Sony Vaio

[coldmeat]

I'm looking to buy a laptop, and I've been really looking at the Sony Vaio FZ290. I did a little bit of searching and found out that you guys don't generally seem to like Sony because of it's high price and maybe some reliability issues.

Ignoring the price difference between it and other similar laptops, what do you guys think of the vaios? I really like the look of it and I've only read good things about the screen. (only 1280x800 for 15.4", but is that really that bad?) I really only want this laptop for bringing to classes and the library and for watching movies and general internet around the house.

There is a Sony store in the mall down the road and I do plan on going in there to see if they have laptops on display, but I'm not really sure if they do.

Also, do you know if I can buy the FZ without the graphics card, because whenever I click "internal" as my option for graphics card, it doesn't select it and it doesn't take the $90 off.

Oh, and should I get 1gb or 2gb for general usage (no gaming), and should I save the $130 and get the 5400rpm hard drive?

I wish there was an option for XP instead of Vista, but oh well.

I'm not too interested in other laptops because of their size, and I don't really like the shiny metal/black look that most of them have.

There is also a $200 off code if I spend >$2000 as well.

Thanks for any input guys.

edit: I should probably say that the main reason I am looking at it is for looks, size, the brightness and sharpness of the display, and because it seems like the hardware is decent enough.

 

[IlllI]

they used to have a reputation for higher than average price for mediocre performance. this one doesnt really convince me they have changed all that much

 

[VinDSL]

Originally posted by: coldmeat
Oh, and should I get 1gb or 2gb for general usage (no gaming), and should I save the $130 and get the 5400rpm hard drive?

If it was me, I'd take the 1 GB RAM option - then, buy 4 GB RAM @ Fry's (or wherever) when it goes on sale... and throw the 1 GB stick(s) in the closet.

And, I'd get the 160 GB Hybrid drive - and, add a 4 GB ReadyBoost card later.

Other than that, your choices look fine, IMHO!

 

[coldmeat]

Originally posted by: VinDSL

Originally posted by: coldmeat
Oh, and should I get 1gb or 2gb for general usage (no gaming), and should I save the $130 and get the 5400rpm hard drive?

If it was me, I'd take the 1 GB RAM option - then, buy 4 GB RAM @ Fry's (or wherever) when it goes on sale... and throw the 1 GB stick(s) in the closet.

And, I'd get the 160 GB Hybrid drive - and, add a 4 GB ReadyBoost card later.

Other than that, your choices look fine, IMHO!

Wouldn't installing my own memory void the warranty? Because the warranty is something I would like to keep for my laptop, especially if there are chances of reliability issues.

 

[TheStu]

Originally posted by: coldmeat

Originally posted by: VinDSL

Originally posted by: coldmeat
Oh, and should I get 1gb or 2gb for general usage (no gaming), and should I save the $130 and get the 5400rpm hard drive?

If it was me, I'd take the 1 GB RAM option - then, buy 4 GB RAM @ Fry's (or wherever) when it goes on sale... and throw the 1 GB stick(s) in the closet.

And, I'd get the 160 GB Hybrid drive - and, add a 4 GB ReadyBoost card later.

Other than that, your choices look fine, IMHO!

Wouldn't installing my own memory void the warranty? Because the warranty is something I would like to keep for my laptop, especially if there are chances of reliability issues.

No, installing RAM, (and usually) hard drives or wireless cards does not void the warranty. unless of course, the RAM is under the keyboard and they don't have instructions available. Then it might, you never know what Sony will do.

 

[996GT2]

That laptop looks incredibly overpriced for what it offers...$1777 starting price and over $2000 when you upgrade a few things such as the processor...

I know you're into the looks and all, but for that price you can get much, much more performance (and maybe reliability) in a laptop. For example, a BETTER EQUIPPED Lenovo Thinkpad T61 15" can be had for HALF THE PRICE of that Sony you posted.

If you use the Lenovo CPP code available from techbargains, you can get a T61 with the following options for $1099.04, with free shipping.

