Sony 930E

[Craig234]

I've had the 930E recommended to me and am considering buying one at Black Friday prices.

I noticed today they've come down from the usual $2500 (but $2100 at a local retailer) to $2000 many places.

Whaddya think?

Any comments on the tv or the price? (Likely tv/movies/pc and maybe light console gaming).

Not sure what's coming in the next year or two, they keep adding things (HDR and improved versions of it, OLED if they make it without burn-in, etc.)

 

[Harry_Wild]

Much brighter screen then the 900E series. It is against the Samsung 9000 I think and LG Quantum models. I do not like the Android based Smart TV and it sort of slow and missing major main streaming apps like most of the other too. Samsung seem to be the fastest with their Tizan? based Smart TV. It all up to you! I have had good luck with Samsung TVs. Sony never owned one other then their Wega TV CRT circa line which was a tank!

What are you looking for?

 

[Craig234]

Much brighter screen then the 900E series. It is against the Samsung 9000 I think and LG Quantum models. I do not like the Android based Smart TV and it sort of slow and missing major main streaming apps like most of the other too. Samsung seem to be the fastest with their Tizan? based Smart TV. It all up to you! I have had good luck with Samsung TVs. Sony never owned one other then their Wega TV CRT circa line which was a tank!

What are you looking for?

Just looking for a combination of picture quality - the brighter more colorful the better, but not unattractive like some I see, hard to describe; a bit of future-proofing and value. Forums suggested the 930E,
and suggested the tv's are better than Samsung (no offense), which I otherwise might look at at Costco's black Friday.

Interesting point on the 'apps' - I've never used 'apps' on a tv so not sure how much an issue it is. I'll hope the Sony isnt' too bad so that it's not worth making an important factor, and that the opinions were correct.

Speaking of Sony tanks, a decade ago I actually purchased a 300+ pound Sony 40" CRT ($1600), the biggest ever made just before CRTs were disappearing. Luckily I was able to refund it before delivery.

 

[imported_bman]

I have a 900E and the picture quality is excellent and the sound is surprisingly good for TV speakers. As for future proofing you will be out of luck since HDMI 2.1 is going to rollout in 2018. Unless there is a chance Sony might enable some of the features of HDMI 2.1 via firmware updates. Samsung on the other hand has said that their 2016 and 2017 TVs should get some HDMI 2.1 features via firmware updates, specifically VRR (basically freesync) which is a big deal if you have a Xbox One X.

Like Harry said the interface is an absolute dog. Netflix is still useable, but Youtube often fails at playing 4k. Even worse is that core interface like volume control or settings menus are laggy. Most of these issues stem from the bottom of the barrel Mediatek SoC Sony picked. My brother has a Samsung KS8500 and from using it I can definitely say that the Google TV interface that Sony uses is substantially inferior to Samsung's Tizen based OS. The only advantage the Sony tv has when it comes to the OS is that it makes good use of voice commands, being able to search Youtube/Netflix using the mic on the remote makes those apps usable without a phone or tablet. The bad interface is not a deal killer, but it does suck that Sony's flagship TV has a slow interface because someone decided to shave off $10 on the cost of TV by choosing an outdated and slow SoC.

 

[Craig234]

Hm. Well another option is always wait for next year... thanks for the feedback so far. I expect I'll have a PC hooked up to it though, so can use that for things like Netflix. The HDMI sounds like a possible
problem on future proofing?

 

[Craig234]

Well, local chain has the 930E for $1699, free local delivery, they'll take away and recycle my old 65" for $30.

 

[Harry_Wild]

Hm. Well another option is always wait for next year... thanks for the feedback so far. I expect I'll have a PC hooked up to it though, so can use that for things like Netflix. The HDMI sounds like a possible
problem on future proofing?

You really don't want to use a PC in theses times of streaming boxes like Apple TV and Roku boxes. They are so much better in every way for such tasks, and they have tiny footprints too. It probably better to use you built-in Smart TV function then a PC unless the app you want is not in their library.

 

[Craig234]

You really don't want to use a PC in theses times of streaming boxes like Apple TV and Roku boxes. They are so much better in every way for such tasks, and they have tiny footprints too. It probably better to use you built-in Smart TV function then a PC unless the app you want is not in their library.

