some people are here are making it very hard to stick around...

[reallyscrued]

What you are saying makes absolutely no sense whatsoever, it is completely irrational. Nobody is born a Christian. Being a Christian requires meeting the criteria, that is how all labels work. That is the definition of labels. The concept here is so basic that it still puzzles me why people don't get this.

I've always wondered about that. Thanks for bringing it up. I think most posters can already predict where I'm going with this.

If a feral child or just someone by chance who grows and matures in complete isolation, say in the jungle, or on a deserted island, manages to live their life up until the age of 30 and dies, they do not go to heaven? Seems like a pretty heavy handed rule.

Ugh, God is such a hardass.

 

[Malak]

I've always wondered about that. Thanks for bringing it up. I think most posters can already predict where I'm going with this.

If a feral child or just someone by chance who grows and matures in complete isolation, say in the jungle, or on a deserted island, manages to live their life up until the age of 30 and dies, they do not go to heaven? Seems like a pretty heavy handed rule.

Ugh, God is such a hardass.

There are a few issues here but I will get to the meat of it. We are saved by grace alone, no magic tricks. Someone doesn't ever have to step in a church for salvation. God is not contained in a building and you don't need a missionary to tell you love is good. Anyone can receive God's grace, even a dying thief.

 

[jonks]

I've always wondered about that. Thanks for bringing it up. I think most posters can already predict where I'm going with this.

If a feral child or just someone by chance who grows and matures in complete isolation, say in the jungle, or on a deserted island, manages to live their life up until the age of 30 and dies, they do not go to heaven? Seems like a pretty heavy handed rule.

Ugh, God is such a hardass.

The pope singlehandedly banished purgatory for babies a few years ago. Church doctrine, church smoctrin.

 

[jhbball]

There are a few issues here but I will get to the meat of it. We are saved by grace alone, no magic tricks. Someone doesn't ever have to step in a church for salvation. God is not contained in a building and you don't need a missionary to tell you love is good. Anyone can receive God's grace, even a dying thief.

At what age were you indoctrinated?

 

[Cerpin Taxt]

Not a Christian myself, but I think that it's worth pointing out that this post reeks of the association fallacy.

If you're going to troll a religious thread, do it right. Use logic instead of logical fallacies.

I would be committing a fallacy if I was trying to demonstrate that Malak is an asshole based on the fact that other Christians are assholes, but I'm not. Malak is an asshole for entirely independent reasons.

Rather, I'm rebutting Malak's question begging when he arbitrarily asserts that certain Christians are not "True" Christians when they do bad things. He does that because he doesn't want to be associated with them, but like I said, I'm not trying to indict Malak of those crimes perpetrated by other Christians.

 

[busydude]

The pope singlehandedly banished purgatory for babies a few years ago.

Does he still say that condoms are bad?

 

[Cerpin Taxt]

Your reasoning is mind boggling so I am just going to avoid this discussion.

Which is another way of saying you can't refute my argument.

You give the impression of trolling because your stance is so obviously illogical.

Saying my stance is illogical is easy. Showing it to be illogical is not. Rather, it is impossible, since my position is not illogical.

 

[shiner]

Does he still say that condoms are bad?

There's an altar boy joke in here somewhere.....

 

[Cerpin Taxt]

We are saved by grace alone, no magic tricks.

Funny, Jesus said that all one needs to do to enter the Kingdom of Heaven is feed the hungry, clothe the naked, take in a stranger, or visit the sick or imprisoned.

No mention of grace at all. :hmm:

 

[Malak]

At what age were you indoctrinated?

I continue to learn and grow as a person daily. I choose and sometimes change what I believe as I continue to understand the concept of love and apply it to my life.

 

[reallyscrued]

I continue to learn and grow as a person daily. I choose and sometimes change what I believe as I continue to understand the concept of love and apply it to my life.

Lies.

 

[reallyscrued]

LOL

you do realize that you just made up a whole bunch of shit and then ranted about it, right?

...you're finally starting to see the Atheist point of view. Good job!

 

[IceBergSLiM]

OP still around?

 

[jonks]

Does he still say that condoms are bad?

Condoms are still bad. Coundoms however are ok.

 

[Nik]

I continue to learn and grow as a person daily. I choose and sometimes change what I believe as I continue to understand the concept of love and apply it to my life.

See? He conveniently ignores the direct questions he's asked once he figures out that the line of questioning will lead, yet again, to disproving his awful religion.

This is Malak, folks, the real troll.

 

[rudeguy]

See? He conveniently ignores the direct questions he's asked once he figures out that the line of questioning will lead, yet again, to disproving his awful religion.

This is Malak, folks, the real troll.

what if he holds up a sign and takes a picture for you?

 

[Nik]

what if he holds up a sign and takes a picture for you?