System Processor: Intel® Core? 2 Duo processor T8300 (2.4GHz 800MHz 3MBL2)
Operating System: Genuine Windows Vista Home Premium
Display Panel: 15.4 WSXGA+ TFT
System graphics: NVIDIA Quadro NVS 140M (128MB)
Total memory: 2 GB PC2-5300 DDR2 SDRAM 667MHz SODIMM Memory (2 DIMM)
Pointing Device: UltraNav (TrackPoint and TouchPad)
Hard Drive: 250GB Hard Disk Drive, 5400rpm
Optical device: DVD Recordable 8x Max Dual Layer, Ultrabay Slim
System expansion slots: PC Card Slot & Express Card Slot
Card Reader: 4 in 1 Media Card Reader
Wireless cards: Intel Wireless WiFi Link 4965AGN (supporting Centrino Pro)
Battery: 9 cell Li-Ion Battery

Thinkpads are some of the most well-built systems in the laptop industry, so there is no reason why a Sony with a worse feature set should cost almost TWICE as much...I mean, come on, a Macbook Pro costs the same as the Sony when you equip both to the same specs...You could also easily get a better-equipped Dell XPS M1530 for $400-500 less after coupons.

Because of that, I'd advise you to look around and make sure that there are really NO other laptops you'd rather have in terms of looks or whatnot before you spring on this deal. It's quite a bad one IMO.


Edit: If you look on notebookreview.com or read the forums, you'll find that battery life isn't exactly the FZ's strong point...something to keep in mind, especially if you plan on carrying it around without taking the AC adaptor everywhere.

 

[jpeyton]

The Sony you picked seems more like a general purpose laptop; your planned usage suggests you should find something with better portability (14" or less, 4.5lbs or less).

Also, the Sony is really overpriced for its segment. A Dell of equivalent specs would go for roughly 50% less; even more stylish Dell XPS notebooks are about $500 less. HP and IBM/Lenovo are also drastically cheaper, as are 'boutique' offerings from smaller notebook manufacturers like Asus.

That is one thing I never understood; most other manufacturers (besides Apple) have responded to industry price pressures, but Sony generally keeps their prices high without offering any real differentiation in their style (which I think is generic) or quality (which is in line with everyone else).

If this notebook will be carried often to class/library, look at the Dell XPS1330, and 12"/13" options from other manufacturers. If you're not gaming, and just using this for school/internet/movies, you don't need discrete graphics or a high-powered CPU. Never pay for factory memory upgrades, because they are much cheaper to DIY.

 

[coldmeat]

Originally posted by: 996GT2
That laptop looks incredibly overpriced for what it offers...$1777 starting price and over $2000 when you upgrade a few things such as the processor...

I know you're into the looks and all, but for that price you can get much, much more performance (and maybe reliability) in a laptop. For example, a BETTER EQUIPPED Lenovo Thinkpad T61 15" can be had for HALF THE PRICE of that Sony you posted.

If you use the Lenovo CPP code available from techbargains, you can get a T61 with the following options for $1099.04, with free shipping.

System Processor: Intel® Core? 2 Duo processor T8300 (2.4GHz 800MHz 3MBL2)
Operating System: Genuine Windows Vista Home Premium
Display Panel: 15.4 WSXGA+ TFT
System graphics: NVIDIA Quadro NVS 140M (128MB)
Total memory: 2 GB PC2-5300 DDR2 SDRAM 667MHz SODIMM Memory (2 DIMM)
Pointing Device: UltraNav (TrackPoint and TouchPad)
Hard Drive: 250GB Hard Disk Drive, 5400rpm
Optical device: DVD Recordable 8x Max Dual Layer, Ultrabay Slim
System expansion slots: PC Card Slot & Express Card Slot
Card Reader: 4 in 1 Media Card Reader
Wireless cards: Intel Wireless WiFi Link 4965AGN (supporting Centrino Pro)
Battery: 9 cell Li-Ion Battery

Thinkpads are some of the most well-built systems in the laptop industry, so there is no reason why a Sony with a worse feature set should cost almost TWICE as much...I mean, come on, a Macbook Pro costs the same as the Sony when you equip both to the same specs...You could also easily get a better-equipped Dell XPS M1530 for $400-500 less after coupons.

Because of that, I'd advise you to look around and make sure that there are really NO other laptops you'd rather have in terms of looks or whatnot before you spring on this deal. It's quite a bad one IMO.


