some Oakland residents will receive 'Basic Income'- lump sum money w/o working for it

[1prophet]

but w/this Basic Income experiment there's no penalty for getting a full time job.
you're not penalized for trying to be a productive member of society

And like wise if there is no penalty for not getting a job and all your needs are met, except for the self motivated why bother working?

 

[JEDI]

And like wise if there is no penalty for not getting a job and all your needs are met, except for the self motivated why bother working?

yup, like I said w/o showing them how to be productive members of society, it'll be sit around all day watching Netflix and playing video games

 

[Jhhnn]

And like wise if there is no penalty for not getting a job and all your needs are met, except for the self motivated why bother working?

yup, like I said w/o showing them how to be productive members of society, it'll be sit around all day watching Netflix and playing video games

The underlying assumption beneath all that bullshit is that poor people are poor because they're lazy, right? Morally inferior! Weak minded! Why, it's been true for serfs & slaves throughout history!

 

[zinfamous]

apparently I'm a Social Justice Warrior now.

wow.

 

[Zorkorist]

We don't have any money to give them.

We're 20 Trillion Dollars in debt.

-John

 

[Chiropteran]

And like wise if there is no penalty for not getting a job and all your needs are met, except for the self motivated why bother working?

What is your point?

Would you rather they be so desperate for cash that they are stealing or selling drugs or prostituting themselves to survive?

Is it really such a horrible thing for a few people to live an extremely modest life without working?

 

[Zorkorist]

Incarcerate them.

-John

 

[Chiropteran]

We don't have any money to give them.

We're 20 Trillion Dollars in debt.

-John

It's not so black and white.

Criminals steal, sell drugs, lower property values, kill hard working "legit" citizens, and cost us a tremendous amount of tax dollars via prisons and the justice system.

What if I told you, $1000 a month to prevent a few people from resorting to crime would actually save us money, because we wouldn't need to pay for as many judges, prosecutors, jailers, prison wardens, police officers, etc?

 

[Zorkorist]

Welcome to Hotel California.

-John

 

[Chiropteran]

Incarcerate them.

-John

I thought we were in debt and couldn't spend more money on these people.

Where is the money coming from to build, maintain, and man these prisons?

 

[Zorkorist]

It's not so black and white.

Criminals steal, sell drugs, lower property values, kill hard working "legit" citizens, and cost us a tremendous amount of tax dollars via prisons and the justice system.

What if I told you, $1000 a month to prevent a few people from resorting to crime would actually save us money, because we wouldn't need to pay for as many judges, prosecutors, jailers, prison wardens, police officers, etc?

Normal people do that too.

It's called, being a criminal.

This is what we incarcerate people for.

-Joh

 

[soulcougher73]

We don't have any money to give them.

We're 20 Trillion Dollars in debt.

-John

Why not? We gave 20 trillion away and we're still here?

 

[Zorkorist]

We can pay them off, and they still continue to be criminals.

-John

 

[zinfamous]

We don't have any money to give them.

We're 20 Trillion Dollars in debt.

-John

let's give them your money. you're only spending it on booze anyway.

and internet that you clearly don't need.

and alex jones tinctures.

 

[Zorkorist]

Why not? We gave 20 trillion away and we're still here?

For now, and our future isn't looking so great.

We can't pay back the money we borrowed.

-John

 

[MajinCry]

...So poor people are criminals?

Fuckin' what?

 

[Zorkorist]

let's give them your money. you're only spending it on booze anyway.

and internet that you clearly don't need.

and alex jones tinctures.

Ignore the message, attack the messenger.

Fuck off zin

-John

 

[Chiropteran]

We can pay them off, and they still continue to be criminals.

And that is just your wild hypothesis. The whole reason this is news is because it's never been tried before in the US. Nobody really knows exactly what is going to happen.

But one thing is known: building more prisons and hiring more police costs a lot of money and has never fixed the root problems.

 

[Chiropteran]

...So poor people are criminals?

Fuckin' what?

It's a proven fact that poor are more likely to turn to crime, not sure where you have been if I never heard that.

For the period 2008–12—
Persons in poor households at or below the Federal Poverty Level (FPL) (39.8 per 1,000) had more than double the rate of violent victimization as persons in high-income households (16.9 per 1,000).
Persons in poor households had a higher rate of violence involving a firearm (3.5 per 1,000) compared to persons above the FPL (0.8–2.5 per 1,000).
The overall pattern of poor persons having the highest rates of violent victimization was consistent for both whites and blacks. However, the rate of violent victimization for Hispanics did not vary across poverty levels.
Poor Hispanics (25.3 per 1,000) had lower rates of violence compared to poor whites (46.4 per 1,000) and poor blacks (43.4 per 1,000).
Poor persons living in urban areas (43.9 per 1,000) had violent victimization rates similar to poor persons living in rural areas (38.8 per 1,000).
Poor urban blacks (51.3 per 1,000) had rates of violence similar to poor urban whites (56.4 per 1,000).

 

[Zorkorist]

Communism and socialism have both happened.

It wasn't pretty.

-John

 

[Chiropteran]

Communism and socialism have both happened.

It wasn't pretty.

-John

If welfare is communism, we are already a communist country by your standards.

If welfare isn't communism, then this absolutely isn't, because this is giving out far less money and this isn't incentivising people to avoid real jobs in the future.

 

[Zorkorist]

...So poor people are criminals?

Fuckin' what?

The Government thinks it has more money than brains, and wants to pay off "poor people."

They've been paying off poor people since welfare began, and it hasn't done a bit of good, and rather has lead us into this place where we have a huge, bloated, federal government, and a massive debt that we can probably never repay.

-John

 

[Zorkorist]

If welfare is communism, we are already a communist country by your standards.

If welfare isn't communism, then this absolutely isn't, because this is giving out far less money and this isn't incentivising people to avoid real jobs in the future.

Welfare isn't communism... some level of welfare is required in a country with safety nets.

However, planning to give people money, "a basic income" is not welfare but communism, or socialism.

Regardless, the American Government has no money to give them. They are 20 Trillion Dollars in debt.

-John

 

[Chiropteran]

The Government thinks it has more money than brains, and wants to pay off "poor people."

They've been paying off poor people since welfare began, and it hasn't done a bit of good, and rather has lead us into this place where we have a huge, bloated, federal government, and a massive debt that we can probably never repay.

-John

Where do you think the prisons come from? Is there a prison fairy that is going around building us free prisons?

Because maybe I am wrong, but I thought our tax dollars paid for the prisons, not a magical prison fairy.

 

[Zorkorist]

We could exterminate them?

Prisons are welfare.

-John