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Some Civil Engineering questions.

Darvil

Member
It seems a bit of a stretch posting these questions here. I'm hoping that there are some civil engineers on this forum. Its worth a try.

Anyway this isn't a homework question. More like seeking some advice.

Basically my group has to build a theoretical bridge over a creek. What we've come up with is a bridge that is 110 feet long, 8 feet wide and with 2 beams supporting it. The 2 ends will be fixed ends on the edges of the creek. There will be 61 feet space between the 2 beams. Just your basic run of the mill bridge.

My first question is. Is there a better way to calculate for deflection? The teacher told us we can cut the bridge into 3 pieces; 2 calculations since 2 of them are the same length. Basically he told us we can just use fixed cantilever formulas to solve each pieces. I probably don't even need to ask this but I was just wondering.

My second question is whether there is a better option for doing our bridge. So far we're going to use 5 I-beams -a foot tall- laid across evenly along the 8 feet width. Going to put an inch of grating on top and bolt the railing on the sides of each of the outer I-beams. Initially we were going to make the width of our bridge 6 feet but was adviced to change it to 8 feet. Because of this some of the members are thinking of switching to 4 columns instead of the 2 beams. Basically in place of each beam there will be 2 columns instead. The size of each of the columns we don't know yet since we haven't calculated the load yet. You guys think there is a better way of doing it? There probably isn't that many options to create a bridge like this but I was just wondering. I forget to mention that we're going to be using steel mainly with concrete for the columns. Of course it'll also be nice to save some money too since we also have to give an estimation. The less material the better although price isn't that big of a concern.

My third question is whether there is a nice software to calculate beams, deflections etc. We found the free version of STEELbeam by Engineering Software Solutions to be very nice. I am wondering if there are better software that does the same thing.

Thank you for taking the time to read.
 
Man the first question in this part of the forum I could contribute too and my books arn't anywhere to be found. I just took the class that would apply directly to this too.

Models - Well anyways to answer you question yes there are probably better ways to model it, although usally better in models means more complicated. We did some of these problems in class and the simple* models we used would take 30mins for the prof to do one problem.

Design of Bridge - Your design of just using steel beams is very easy to model and will probably be good enough, although go with I-Beams although the calculations get harder they are cheaper and stronger for the same size solid beam. This should be apperent but the caluclations change a lot when you move between them. As for the concrete colomns go for it concrete rocks at compressive normal forces, just stay away anything shear or tension(which you should be the way you described it).

Software - I had no idea so I just found some links
http://www.engineeringspreadsheets.co.uk/
http://www.bridgesite.com/softwarelinks.htm

Good luck and if I find my books I will try to look up the calcs for the model we used. If you are feeling up to a challange I belive our model was the "Deflection of Symmetric Beams solved using boundary values".
 
Originally posted by: Darvil
It seems a bit of a stretch posting these questions here. I'm hoping that there are some civil engineers on this forum. Its worth a try.

Anyway this isn't a homework question. More like seeking some advice.

Basically my group has to build a theoretical bridge over a creek. What we've come up with is a bridge that is 110 feet long, 8 feet wide and with 2 beams supporting it. The 2 ends will be fixed ends on the edges of the creek. There will be 61 feet space between the 2 beams. Just your basic run of the mill bridge.

My first question is. Is there a better way to calculate for deflection? The teacher told us we can cut the bridge into 3 pieces; 2 calculations since 2 of them are the same length. Basically he told us we can just use fixed cantilever formulas to solve each pieces. I probably don't even need to ask this but I was just wondering.

My second question is whether there is a better option for doing our bridge. So far we're going to use 5 I-beams -a foot tall- laid across evenly along the 8 feet width. Going to put an inch of grating on top and bolt the railing on the sides of each of the outer I-beams. Initially we were going to make the width of our bridge 6 feet but was adviced to change it to 8 feet. Because of this some of the members are thinking of switching to 4 columns instead of the 2 beams. Basically in place of each beam there will be 2 columns instead. The size of each of the columns we don't know yet since we haven't calculated the load yet. You guys think there is a better way of doing it? There probably isn't that many options to create a bridge like this but I was just wondering. I forget to mention that we're going to be using steel mainly with concrete for the columns. Of course it'll also be nice to save some money too since we also have to give an estimation. The less material the better although price isn't that big of a concern.

My third question is whether there is a nice software to calculate beams, deflections etc. We found the free version of STEELbeam by Engineering Software Solutions to be very nice. I am wondering if there are better software that does the same thing.

Thank you for taking the time to read.

Simply supported beam's deflection at midspan is 5wL^4/384EI if I remember correctly. Any strength of materials books would have beam tables, so you can just plug and chuck numbers. Do you know the loading conditions?

Now you lost me there... I thought you were using 2 beams? How do you replace 2 beams with 4 columns? A little illustration goes a long way. Maybe you can use reinforced concrete beams too, but those are a little harder to design.

RISA3d (hell, even 2d) should size the member automatically for you. 110 ft span is pretty long. If servicability is of any concern you should look into a truss structure (better strength/weight ratio also). You'll definitely get vibration on this thing. Are you a civil/structural engineering major and what's your school standing (sophomore, junior etc)?

Hope this helps
 
I've taken tons of structures classes but I hope that I am not the only one so confused in trying to conceptualize what this acutally looks like??

In a bridge, you're not gonna just be using simply supported W-shapes, this thing is definately gonna be some sort of truss structure. Its not that W-shapes wouldnt support the load but for the simple fact that you have to deal with deflection.

A diagram of some sort may be nice to help us try to help you.....
 
Originally posted by: Leafblighter
In a bridge, you're not gonna just be using simply supported W-shapes, this thing is definately gonna be some sort of truss structure. Its not that W-shapes wouldnt support the load but for the simple fact that you have to deal with deflection.

Yep, in which case, the best way to calculate realistic deflections is with a finite element analaysis application like as ANSYS or even VisualAnalysis, which any civil engineering department should have. It will be quite difficult to calculate the deflections of a complex structure like a bridge otherwise, unless you are just going to assume that it is a simply supported I-beam or something.
 
Originally posted by: daniel1113
Originally posted by: Leafblighter
In a bridge, you're not gonna just be using simply supported W-shapes, this thing is definately gonna be some sort of truss structure. Its not that W-shapes wouldnt support the load but for the simple fact that you have to deal with deflection.

Yep, in which case, the best way to calculate realistic deflections is with a finite element analaysis application like as ANSYS or even VisualAnalysis, which any civil engineering department should have. It will be quite difficult to calculate the deflections of a complex structure like a bridge otherwise, unless you are just going to assume that it is a simply supported I-beam or something.

Shouldn't be terribly hard to do a deflection calc of a determinate truss with the virtual work method... But yeah, VA is almost free for students (15 bucks for 1 year license).
 
Your question surprises me. Don't you have a student ASCE chapter ?

For many years now, they have been sponsering the West Point Bridge Design Contest.
You get to download free bridge design program for all sorts of truss bridges. Everybody
competes to design the lightest bridge for the given span.

Here's the link to get you started....
http://www.asce.org/community/educational/contest.cfm
 
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