Edit: If you look on notebookreview.com or read the forums, you'll find that battery life isn't exactly the FZ's strong point...something to keep in mind, especially if you plan on carrying it around without taking the AC adaptor everywhere.

Thanks for the info.

I'd like to stay away from Lenovo, because even though it is a lot cheaper, they look like they were made 15 years ago, and they have glossy screens right?

I'm willing to pay more for a quality anti-glare screen and looks.

And I did read the notebookreview review on the laptop, and did notice that the battery wasn't so good, but when I looked on the sony website, they offer an upgraded battery that is supposed to last 1.5 times longer. This is included in the $1777.

Also, if I drop some of the software that I don't want, and bring the hard drive down to 5400rpm, and if it is possible to get rid of the graphics card, then the price is brought down to $1526. I also read somewhere that sony has free shipping as well.

I'm not trying to convince you to tell me it's a good deal, it's just that for some reason I keep coming back to the FZ.

edit: what do you guys think about 1280x800 on a 15.4" display?

 

[VinDSL]

Originally posted by: coldmeat
I'd like to stay away from Lenovo, because even though it is a lot cheaper, they look like they were made 15 years ago...

Atta boy!!!

Stick to your guns!

Lenovo is NOT IBM!

Lenovo Klunkpads = cheap Chinese junk made to *look* like IBMs from their heyday... retro lappys, if you will...

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: VinDSL
Lenovo Klunkpads = cheap Chinese junk made to *look* like IBMs from their heyday

My "klunkpad" has a nice magnesium rollcage. What do the "Made In China" Sonys have underneath their keyboards?

The "Chinese junk" argument isn't really valid anymore, since a majority of the world's computer components are either entirely or partially manufactured and assembled in China.

 

[TheStu]

Yea, I have no idea what this resurgance of 'Merican made insistence has come from. Honestly, so much stuff is either made or assembled over there, why is this such a big deal? It is called a World Market people, get with the times. And who cares where it is made if it meets the standards that are set in teh country that you buy it in?

 

[VinDSL]

Originally posted by: jpeyton
My "klunkpad" has a nice magnesium rollcage.

True! And, I'm sure that's great if you're in the habit of throwing baseballs inside your house, or whatever...

Unfortunately, the exterior panels are made of some sort of cheesy plastic-like material that shouts "I'M CHEAP!!!"

I *think* that's what the OP is talking about...

The Sony Vaio looks MUCH classier!

 

[996GT2]

Originally posted by: VinDSL

Originally posted by: jpeyton
My "klunkpad" has a nice magnesium rollcage.

True! And, I'm sure that's great if you're in the habit of throwing baseballs inside your house, or whatever...

Unfortunately, the exterior panels are made of some sort of cheesy plastic-like material that shouts "I'M CHEAP!!!"

You do realize that Lenovo switched from titanium to the carbon fiber reinforced plastic exterior for a reason, right? The new material lets wifi signals through easier, giving the Thinkpads better reception than most other laptops without the use of an external antenna. And carbon fiber is by no means a cheap material to get. After doing my research of all of the major manufactors in my college laptop search, I really came to the conclusion that Lenovo is about as good as it gets in terms of build quality.

Originally posted by: VinDSL

Originally posted by: coldmeat
I'd like to stay away from Lenovo, because even though it is a lot cheaper, they look like they were made 15 years ago...

Atta boy!!!

Stick to your guns!

Lenovo is NOT IBM!

Lenovo Klunkpads = cheap Chinese junk made to *look* like IBMs from their heyday... retro lappys, if you will...

You really think that previous IBM Thinkpads weren't made in China? Or that the Vaio isn't made in China, either? ANY laptop you can buy today probably got the brunt of its assembly done there. I don't know if you realize yet, but during the average day you'll probably touch/use/interact with something that was made there every minute or so.

I understand if the OP wants to buy the Sony based on looks and styling, but that's no excuse to be dishing out all this racist bashing of the new Thinkpads just because IBM got bought out by Lenovo. Have you read any reviews from PC Mag, CNET, Notebookreview.com, or any other major computer site lately? The Thinkpad T series and X series are among the highest rated laptops on every single one of those sites; in fact, multiple current Thinkpads (T61, X61, X61 Tablet, X60) are editor's choice at both PC Mag and CNET, among other places. You'd think that maybe those POS "Klunkpads" would be getting a few less awards and accolades if they were really as crappy as you say they were, just eh? Btw, how many Sony Vaios do you see getting editor's choice awards? That's right, none.

