SSD P/E cycles

[Muse]

OK, Zap, blow me out of the water (hopefully redirecting me to the answers), or not... (I didn't see discussion on this in the New to SSDs? Read this first before asking questions! thread)...

I see stuff online about P/E cycles relating to life expectancies of SSD's. Having just bought my first (Intel 330 180GB), I want some understanding. I've read some articles online but don't see the answers to the following questions.

What activities cause P/E cycles to mount up?

What activities do not cause P/E cycles to mount up?

Do you incur any activity when you simply put your computer to sleep and awaken it?

I plan on keeping my OS and applications on my SSD. However, if I keep some data on an SSD (e.g. databases for access from a database application), will that factor in?
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Haven't decided on OS yet, but I'm hoping to use XP Pro, via the COA on the machine.

 

[Coup27]

Most of this is a non issue but in answer to your questions:

Imagine you have a 4GB SSD. You then save a 4GB movie to this SSD. You watch the movie, and then delete the movie. You empty the recycle bin which triggers the TRIM command. The SSD's garbage collection now erases the movie from the SSD. 1 program/erase cycle has now been used.

Reading data does not cause P/E cycles to be used. Writing data and erasing data does.

Sleep, no, hibernation, yes. Sleeping suspends to RAM, hibernation writes everything to your SSD. SSD's have been known to have issues with sleep so use it under caution.

A database is no more than any other read or write, which will use your P/E cycles. Unless you are hammering over 10GB per day of writes, you do not need to worry about it.

If you are using Windows XP then you will need to make sure you create some aligned partitions prior to installing XP. Make sure you run in AHCI mode and install the Intel SSD Toolbox to allow you to TRIM the drive.

 

[Phynaz]

Sleep, no, hibernation, yes. Sleeping suspends to RAM, hibernation writes everything to your SSD. SSD's have been known to have issues with sleep so use it under caution.

Hybrid sleep also writes out to the hibernation file.

 

[Muse]

Hybrid sleep also writes out to the hibernation file.

I presume hybrid sleep is not an option in XP.

Is it the default sleep mode in Windows 7 and Vista?

 

[Phynaz]

I presume hybrid sleep is not an option in XP.

Is it the default sleep mode in Windows 7 and Vista?

Missed that you are using XP. You really want to use something more modern that has an innate understanding of SSD.

Hybrid sleep is not on by default.

 

[Muse]

Missed that you are using XP. You really want to use something more modern that has an innate understanding of SSD.

I don't know if I want to bother. Reason is I have some apps that work OK in XP, not so hot or at all in Win7. Also, I've seen info about setting up SSD's (in particular Intel) for XP with good success. Intel's SSD Toolbox will help there, and I can align the partition correctly using free utilities or by partitioning the drive with my Win7 machine.

I'm trying to grasp the issues, but it's pretty hazy at the moment. Seems like I'm going to get almost as much speed boost using XP as Vista or Win7, and drive longevity will not be severely compromised if at all. Maybe the biggest downside is Microsoft halting XP support in 2014. I don't have a sense of how that is so terrible except that people are not going to be so concerned with XP support, being device and software developers.

 

[imusorka]

You empty the recycle bin which triggers the TRIM command.

Is TRIM not triggered when deleting through Shift+Del, i.e. skipping the bin?

 

[kevinsbane]

I don't know if I want to bother. Reason is I have some apps that work OK in XP, not so hot or at all in Win7. Also, I've seen info about setting up SSD's (in particular Intel) for XP with good success. Intel's SSD Toolbox will help there, and I can align the partition correctly using free utilities or by partitioning the drive with my Win7 machine.

I'm trying to grasp the issues, but it's pretty hazy at the moment. Seems like I'm going to get almost as much speed boost using XP as Vista or Win7, and drive longevity will not be severely compromised if at all. Maybe the biggest downside is Microsoft halting XP support in 2014. I don't have a sense of how that is so terrible except that people are not going to be so concerned with XP support, being device and software developers.

No security updates past 2014. So if a 0-day exploit is revealed after support ends, it's never going to get patched by Microsoft.

 

[Coup27]

Is TRIM not triggered when deleting through Shift+Del, i.e. skipping the bin?

Yes. TRIM is triggered when a file is actually deleted, so this is a format, shift+del or emptying the recycle bin.

 

[fuzzymath10]

I don't think users need to pay attention to minimizing writes unless they have a very specific application (such as repeatedly copying large files to the drive, deleting them, and repeating).

Yes, even idling at the desktop does use write cycles (background wear leveling, logs, etc.), and with a small and/or poorly implemented SSD you may accumulate a lot of writes. I ran a 32GB OCZ Onyx 24/7 for a year or so. The wearout indicator was at about 20%, and it was because the controller had awful WA. A new firmware update fixed that, and now it's taken another 1-2 years to move down a few percent so I'm no longer worried and it sits in my old laptop.

I think Intel's controllers have WA under control; I swapped the OCZ SSD for an old 80GB X25-M G1 and it used about 1% of its writes in a year running close to 24/7.

 

[Muse]

Yes. TRIM is triggered when a file is actually deleted, so this is a format, shift+del or emptying the recycle bin.

Shift + del is my always used delete action, don't bother with the recycle bin. Should I do away with that habit when I start using a SSD?

 

[Muse]

No security updates past 2014. So if a 0-day exploit is revealed after support ends, it's never going to get patched by Microsoft.

Could that be ameliorated by running an antivirus program?

 

[Revolution 11]

No antivirus can protect against a 0-day exploit which by definition is not analyzed by the AV provider. Turning off your Internet connection is the only way to be safe when using XP past 2014.

 

[kevinsbane]

Could that be ameliorated by running an antivirus program?

Somewhat. The problem is that antivirus programs will typically only catch a specific instance of a software vulnerability. The vulnerability is still there, and another instance of malware which takes advantage of that vulnerability will not be caught by the antivirus (until the antivirus issues a definition for the virus). It would be like having an open window in your house. You can have a security guard watch it, but he has to go to the washroom, sleep, eat, whatever; it works, sort of, but better to just shut and lock the window.