Something weird is going on with Windows Updates

[yukichigai]

I have several systems running XP, my main system running XP x64. Now I have it set on ALL my systems so that it at most auto-downloads but lets me choose which updates to install, and on the x64 system it prompts before downloading AND installing. Well, it did. I woke up this morning and discovered an unexpected "you need to restart your computer" box from Automatic Updates. I was too groggy to process fully, but now that I've fired up the laptop I've found the same box here, and what's more I just noticed that my automatic update prefs have been reset to "Automatically Install Every Day"!

Now I could chalk this up to operator error on one computer, but on both the laptop and the main computer? No. I'm absolutely certain I set both machines so they NEVER auto-install updates. Honestly, this disturbs me. I can think of no possible common cause which would do this to both machines, other than some sort of stealth preference reset on the part of Microsoft. I haven't even installed anything new on the main machine in the past month, other than an updated Monkey's Audio Codec.

Anyone else notice similar creepyness?

 

[bruceb]

NO .. I have auto updates Turned Off ... and it stays that way
Possibly one update you installed recently, turned it back to ON
by default ... big brother, Bill, at play

 

[stash]

Haven't seen or heard about that either. I would recommend opening a (free) case with PSS so they can track any potential issues.

 

[BrettCB]

I just checked my computer after reading this and noticed that my settings had changed to install everyday at 3:30 AM. My old settings were set to download and notify but don't install. Seems like you might be right that a new update may be changing peoples default Automatic Update settings.

 

[Sforsyth]

I have 2 pc's and I turn off auto update I and about 3 weeks ago it turned it self back on without me knowing, I think it does it after a certain time frame.

 

[cubby1223]

Originally posted by: Sforsyth
I have 2 pc's and I turn off auto update I and about 3 weeks ago it turned it self back on without me knowing, I think it does it after a certain time frame.

No, I've never had automatic updates turned on, and never have had the settings change (except when installing sp2 when it gives you the option on restart). Of course I haven't gotten around to installing this new set of updates this week yet...

There are some other software, like Norton Anti-Virus 2006, that nags you to death if you have the settings set to anything but full auto-updating, and change the settings for you.

 

[yukichigai]

Originally posted by: cubby1223

Originally posted by: Sforsyth
I have 2 pc's and I turn off auto update I and about 3 weeks ago it turned it self back on without me knowing, I think it does it after a certain time frame.

No, I've never had automatic updates turned on, and never have had the settings change (except when installing sp2 when it gives you the option on restart). Of course I haven't gotten around to installing this new set of updates this week yet...

There are some other software, like Norton Anti-Virus 2006, that nags you to death if you have the settings set to anything but full auto-updating, and change the settings for you.

I run a lean system on both the laptop and home PC, but with very different software. The AV suite on both is different, so I find it far too much of a coincidence. This has to be some Microsoft "feature" or something nonsensical like that.

What's most disturbing is that I have no idea what update was installed. It could be that goddamn Windows Genuine Advantage piece of crap; I have no way of knowing. Automatic Updates refuses to show me anything.

 

[porcorosso]

Just going to the Microsoft / Windows Update site and checking the Previously Installed Updates link should give you a list of everything which has been installed there, and whether it was done via automatic updates or via the update site.

Also, if you check the checkbox for showing updates in Add/Remove Programs that should show you all of your MS updates.

 

[stash]

What's most disturbing is that I have no idea what update was installed. It could be that goddamn Windows Genuine Advantage piece of crap; I have no way of knowing. Automatic Updates refuses to show me anything.

The event viewer will log a detailed event for every update that is installed.

You can also look at the c:\windows\windowsupdate.log file for very verbose detail.

 

[porcorosso]

Oh yeah. Stash's suggestion is better than mine.

And, since Stash is present in this thread, I'm going to try just a bit of a sidetrack -- even though my observations do fit with the rather general title.

After this round of updates I noticed:

1. My nVidia driver helper service no longer passes muster with DEP. DEP shuts it down unless it is provided with an exception. I just set the damned thing to manual start for now. (I posted a new thread about this issue.)

2. XXCOPY, which is supposed to only check OS name and SP level, is suddenly objecting and saying that it hasn't been tested in this OS environment. I just uninstalled the danged utility. I'll use XCOPY and ROBOCOPY instead.

Although none of the behavior mentioned in this thread is (IMO) a show-stopper, it does make a few hairs stand up on the back of my neck. I would hate to see us going back to the days when the more cautious of us waited as long as we dared to apply security patches, watching the newsgroups for signs of violence. And even after a seemingly succesful debut of a new patch we would still cross our fingers while applying it.

However, so far, so good...

Ross

 

[stash]

Again, I will reiterate, if you are having issues with the updates, open a case with PSS. Until a case is opened and the issue is determined to be a problem with an update, everything else is just rumor and speculation.