What other laptop has a spillproof keyboard, except purpose built ones like the Panasonic Toughbook? Try spilling a cup of joe on the Sony and see if it drains out the other side through the non-existent drain holes. What other laptop has been confirmed by independent tests to withstand multiple 3-foot drops and have Windows still boot properly afterward? What other laptop line has been praised by countless sources as having the best keyboards ever made in any mobile computer? What laptop is the only one in use on the International Space Station? That's right, those clunky, black plastic "Klunkpads."

This isn't really directed at the OP, it's just my 2 cents' reply to VinDSL's blatantly unbacked (and kinda racist) bashing of the Thinkpad.

 

[Atheus]

Anyone here actually dropped a Vaio? Or spilt something on it? I am considering buying the TZ very soon.

 

[TheStu]

I have actually dropped my macbook (ok, what actually happened was that it was overhanging a table edge, and I swung my arm up, catching the corner of the macbook, it then flew about 2-3 feet into the air, and then obviously came back down) and it still works. Also, it was inundated with a healthy amount of water and still works. These are not thing that it is designed for but my macbook has stood up to some truly hellacious abuse.

 

[VinDSL]

Originally posted by: 996GT2
This isn't really directed at the OP, it's just my 2 cents' reply to VinDSL's blatantly unbacked (and kinda racist) bashing of the Thinkpad.

Sorry, Mr. Yang - I didn't mean to insult your ancestors, so please don't take it that way!

I LOVE Chinese women, food, firecrackers, and communism... I just don't care for their laptops.

I know almost all laptops are made in China (American corporate greed greased with the suffering of cheap/slave labor) and they're all junk, designed to last 2-3 years, but...

The OP stated he does NOT want a pig with lipstick, e.g. a Klunkpad.

He wants a lappy that looks nice, and is willing to pay for it. What's wrong with that?

When it comes to *classy looks*, nothing beats Apple and Sony notebooks.

For innovative and fresh looks, that would be ASUS, but he's apparently not into that either. He wants 'Sony Style'.

Lenovo Thinkpads are the '55 Chevies of the new millennium - old rust bucket styling with a fuel-injected engine and 'roll cage', if you will.

If that's what YOU are into, so be it, but not everybody shares this view of mobile computing!

Personally, I'm running a Toshiba A215 Vista multimedia lappy with 4 GB RAM, 4 GB ReadyBoost, one-week old BIOS, and Service Pack 1 Final. This thing looks great, and it flies (approx. $800 investment) - but, that isn't what the OP asked.

I'm sticking with my original recommendation... Get the Sony!

Look at that thing - It's gorgeous!!! :thumbsup:

 

[coldmeat]

I think I'm going to go for the Sony, but everytime I make up my mind, the battery life scares me off. I can get the extended battery, but it sticks out the back and props the laptop up which seems kinda silly.

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: VinDSL
I LOVE Chinese women, food, firecrackers, and communism... I just don't care for their laptops.

Apple MacBooks are made in China. So are Sony VAIOs. What laptops do you care for?

I know almost all laptops are made in China (American corporate greed greased with the suffering of cheap/slave labor) and they're all junk, designed to last 2-3 years, but...

Again, I'm not following your argument. If you say almost all laptops are "Made In China", and all "Made In China" laptops are junk, then you're in effect saying: almost all laptops are junk. So, once again, I'm curious, what laptops do you not think are junk?

The OP stated he does NOT want a pig with lipstick, e.g. a Klunkpad.

If the OP doesn't like the styling of a Thinkpad, that's understandable. Calling it a "pig in lipstick" is basically saying you don't like anything modern with retro styling (e.g. new Camaro, new Mustang, etc.). I can tell you that many people do prefer classic styling, just as many people prefer modern styling.

He wants a lappy that looks nice, and is willing to pay for it. What's wrong with that?

Nothing is wrong with that. You just simply insist on bashing Thinkpads as 'cheap plastic Chinese junk' without offering any verifiable evidence. I can link a dozen independent reviews saying the exact opposite.