Fair enough. Between the TV, a PS4, a Fire TV, I should have plenty of ways to get to apps.

The PC will mostly be for gaming.

 

[Aikouka]

I own a 930e, and it's a good TV. You'll probably be quite surprised at its backlighting given that it's quite good for an edge-lit set. (The 900e is FALD where the 930e is edge-lit.) Although, I will warn you that any off-angle viewing does result in a bit more of a halo effect in darker scenes. Similar to most TN panels, it does work far better when you sit in the "right spot". I agree with what others say about Android TV... it's pretty much garbage on the TV, and it does affect other more important things such as menu speed. Fortunately, you don't usually have many reasons to go into the menu, so it doesn't affect me that much.

Also, do note that while Sony has mentioned Dolby Vision will be coming to the TV, it still isn't here yet. It has been delayed for months, and Sony has stated that they should provide more information about its release in December. The rumor is that it will be released in March '18. (Sony's last statement was by the end of this year.) They did show off a working demo to Forbes, which the reviewer had good things to say about it.

Although, I do want to note that I wouldn't push for a more expensive set like this unless you plan on delving into HDR and such. That's really what this TV is geared for with its high brightness. You'll also want some good quality cables if you plan on doing High-Speed HDMI (18Gbps). If your cables don't support it, all you'll get is a nice, black screen. (I've had a lot of fun dealing with that problem.)

It probably better to use you built-in Smart TV function then a PC unless the app you want is not in their library.

If you use a good surround sound setup, you do not want to use built-in apps due to the inability to transmit lossless or object-based audio to your receiver. HDMI's ARC only supports lossy audio (HDMI 2.1 will support Dolby Atmos), and that's the same as S/P-DIF.

 

[Craig234]

Well, the reason I went for the 930E over a worse TV is for the image quality, the bright colors; I assume HDR will just happened when the content supports it. I expect to only sit in front, not a side view.

So not sure what 'delving into' HDR means or the 'and such' is. Glad you like your 930E also.

 

[Aikouka]

So not sure what 'delving into' HDR means or the 'and such' is. Glad you like your 930E also.

What I mean is that there isn't much of a reason to spring for the 930e if you don't plan on watching HDR content. It's still a good TV regardless, but it's also an expensive TV. The benefits that you gain from it are mostly in regard to its higher brightness, slightly better scaling of non-4K content and upcoming Dolby Vision. If you don't plan on using HDR, the only benefit from that list is the 4K scaling as the higher brightness is really for HDR and Dolby Vision is just dynamic HDR.

 

[Craig234]

What I mean is that there isn't much of a reason to spring for the 930e if you don't plan on watching HDR content. It's still a good TV regardless, but it's also an expensive TV. The benefits that you gain from it are mostly in regard to its higher brightness, slightly better scaling of non-4K content and upcoming Dolby Vision. If you don't plan on using HDR, the only benefit from that list is the 4K scaling as the higher brightness is really for HDR and Dolby Vision is just dynamic HDR.

OK, my impression was that HDR is a pretty universal improvement, one definitely worth getting - only the lowest tv's anymore seem not to have it. I do like the brighter picture and colors (to a point).

I was trying to decide what to get, how much to spend, to get a good tv but not overspend paying a premium for the best, and was advised to get this one. Main issue might be the lack of HDMI 2.1.

 

[Aikouka]

OK, my impression was that HDR is a pretty universal improvement, one definitely worth getting - only the lowest tv's anymore seem not to have it. I do like the brighter picture and colors (to a point).

I'm not saying that it's not an improvement. I'm talking about what you plan on using the TV for. For example, if you're just going to play standard Blu-ray movies or stream 1080p Netflix, there's no point in the HDR TV. HDR will require content that supports it such as UHD BR discs and 4K streaming from Netflix, VUDU, etc. (Although, I think VUDU just supports Dolby Vision as that's what I see listed on my 4K digital movies, but I'm not 100% sure about that.)

