared to funcy design of transparent Orico case.
3. Firmware update on desktop Pcie slot the nvme card. On my case 2230 was too small and I used electrical tape to hold in place while firmware flashing.
4. Use good quality usb 3.1 gen 2 10Gbps (usb 3.2 gen 2 10 Gbps or USB 3.2 gen 2x2 20Gpbs) SS cables.
 
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