 

[Raduque]

Hmm, that's weird. I haven't noticed this behavior on either of my computers. My laptop, a64 rig and HTPC are all still set to "Download and Notify". My laptop pulled a bunch of updates yesterday, but they haven't come through on my desktop yet.

 

[porcorosso]

Again, I will reiterate, if you are having issues with the updates, open a case with PSS. Until a case is opened and the issue is determined to be a problem with an update, everything else is just rumor and speculation.

Perhaps a little acerbic, but certainly correct from a technical standpoint -- though if you look for hits online on XXCOPY issues and on nVidia driver helper service running afoul of DEP since this recent spate of updates you'll see that the effect of these updates is not "just rumor and speculation".

So, you mention PSS. It might surprise you (or not) to know that I've been working with computers (as an adjunct to my profession as a physicist) for over forty years. I don't happen to know what PSS is. I'm no MS MVP, but I'm reasonably familiar with their operating systems. Would you care to enlighten me as to the methods by which I might avail myself of this service. I went to the Microsoft Update site. I did a search at microsoft.com for PSS. I didn't find anything (useful) about PSS. Got a telephone number or a linky?

Thanks. I'm not trying to be (particularly) smart-assed, but you should realize that what's obvious to an insider like you might not be quite so obvious to a twinky like me.



And, by the way, I appreciate the fact that public-spirited folks like you with links into the corporation try to help us outsiders with your participation here.

Regards,
Ross

 

[stash]

Ha! I've actually gotten this question before (what is PSS), so I should probably know better than to throw around TLAs (three-letter acronyms )

PSS stands for Product Support Services. It is Microsoft's support group, they handle every product that is currently in support. There are direct lines of escalation from the engineers who take your call (who are typically very good) to the product groups that actually wrote the code. If there is a problem with the product, they will find it.

If you look at the bottom of the main bulletin page for the monthly updates (http://www.microsoft.com/technet/security/bulletin/ms06-aug.mspx), you'll see a statement about calling PSS for support. For help with security updates, you'll be routed to the PSS Security team, and the number is 1866-PCSAFETY

There are many different levels of support depending on what type of customer you are (home user, business with a premier contract, business without a premier contract, etc). You can read about all the different support options available here: http://www.microsoft.com/services/microsoftservices/srv_support.mspx

hope this helps clear up the confusion a little...

 

[porcorosso]

Thanks for that information. I'm in the midst of several non-related calamities at the moment, but I've made a note of the information you've provided. I'll be taking your advice at the earliest opportunity.

Regards,
Ross

PS: If I get any kind of resolution I'll post it here.

 

[wpshooter]

I noticed that after I updated my work computer last week with the several available M/S updates (Win2000), that after that there was a certain website "Linux Questions" that I could no longer surf on without getting an error asking me to send report to M/S and then getting kicked out of my browser, IE.

I did not have this problem before I applied the M/S updates and I have not had it on other website that I have been to to this point.

I did notice that one of the updates applied to IE.

Thanks.

 

[IGBT]

Originally posted by: bruceb
NO .. I have auto updates Turned Off ... and it stays that way
Possibly one update you installed recently, turned it back to ON
by default ... big brother, Bill, at play

..all our boxes are belong to bill.

 

[PingSpike]

I think I've had this happen on a lot of machines. I couldn't ever say for sure, but windows updates and the firewall have turned themselves on after I deliberately turned them off so many times I've started to think thats whats happening. I couldn't have accidentally reactivated it as many times as I've noticed it.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Maybe registry corruption at work? Seems unlikely that it would happen to so many of you, all around the same timeframe. I wouldn't be surprised to find out that *something* re-enabled auto-update, and here's a bit of FUD: it probably IS because MS wants to force down "WGA" onto every MS OS install. In fact this isn't the first time that one MS update triggered settings to be changed. (A long time ago, there was one update that re-installed/enabled MSN messenger, IIRC.)

I not only disable via settings, but I also disable most of those background-download services in services.msc. Seems to WFM. (I vehemently dislike auto-update features... on any software, not just MS.)

 

[porcorosso]

A few days down the road from the problem I reported in an earlier message on this thread I got the "DEP is closing such-and-such" message about Windows Explorer! The desktop instance of Explorer closed and restarted, and nothing untoward has happened since. But this behavior made me decide to go ahead and call PSS, as stash suggested.

The support person asked me to remove the nVidia driver helper service and Windows Explorer from the DEP exceptions list. I was skeptical about this because I had already tried it twice with the driver helper service. But I removed both items from the exceptions list as requested. I have restarted several times and have used the system extensively since that time (yesterday) with no more misbehavior from DEP.

I guess I'll never know just what happened. As long as it doesn't keep cropping up I'll be satisfied.