 

[Craig234]

I'm not saying that it's not an improvement. I'm talking about what you plan on using the TV for. For example, if you're just going to play standard Blu-ray movies or stream 1080p Netflix, there's no point in the HDR TV. HDR will require content that supports it such as UHD BR discs and 4K streaming from Netflix, VUDU, etc. (Although, I think VUDU just supports Dolby Vision as that's what I see listed on my 4K digital movies, but I'm not 100% sure about that.)

Ah. I wasn't aware that HDR was no benefit for DVD and blu-ray (and presumably TV stations). But other uses are expected to include gaming and streaming (netflix at least). The brighter colors are still an improvement I assume though - it looked better in stores than cheaper tv's even with non-HDR sources.

If you're raising questions whether I should reconsider this model...

I did think about the logic of spending half as much, allowing an upgrade in the nearer future when there will be better features and lowered prices...

That sweet spot, hope the 930E is it.

 

[Aikouka]

Ah. I wasn't aware that HDR was no benefit for DVD and blu-ray (and presumably TV stations). But other uses are expected to include gaming and streaming (netflix at least). The brighter colors are still an improvement I assume though - it looked better in stores than cheaper tv's even with non-HDR sources.

Well, Sony does tout their X1 Extreme processor, which is found in the 930e and above, as being able to perform more than just a simple 4K upscaling. You can read about their claims here. It's hard for me to really say how well it works as I haven't messed with the settings much to try turning features off. Also, most of my devices output in 4K already, so I don't know what the Sony TV does with existing non-HDR 4K content.

Now, I can attest to how good the TV looks. I purchased a TCL P605, which is like the lauded P607 but with a simpler remote. These TVs both support 4K and HDR (and the TCL supports Dolby Vision right now); however, just watching normal content is vastly different. When I load up Plex on the 930e, the black background looks so black that you might assume you're watching an OLED. On the other hand, the P605 has your typical issue where there's too much backlight and the screen has a bit of a grayish hue. (I did setup the dynamic backlighting, but it seems like it doesn't work or it just isn't as good as Sony's?) The localized dynamic backlighting is pretty good on the 930e for an edge-lit set. Apparently, it has some diffuser layer inside that redirects the light or something like that. So, it looks more like a FALD setup, but with the thinness of an edge-lit TV.

 

[Craig234]

A factor I didn't mention in the buy or wait topic was that I recently got a 34" monitor nearly half the price of the 930E - so I can either use the 930E for video and gaming or the monitor but having both seems like I could use one instead.

 

[bigi]

As x900e owner I fail to see how more brightness will help with anything. It x900e has great picture quality and for $1499 for 65" model is a good buy IMO.

I use dedicated sound receiver and speakers, but onboard audio is actually very good for what it is.

Lastly, I have disabled 90% of crap running on my TV that I would not ever use. Android TV is fast that way. You tube and Netflix work perfectly fine. This can be done via pro settings menu.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fKRNVHXeQDk&t=178s

 

[Aikouka]

As x900e owner I fail to see how more brightness will help with anything.

It's mostly beneficial for HDR. The recommendation is to have a TV capable of around 1000 nits for HDR, but of course, you don't need it. I'll tell you that the TV can get quite bright when in HDR.

Although, it can also be a bit awkward when dealing with vastly different lighting in scenes that are being swapped to. I haven't really seen this happen much, but a really egregious example was in Marvel's latest Netflix show, The Punisher. During one scene, it had two FBI agents talking to each other in an office. One agent's back was to a large wall of windows while the other had his back to the door. Since the scene facing the window had a large portion of the window in the frame and it was daytime, it was a very bright scene. The scene was shot in a-cam/b-cam style, which meant the cameras were static and would usually swap when someone was talking. (This is pretty much the most basic directorial style used for dialog.) So, when the female agent was talking, the view was bright, and then the male agent was talking, it would swap to a much darker view. When that happened, the backlight dimming was VERY apparent.

 

[Aikouka]

Sony announced that the Dolby Vision update will start rolling out in mid-January in the US.

 

[Craig234]

Sony announced that the Dolby Vision update will start rolling out in mid-January in the US.

Yay. I wonder how much content will benefit and how much you'll notice.

 

[Aikouka]

Yay. I wonder how much content will benefit and how much you'll notice.

There was a previous article from Forbes where they saw a demonstration of it, and they seemed pretty impressed overall.

