South Dakota now requires 3-day waiting period for abortions

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Texashiker

Lifer
Dec 18, 2010
18,811
197
106
That's up to the woman to decide.

Hopefully, one day society will look back on these times when abortion was legal, and people with that mindset, and hang their head in shame.

Just as keeping slaves, and killing the north American Indian are shameful, so will abortion be.
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
Fun fact since nothing is accomplished by these threads.. In Korea they start counting day you are conceived so everyone is one years old the day you are born. When someone in Korea says they are 31, they are really 30 on everyone else's time. Obviously abortion is illegal there.
 
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bfdd

Lifer
Feb 3, 2007
13,312
1
0
Hopefully, one day society will look back on these times when abortion was legal, and people with that mindset, and hang their head in shame.

Just as keeping slaves, and killing the north American Indian are shameful, so will abortion be.

abortion has been "legal" for far longer than it has been illegal.
 

Texashiker

Lifer
Dec 18, 2010
18,811
197
106
abortion has been "legal" for far longer than it has been illegal.

What is your point?

At one time is was legal to own slaves, and kill them as the owner saw fit
At one time it was legal to kill mormans,
At one time is was legal to kill american indians,
At several times it was legal to kill jews,

Just because something is "legal" does not make it right.

One day our society will move past the "its legal" excuse, and start doing what is right. Killing innocent children is not right.

Maybe one day, which it might take 100 or 150 years for society to mature, we might be able to add "At one time it was legal to kill innocent unborn children" to the list of crimes against humanity.


The solution here is to legalize infanticide...

The only real "solution", is for parents to take responsibility for creating a life.
 
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abaez

Diamond Member
Jan 28, 2000
7,155
1
81
It's all semantics. You think a bunch of cells is a "child" and do not feel it is right. Alot of people do not think that aborting a bunch of cells is murder or bad or anything like that. So you saying that in 100 years we will look back and say, damn I can't believe we allowed this - I don't think that will happen. Maybe it will be banned after 3 months or something like that, but I highly, highly doubt it will become completely illegal.
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
150 year away? That's one hell of a prediction without any supporting evidence. I mean all evidence points to the contrary as abortion is being more liberalized. Even in a couple Muslim countries abortion was allowed in this past decade.
 

Texashiker

Lifer
Dec 18, 2010
18,811
197
106
150 year away? That's one hell of a prediction without any supporting evidence. I mean all evidence points to the contrary as abortion is being more liberalized.

How long was it from the time slavery was introduced in America, to the time it was abolished? Wikipedia says slavery existed in America from the 16th - 19th century. Lets just say 300 years.

Even though the American civil war ended in 1865, Thomas Jefferson wrote in the early 1800s that slavery needed to be abolished. Jefferson compared slavery to holding a wolf by the ears, sooner or later you have to let go.

Once society accepts a topic as justified, it can take generations to change - but change it will. Regardless of how wrong a topic is, if society can justify it, then the actions will be tolerated.

As society becomes more self-centered, abortion may be accepted more freely.

But as society matures, and becomes less self-centered, abortion will be frowned upon, and hopefully outlawed.

Even though abortion is legal, it is morally wrong to kill a child. Even though it was legal to own slaves, people knew morally it was wrong.
 
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CallMeJoe

Diamond Member
Jul 30, 2004
6,938
5
81
How long was it from the time slavery was introduced in America, to the time it was abolished? Wikipedia says slavery existed in America from the 16th - 19th century...
In other words, European settlers started holding slaves here as soon as there were permanent European settlements on the North American continent.
 

Texashiker

Lifer
Dec 18, 2010
18,811
197
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In other words, European settlers started holding slaves here as soon as there were permanent European settlements on the North American continent.


From wikipedia

The first English colony in North America, Virginia, acquired its first Africans in 1619, after a ship arrived, unsolicited, carrying a cargo of about 20 Africans

1865 - 1619 = 246 years


Could be but trends point opposite is all I was saying.

As humanity matures, there is a trend to treat people with more respect - both born and unborn.
 