Your pathetic attempt at humor fails miserably.

 

[OCGuy]

Has anyone done the "Some people here are making my stick round and hard" parody yet?

 

[zinfamous]

jesus christ, you people are nutters.

Hey, we can all probably agree that Scientologists are the craziest of all--completely unacceptable.

Perhaps someone has linked it here in the last week, but if no one has, I highly encourage you all to read the current New Yorker's massive expose on Scientology--in which human trafficking, slave labor, physical abuse, forced abortion and a slew of other human crimes are exposed as functioning tenets of the organization.

The article:
http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2011/02/14/110214fa_fact_wright
(I think this is the longest NY article since Hiroshima, in which they dedicated the entire issue to the world's introduction to the nuclear age--so you know it's serious)


report on the article (for the attention deficit):
http://www.thedailymaverick.co.za/a...ientology-slammed-in-massive-new-yorker-expos

 

[jhbball]

I continue to learn and grow as a person daily. I choose and sometimes change what I believe as I continue to understand the concept of love and apply it to my life.

I'm really curious. At what age did your parents start taking you to church?

 

[zerocool84]

There are a few issues here but I will get to the meat of it. We are saved by grace alone, no magic tricks. Someone doesn't ever have to step in a church for salvation. God is not contained in a building and you don't need a missionary to tell you love is good. Anyone can receive God's grace, even a dying thief.

But like others have said, you can live the perfect life, but not be religious and your god will not save them from eternal damnation yet the person who does wrong their whole life, yet at the very end of their life prays for your god's forgiveness is saved. Nothing about that seems backwards to you? You should be saved no matter whether you follow god or not. That is obviously NOT a loving god.

Also your god obviously loves killing people and loves torturing people as your god does not allow free will since if he does good for people he has to do bad. He cannot allow free will if he's making good things happen for people so he either allows free will and everything good that happens is human free will as much as the bad or he makes bad things happen as much as the good. You can't pick and choose, it has to be one or the other since all you Christians say bad things happen because of human free will yet your god is the reason why good things happen to people. It obviously can't be both.

 

[Malak]

But like others have said, you can live the perfect life, but not be religious and your god will not save them from eternal damnation yet the person who does wrong their whole life, yet at the very end of their life prays for your god's forgiveness is saved. Nothing about that seems backwards to you? You should be saved no matter whether you follow god or not. That is obviously NOT a loving god.

Who says God won't save them? You are still stuck on what the religions claim are the requirements of the righteous but I will say again what Jesus put simply. Just love one another.

Also your god obviously loves killing people and loves torturing people as your god does not allow free will since if he does good for people he has to do bad. He cannot allow free will if he's making good things happen for people so he either allows free will and everything good that happens is human free will as much as the bad or he makes bad things happen as much as the good. You can't pick and choose, it has to be one or the other since all you Christians say bad things happen because of human free will yet your god is the reason why good things happen to people. It obviously can't be both.

Doing good does not inhibit free will and neither does it require doing bad either. Both good and bad on earth are the result of human free will. Miracles don't limit choice.

 

[Malak]

I'm really curious. At what age did your parents start taking you to church?

My mom took me since I was a baby. Growing up I never took it seriously and stopped going regulary later. I started taking it more seriously in 2000. I spoke with theologian professors, cultists, various sects. I study authors over the last 400 years on their thoughts on doctrine, successes and failures of the church, and thoughts on how we can change. My goal since 2000 is to find truth and not accept beliefs just because. No matter what anyone here thinks, I do not get spoonfed anything. I have changed a lot of my beliefs over the years on a lot of subjects. Sometimes I am more consertive or sometimes I am more liberal than other Christians. I evolve in my thoughts by taking in lots of information and running it through my love filter.

 

[jonks]

jesus christ, you people are nutters.

Hey, we can all probably agree that Scientologists are the craziest of all--completely unacceptable.

I disagree. The tenets of Scientology are probably (maybe) the craziest, but those who choose to become Scientologists are probably making a valid economical decision. Hollywood is filled with em so joining the brotherhood is a good way to get ahead, or at least provide the possibility of special notice. They don't even preach xenu until you're a level 4 zaxxon or something so most of it has nothing to do with that. Compared to the ritualiazed lifestyle of most other religions Scientology doesn't seem that intrusive. Unless you're gay. Or want to quit the church. Or have friends or family that don't want you in the church. Or you want to criticize a position of the church. Or want to read about criticisms of the church.

Ok, maybe you were right.

 

[jonks]

Who says God won't save them?

I think his name was Jesus?

http://bible.cc/john/14-6.htm

To the extent you disagree with Jesus and every other denomination that thinks salvation comes only through faith (except Unitarians...any others?) you should probably form your own religion b/c the one you got aint the one you think it is.