Someone has to say it, so it might as well be me: Windows 8 will be a giant mess

[Tsaar]

Features I like:
-Various Speed Tweaks
-Ribbon Interface (for the most part)
-Native PDF Reader
-Native Disc Emulation
-Metro IF NOT FORCED AND DEFAULT

Features I Don't Like:
-Metro FORCED AND DEFAULT

 

[QueBert]

Heh, I suppose I shouldn't be shocked that iFanatics believe Apple controls any segment of the computer market. Expensive =/= does not equal high end. Cheapest Mac Pro model is 2500 dollars, is a mere quad core, and sports a Radeon 5770. You can get better than that for half the price.

But, back to the subject at hand. I thought it was pretty common knowledge that Windows 8 was going to be a fail train? We knew it was going to fall hard on tablets when MS said they expected pricing to start at 600 dollars. And we new it was going to fail on the desktop/laptop when Metro was going to be used. Even Ubuntu's Unity is better than that crap.

Better what? I make music, PC's absolutely suck for producing music. Specs don't concern me, I want a system that can perform the tasks I need effectively. And Windows cannot do that. Apple's aren't for everyone, but they do have their market and strong points. Go into any professional music studio and you'll see nothing but Macs, there's a reason for that.

Nice way to work your Apple hate into a thread about how much Windows 8 sucks, which it really really REALLY does. The more I use it, the more I'm confused at how this got the green light. GOD I miss DOS. A solid OS without any useless bullshit and no stupid UI.

 

[Zaap]

Apple's aren't for everyone, but they do have their market and strong points. Go into any professional music studio and you'll see nothing but Macs, there's a reason for that.

Be smug about it while you can- Apple's done a lot to thumb it's nose at pros lately, no matter how loyal they've been. I've witnessed scores of people I know that do professional video editing make the jump to Premiere since Apple turned Final Cut Pro into iMovieX.

Several that needed new hardware have turned to the PC as well. Sure, they could have just bought a 'new' MacPro... oh wait a minute. Apple let them down with that as well. What new MacPro? There's the same MacPro that's nearly two years old. Double whammy.

The irony is, the iFanatics then throw up the same 'arguments' against the pro users that I see the MS defenders use: "Oh, you just don't like change!" "Boo hoo, you just can't handle the future!"

No, people don't like the tools of their livelihood f'd with by 'hipsters' that have no understanding that pros use these things to make a living, not experiment with some script-kiddie's idea of 'the future', especially when the ideas are mostly crap. Features missing that are required to do actual work? Then see ya, wouldn't wanna be ya.

More and more citiing Apple as the tool of pros is gonna get shaky as they chase more pros away with the crap iAttitude. Ruining FCP was a shot across the bow that YouTwits are more Apple's target market, and pros can go get stuffed.

Of course, with MS now turning to 'My Little Computer' as their next OS, maybe there won't be anywhere for shunned pros to run to, so maybe Apple can dumb down all their pro apps as well and get away with it. Seems to be all the rage lately.

 

[QueBert]

I didn't say anything about video editing, I was talking about music production. You will NEVER see the balance change to Windows so long as it uses AISO for audio. And while Apple did dumb down Final Cut, they'll never do the same with Logic. And real video editing professionals don't use either FCP or Premiere.

 

[Zaap]

And real video editing professionals don't use either FCP or Premiere.

Haha! So what is it we use then?

As for logic, according to two musicians I know apple already ruined logic's audio engine. I personally don't know about logic (like you clearly know nothing about video editing) but I've heard thus from two different sources.

 

[13Gigatons]

Windows 8 is completely pointless on the desktop. The big question is will it sell on Tablets?

 

[blurredvision]

I'm guessing you were an ME and Vista defender too.

It's not like MS doesn't have a record of screwing up royally every other OS version.

Vista = yes. ME = god no. Vista was a little bumpy at the start and got a very bad rap, but it was a solid OS (hell, W7 is simply Vista 2.0). ME was a hot mess from the beginning. I remember working for HP and getting trained on ME before its release. Thank god I left before having to support it.

 

[Ausm]

It couldn't possibly be as bad as Windows ME was.

 

[alent1234]

Be smug about it while you can- Apple's done a lot to thumb it's nose at pros lately, no matter how loyal they've been. I've witnessed scores of people I know that do professional video editing make the jump to Premiere since Apple turned Final Cut Pro into iMovieX.