When it comes to *classy looks*, nothing beats Apple and Sony notebooks.

Entirely subjective. A proper way to say this would be adding the phrase "I think"...as in "I think Apple and Sony are the best looking notebooks". That is a true statement. The way you have it worded now can be argued true or false because you've offered no evidence to back it.

Personally, I'm running a Toshiba A215 Vista multimedia lappy

Speaking of "Made In China" plastic laptops...

Just to re-iterate my point, you are absolutely correct in saying that you and the OP don't like ThinkPad styling. That is your opinion and you're welcome to it.

But if you continue to bash ThinkPads (or any other laptop) in regards to performance or quality, hold yourself to a higher standard and offer some proof. The only reason you wouldn't is because you don't have any.

 

[Kate724]

Wow, love this thread. Keep it going, this is great because a lot of info is coming out which most people are afraid to say. I'm still looking for a laptop and was leaning toward Thinkpad. You convinced me that Sony is out (sorry OP). Lets hear about the other companies - Dell, Toshiba????

Kate

 

[TheStu]

I am currently repairing a Dell laptop, and I would never buy one based on the truly terrible decision that were made during the design/construction phase of this system. Dell used a painfully low quality solder for most of the ports, almost guaranteeing that within a few years the DC-In system will fail. And ordinarily, that wouldn't be to big of an issue, many OEMs place this on another PCB altogether, but in this case the DC in is located on the motherboard, and it took me hours to desolder the 9 pins that it has. 2 of them were black from corrosion, and another 2 had to be physically drilled out since the solder used wouldn't melt.

The exterior construction IMO, is not much better.

I have never been impressed with Toshiba, sure they are cheap, but there is a reason for that. They too made some seriously odd decisions regarding the innards and putting them together.

HP is getting better and better, but I have never repaired one, so I can't speak to how well they hold up over time.

I really like my MacBook, but I realize that it is not for everyone, personally I find that it is built like a tank (although not sold as such), but there are some aching design flaws (really thing plastic on the palmrests, right where the lid closes, almost guaranteeing a cracked palmrest). Plus they had (past tense) the yellowing issue on the white macbooks, but that has since been rectified. And if you look at ebay, you will see that not only do Macs hold their value, but they also tend to still be usable years down the road. I think my buddy determined that the top-of-the-line Mac from 7 years ago was able to run the newest OS (10.5) and quite well. Say what you will about Vista being good or bad, but you cannot say that even the top of the line system from 7 years ago could run it well.

I generally hear nothing but good things about Thinkpads. And you see basically just as many of them on ebay, just as old as the macs, and although they might not have the latest OS, they are still kickin

 

[VinDSL]

Originally posted by: jpeyton
Just to re-iterate my point, you are absolutely correct in saying that you and the OP don't like ThinkPad styling. That is your opinion and you're welcome to it...

Sorry, but I can't continue in this thread... now that you've seen fit to interject yourself into the middle of the discussion...

I was warned, not 3 days ago, about 'mod baiting' in a different forum, and I'm smelling a rat in this one.

Have it your way! I'm outta here...

 

[coldmeat]

I like the way this thread is going.

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: VinDSL
Sorry, but I can't continue in this thread... now that you've seen fit to interject yourself into the middle of the discussion...

I was warned, not 3 days ago, about 'mod baiting' in a different forum, and I'm smelling a rat in this one.

Have it your way! I'm outta here...

Don't let me infringe on your right to speak. All this can really be traced back to this comment you made:

Lenovo Klunkpads = cheap Chinese junk made to *look* like IBMs from their heyday... retro lappys, if you will...

If you could qualify that with some user or industry reviews, that would be great.

For example, to prove my point that ThinkPads are well-built laptops (e.g. not "cheap Chinese junk"), I submit the following:

Notebook Review

The ThinkPad T61 is a premium product with a durable build, it is geared towards business users or simply those willing to pay a bit more to get something that won't fall apart after 1-year of use.

So how does the T61 excel build-wise? Basically the same as its predecessor T-series notebooks did. The T61 body is a rugged plastic that does not flex. Inside the stiff and thick plastic casing is a magnesium roll cage in both the lid and main chassis. The lid on the previous T60 was a magnesium material, while the lid on the T61 is a plastic composite with a magnesium "roll cage" plate inside. The reason for plastic now being used in the lid is to allow better penetration of radio waves, such as 802.11 and WWAN, thus providing greater wireless range and signal strength.