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her209

No Lifer
Oct 11, 2000
56,336
11
0
Maybe one day, which it might take 100 or 150 years for society to mature, we might be able to add "At one time it was legal to kill innocent unborn children" to the list of crimes against humanity.
Annnnnnnnd maybe in 100 or 150 years we'll be wondering why we found it acceptable to kill people we don't know only because our government officials didn't agree with theirs. But I'm not holding my breath on that one.
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
20
81
What is your point?

At one time is was legal to own slaves, and kill them as the owner saw fit
At one time it was legal to kill mormans,
At one time is was legal to kill american indians,
At several times it was legal to kill jews,

Just because something is "legal" does not make it right.

One day our society will move past the "its legal" excuse, and start doing what is right. Killing innocent children is not right.

Maybe one day, which it might take 100 or 150 years for society to mature, we might be able to add "At one time it was legal to kill innocent unborn children" to the list of crimes against humanity.

No one advocates the killing of innocent children, so you're starting off on powerful rhetoric but shaky logical ground. The debate is and essentially always has been around what qualifies as a child. You might consider a 5 week old group of cells a baby, I do not. Is it life, possibly, but that's a different question. You also assume that life of whatever quality is always better than death, another point I'd dispute.

The reason abortion is legal is not because it's "right", but because there are complex competing interests at work and the overwhelming majority of citizens, legislators and judiciaries who examined the issue at this point in time, given the competing interests and the options available, has found abortion acceptable if still unsavory and unfortunate.

If in the future there is perfect contraception which eliminates any unwanted pregnancies, I believe that humanity will collectively let out a sigh of relief. Medieval doctors used to drill holes in people's heads for unrelated ailments and we find that barbaric now, but we don't really judge them for it given they didn't know what else to do. Abortion is regarded by most as a lesser evil, not as an endorsed and recommended method of birth control, but many of those who rail against abortion also oppose contraception. If our hypothetical future person wants to condemn us for acts of necessity given our limited technology, he would probably also be mystified at resistance to methods that would prevent the choice from having to be made. Oh, and the plastic bags found in the remains of so many women's chests. Did some plague destroy the lungs of women in the 21st century requiring silicon replacements?

If abortion were completely illegal now in all circumstances, futureperson might just as easily look back with horror and say "Wait, if a woman got raped the government would turn her into a baby factory against her will?" This scenario is more plausible than yours given that women will take over the earth soon.
 
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her209

No Lifer
Oct 11, 2000
56,336
11
0
It shouldn't be.
If its not up to the woman to decide, will she get thrown in jail if she drinks alcohol, smokes cigarettes, uses drugs, etc. while pregnant? What if she doesn't eat the right foods, is that consider child abuse and endangerment?
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
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If its not up to the woman to decide, will she get thrown in jail if she drinks alcohol, smokes cigarettes, uses drugs, etc. while pregnant? What if she doesn't eat the right foods, is that consider child abuse and endangerment?

Yes it should. This applies to women who are having kids at the moment and getting drunk. They are also morons.
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
20
81
Yes it should. This applies to women who are having kids at the moment and getting drunk. They are also morons.

3 month pregnant woman doesn't wear a seatbelt, gets in small accident, miscarries. Negligent homicide? Vehicular manslaughter for the guy who hit her car?
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
20
81
Obvious because if the woman dies, the child will as well...
Well that's not either or then.

A combination of both.

Scary fucking world that'd be. Not to mention we'd have to redraft our entire legal code from Trusts & Estate straight through Torts/Negligence and the Criminal code. It's very easy to say fetuses are people, acting like it would necessitate an entirely different society, altogether. (It would necessitate an entirely dfferent society.)
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
76
Well that's not either or then.



Scary fucking world that'd be. Not to mention we'd have to redraft our entire legal code from Trusts & Estate straight through Torts/Negligence and the Criminal code. It's very easy to say fetuses are people, acting like it would necessitate an entirely different society, altogether. (It would necessitate an entirely dfferent society.)

That it would, and I'm not arguing that foetuses are people, just potential life.