 

[Aikouka]

So, Sony released the Dolby Vision update, and unfortunately... it only works on the TV's apps. Sony hasn't been very forthcoming with what to expect, but they've removed references to Dolby Vision on the update's patch notes. Some say it might be related to the bug that Dolby found recently that affects all Dolby Vision devices over HDMI, and it must be fixed on the TV. Some say it relates to Sony using some weird profile that doesn't work with the standard Dolby Vision profile. One article said a Sony rep stated that it "wasn't that bad" and a fix is forthcoming.

One thing that was interesting is that Forbes said that the Dolby Vision preview that they saw was done off USB, which also doesn't work now. So, it's almost like things regressed. I wonder if Sony tried to quickly implement Dolby's fix, which LG stated is a Dolby Vision library. Perhaps the new library required some extra tweaking, but since it was only announced during CES, Sony didn't get enough testing in? It'll be interesting to see what happens with this, but I can tell you that the Sony forums are not currently a bastion of happiness.

 

[Aikouka]

We've gotten some updates about the Sony Dolby Vision situation. Essentially, it appears that the rumors of Sony using a different implementation of Dolby Vision were true. One pro of Dolby Vision is that it has superior legacy support as it's compatible with HDMI 1.4 and 2.0, which it does by embedding the metadeta into the video stream. However, the metadata must be removed by the TV for processing, which is a bit time consuming. Sony's latest update actually implements an HDMI 2.1 feature called dynamic metadata, which allows it to receive the metadata separately from the video stream; however, the source has to support this as well.

So, where does this leave us? Well, there is some good news there as the Apple TV tvOS 11.3 Beta supports Dolby Vision on Sony TVs, and Oppo has stated that they're looking into it and working with their SoC provider. If you have an Apple TV and want to try it out, you can enable beta updates by going to beta.apple.com, and signing in using the same Apple ID that you use on your Apple TV. That will enable the beta updates option on your Apple TV, and fortunately, Apple released the 11.3 public beta earlier today. I've got it installing right now, so I'll be checking out to see how it works.

 

[cmdrdredd]

We've gotten some updates about the Sony Dolby Vision situation. Essentially, it appears that the rumors of Sony using a different implementation of Dolby Vision were true. One pro of Dolby Vision is that it has superior legacy support as it's compatible with HDMI 1.4 and 2.0, which it does by embedding the metadeta into the video stream. However, the metadata must be removed by the TV for processing, which is a bit time consuming. Sony's latest update actually implements an HDMI 2.1 feature called dynamic metadata, which allows it to receive the metadata separately from the video stream; however, the source has to support this as well.

So, where does this leave us? Well, there is some good news there as the Apple TV tvOS 11.3 Beta supports Dolby Vision on Sony TVs, and Oppo has stated that they're looking into it and working with their SoC provider. If you have an Apple TV and want to try it out, you can enable beta updates by going to beta.apple.com, and signing in using the same Apple ID that you use on your Apple TV. That will enable the beta updates option on your Apple TV, and fortunately, Apple released the 11.3 public beta earlier today. I've got it installing right now, so I'll be checking out to see how it works.

Just to add to this line of discussion, the update was worked on by Dolby and Sony jointly for about a year. Dolby knew the change to the way the metadata was handled would require updates for UHD players and streaming boxes. Yet Dolby didn't work with them to provide working solutions according to Oppo. So the situation is a little strange to me, but it should be fixed in time I'd guess.

 

[Aikouka]

I've been watching some Dolby Vision content on my Apple TV through Netflix, and I'm not sure if something is wrong with my Apple TV, the AVR-to-TV HDMI cable, or something else. The problem that I notice is that during scenes with dark colors in the corner, there seems to be this sort of flash of black blocks in the dark corners. Although, I've never been able to play any HDR content on the Apple TV without issues, so I don't know if this is just another problem. In typical HDR10 content, I get random black frames inserted, and upon rewinding to check again, they're not there.

I'm trying to figure out if the issue could be my HDMI cable as it's an active cable (Monoprice DynamicView 25-foot). It's their only cable that actively supports HDR and Dolby Vision, but there's nothing in the listing about it supporting Dynamic Metadata for Dolby Vision.