The keyboard is spill proof and has two drain holes to make sure if you do happen to spill your morning Starbucks coffee, the liquid is carried away from sensitive components and out through the bottom of the notebook

The thick metal hinges that attach the screen are very rigid and ensure the screen does not wobble. You'll need two hands to adjust and open the screen as the hinges are very tight. The double screen latch system locks securely to make sure the screen stays down when being carried around.

PC Magazine

When you factor in all the other intangibles (comfortable keyboard, lightweight chassis, and more), it's obvious why the Editors' Choice for business laptops couldn't go to anyone else.

Laptop Magazine

You can't tell by looking at the familiar squared-off matte-black chassis, but the Lenovo ThinkPad T61 delivers dozens of subtle improvements that make it the widescreen machine to beat among thin-and-light business notebooks. This 5.2-pound classic isn't perfect, but it's darn close.

Behind the 14.1-inch screen, Lenovo has added a magnesium-alloy inner shell to better protect the display, similar to the internal rollcage added to the bottom of the chassis a few years ago. Lenovo claims that the screen is now 25 percent more resistant to breakage than previous models.

Geek.com

During testing the T61 proved itself to be reliable, powerful, and easy to use...the notebook is as sturdy as ever...the build quality is excellent...there are thick metal hinges holding the LCD firmly in place...

The Rollcage is designed to protect the notebook from all sorts of damage, but is also optimized to reduce weight. One of the biggest improvements it has seen in the upgrade is to the LCD cover which is stronger than ever before and is designed so that the WWAN antenna can go behind the display...

CNet

It's still pricey when configured for power users, but the typical excellent ThinkPad build quality makes this a system that should enjoy a long lifespan.

 

[996GT2]

Exactly. Just because Lenovo is currently offering 25% off with an additional 15% coupon does NOT make these laptops any less good than they already were. It's funny now a lot of people are looking to save a few bucks in Hot Deals, then in Notebooks/SFF they associate a lower price with "cheap junk." The Thinkpad T61 I linked on the previous page was selling for over $1600 just a few months ago, and a similarly configured (and priced) T61 Mobile Workstation would have been worth nearly $2000 not long ago. Lenovo's having some great discounts right now (persumably to clear out stock), and it's definitely a good time to buy if you want to get you hands on some of the best-made laptops in the industry.

Also, I'd like to say a few things about Lenovo's tech support. Part of the reason Thinkpads became my first choice in a laptop for college use was due to my friend's praise of their tech support system. He's in college at Columbia University; on one occassion, he accidentally left the DVD-RW drive open while walking with the laptop and bent the tray pretty badly. He called them up under warranty, and Lenovo overnighted him a new drive (which arrived the next day). On two other occassions, Lenovo's done the same for batteries and other parts; this kind of service consistency is definitely not something to overlook, and really shows that the new Thinkpads do not lag in the warranty department when compared to the older, IBM made ones.

With regard to other manufacturers, here's how I would rank them in terms of build quality and reliability:

Generally reputed to have good build quality/reliability:
Apple
Lenovo (especially the Thinkpad line)
Panasonic (not a huge market share though)
Fujitsu
Dell Latitude
HP/Compaq Business Models


Average build quality/reliability, maybe a few issues here and there:
Dell's consumer lines (Inspiron/XPS)
HP/Compaq Consumer Models
Toshiba
Sony
Asus
Acer
Gateway

Now, people's opinions will of course vary greatly on this issue, but what I've listed above is the conclusion I've come to after doing research on a number of brands in my own laptop search.

So what kind of issues might you have with one of the makers with average quality? Let's use Dell as an example. In the months right after the XPS M1330 was released, some people reported that trim and other minor parts were badly assembled, and, in some cases were literally falling off on their top of the line XPS laptops.

Here's a site where a buyer took some pictures of his right after receiving it:
http://www.obscurehideout.com/

Dell may have fixed this problem now, but I do remember reading that quality control was quite a widespread issue with early-run models of these notebooks. Personally, I would stick with a model from a manufacturer with a reputation for good build quality.