Several that needed new hardware have turned to the PC as well. Sure, they could have just bought a 'new' MacPro... oh wait a minute. Apple let them down with that as well. What new MacPro? There's the same MacPro that's nearly two years old. Double whammy.

The irony is, the iFanatics then throw up the same 'arguments' against the pro users that I see the MS defenders use: "Oh, you just don't like change!" "Boo hoo, you just can't handle the future!"

No, people don't like the tools of their livelihood f'd with by 'hipsters' that have no understanding that pros use these things to make a living, not experiment with some script-kiddie's idea of 'the future', especially when the ideas are mostly crap. Features missing that are required to do actual work? Then see ya, wouldn't wanna be ya.

More and more citiing Apple as the tool of pros is gonna get shaky as they chase more pros away with the crap iAttitude. Ruining FCP was a shot across the bow that YouTwits are more Apple's target market, and pros can go get stuffed.

Of course, with MS now turning to 'My Little Computer' as their next OS, maybe there won't be anywhere for shunned pros to run to, so maybe Apple can dumb down all their pro apps as well and get away with it. Seems to be all the rage lately.

since you only joined in 2008 i'll give you a history lesson

back in the 1990's the pro's worked on workstations that ran UNIX. these were very expensive machines made by SGI and other now dead companies

Windows wiped the floor with everyone with 2 crappy OS's and only got into the pro market because NT based workstations were A LOT cheaper. MS won due to the consumer and semi pro markets. Windows NT was junk and only beat novell because it was easier to use and set up. on NT4/2000 you can have a domain going in an hour and it was pretty easy to manage. i've talked to novell people and every other answer seems to be "it depends where they log on in the tree" or "we'll have to write a script for that"

apple can dump the pro market and still win. its a tiny but whiny part of the market they don't want

and the world is changing now as well. MS Office is a ridiculous $200 per user per year or $300 to $500 per device. people can do a lot of work on phones and tablets now and MS is going to be hard pressed to find how to make up the revenue since most people only need a few features from Office.

most people aren't going to care about windows 8 because it won't do anything for them. the computer is something you turn on once in a while now. most computer use is now done from smartphones, tablets or boxes attached to your TV

MS completely missed mobile and it's too late. and they are losing market share in desktop OS's to apple

i remember when people lined up to buy Windows 95 at midnight. and they also bought hundreds of $$$ of upgrades to run it

these days everyone is lining up for apple stuff. why would anyone spend $200 for an OS upgrade when new computers start at $250?

 

[corkyg]

When support for Windows 7 fades away, it may be time to move to the dark side and get a Mac.

 

[ultimatebob]

Honestly, I'd be a happy camper if they just put the Start button back on the Desktop screen. They can leave their pretty new Start Screen as is, as long as I can click the Desktop button to get past it.

 

[ultimatebob]

i remember when people lined up to buy Windows 95 at midnight. and they also bought hundreds of $$$ of upgrades to run it

That's mostly because Windows 95 was a memory pig compared to Windows 3.1. Windows 3.1 was happy with just 4 MB of memory, but Windows 95 didn't run well until you gave it at least 16 MB.

Memory cost a fortune back then as well... I remember ponying up $150 for that upgrade!

 

[JimmiG]

Initial reaction to the start screen: WTF is this?!

After using it for a while: Hey, I could get used to this! It isn't that bad.

After installing a bunch of programs and discovering the view is completely flat, with no sub-folders and no way to organize icons, resulting in uninstallers and other useless icons mixed with useful ones: FFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUU!

 

[QueBert]

Haha! So what is it we use then?

As for logic, according to two musicians I know apple already ruined logic's audio engine. I personally don't know about logic (like you clearly know nothing about video editing) but I've heard thus from two different sources.

Avid > * for video editing outside of maybe Lightworks. And while Apple did screw up the latest version of FCP. Most video people I know would still take the version from 3 years ago over the latest Adobe CS5.5 offering. Logic's still the top for audio, and just in general Mac's are better for Audio simply because they don't use AISO for sound processing. So something that's cross platform like Pro Tools or Cubase will be much better on OSX. For video Avid & Lightwork are both "pro level" where FCP/CS4 are prosumer level products at best.

 

[alent1234]

That's mostly because Windows 95 was a memory pig compared to Windows 3.1. Windows 3.1 was happy with just 4 MB of memory, but Windows 95 didn't run well until you gave it at least 16 MB.

Memory cost a fortune back then as well... I remember ponying up $150 for that upgrade!

the point is that people lined up to buy it and spent money on stuff to make it work

these days this excitement is with apple stuff. there is no one i know who will spend money to buy the upgrade

 

[jhansman]

Metro may fly on mobile devices, but on the the desktop this will suck large. I run Win7 and chuckle at those who still cling to XP, but now I can imagine myself as them in a way. Newer ain't always better...

 

[bankster55]

um, the Win key is the toggle from Metro to Classic - lol

then if you if you place your mouse arrow to right of date you can click the search icon in the sidebar and see everything you would normally see in Win 7 Start button, but better organized

 

[Dominato3r]

the point is that people lined up to buy it and spent money on stuff to make it work

these days this excitement is with apple stuff. there is no one i know who will spend money to buy the upgrade

Yet, like apple products they sell bazillions of copies at launch. IIRC Win7 holds some pretty nifty launch day numbers/records

 

[Zaap]

Avid > * for video editing outside of maybe Lightworks. And while Apple did screw up the latest version of FCP.

Avid only sticks around because its entrenched- a lot of editors that learned on it don't want to let it go. Avid is not superior to FCP7 or Adobe Premiere CS5 for video editing.

Lightworks isn't even a major player- I don't know where you pulled that out from.

Most video people I know would still take the version from 3 years ago over the latest Adobe CS5.5 offering.

That'd be nice if you could buy licences for the older versions. For a time you couldn't. (Though Apple did get smart and offered FCP7 licences again). The real production world operates on what's available and the practicality of using it.

Logic's still the top for audio, and just in general Mac's are better for Audio simply because they don't use AISO for sound processing. So something that's cross platform like Pro Tools or Cubase will be much better on OSX.

Point is, more and more Apple no longer caters to professionals. Enjoy gloating about Logic while you can- overnight it could become iMusicX, catering to twits that think making ringtones is the pinacle of music production.

Believe me, I wouldn't have thought Apple would ever cater more to YouTwits than professional video editors, but they're moving that direction. The same could happen for music. The simple fact is- ringtone making twits outnumber professional musicians, and catering to consumers means more money than catering to producers.

When you eventually complain that the tools of your trade have been ruined, it'll be kind of funny watching other iFans call you a whiner because you're not down with the new ringtone maker in place of your old music production tools.

For video Avid & Lightwork are both "pro level" where FCP/CS4 are prosumer level products at best.

Avid is used more as an online finishing solution than a strict editor in most major studios, FCP is the standard for video (not film) editing, though it's no slouch for film as well, and whereas you used to be right about Adobe, they're gaining ground fast since Apple dropped the ball with FCPX.

I know of at least three TV productions that were forced to go with Premiere rather than FCP because for a time Apple did the double-whammy of not offering new FCP7 licences, screwed up FCPX and Premiere was the only game in town. (Avid isn't even an option in such cases because no one is filling new editing seats on a production with costly entrenched Avid editors that mostly do finishing work.) Again, Lightworks isn't even a player in the same arena.

 

[Zaap]

since you only joined in 2008 i'll give you a history lesson

back in the 1990's the pro's worked on workstations that ran UNIX. these were very expensive machines made by SGI and other now dead companies

Back in the '90s Avid (running mostly on Macs) ruled the roost for video and film production. SGI was more of a 3D graphics production tool, not editing.

apple can dump the pro market and still win. its a tiny but whiny part of the market they don't want

Exactly the iAttitude that smug pro-audio people using Macs are going to eventually discover as well, which was my point.

 

[lothar]

most of the computers that cost more than $1000 are sold by apple

most != 100%

You're basing your "high-end" analysis on MSRP cost, and not component internals.

 

[gmaster456]

The big question is will is sell on Tablets?

They'll at least be getting one sale. From me . I can't wait to use it on a tablet. In the tablet market, it really is a step in the right direction and I quite like the changes. However, those same changes on the desktop have me feeling the exact opposite.

 

[gmaster456]

Metro may fly on mobile devices, but on the the desktop this will suck large. I run Win7 and chuckle at those who still cling to XP, but now I can imagine myself as them in a way. Newer ain't always better...

I feel the exact same way.

 

[StinkyPinky]

Use the Windows key. It's now vital for Windows 8.

The windows key is now the "start button".

 

[bankster55]

no its not
read my post 6 prior