So why didn't the iPhone 4 get Siri?

[Dominato3r]

Just wondering because it doesn't really make all that much sense to me.

I've got a Nexus S, a phone that was released a couple of months after the iPhone 4 and it has the new Google Now Voice Searching, which one could argue is better than Siri. I also learned there's no navigation coming to the iPhone 4, or some crippled version which lacks a few features. Where as I think I've had the Google Nav since 2.3.

Why? Is there some actual hardware reason or is it some planned obsolescence? I think there was a rumour that Siri was blocked because of hardware issues, but after seeing the new Google Voice Search, I'm not buying it. IIRC most of the iPhone 4 guts are better than the Nexus S too.

 

[WelshBloke]

People have speculated that its because the 4s has some noise cancelling mic and a better chip.

I'm not sure that the processing power bit stands as (IIRC) most of the processing is done on Apples servers.
I dont really buy the mic bit either as people hacked Siri to run on the Iphone 4 in the beginning before Apple locked it out of their servers. Linkage

In short its probably just to differentiate the iPhone 4s and add a bit more value to an upgrade.

 

[T_Yamamoto]

It was so there was something with upgrading to for those who aren't that technologically inclined

 

[bearxor]

Basically, the iPhone 4S includes a 2nd generation Audience audio processor in the A5 package. The iPhone 4 has the first generation.

In the iPhone 4, the chips job is to take the input of the second microphone (on top) and compare it to the noise in the main microphone and eliminate some of the background noise. The chip can only do this job for near-field voice.

On the iPhone 4S, the chip is designed for far-field voice (ie: at arms length). This allows the user to speak in to the phone while they're looking at it and cut out the background noise through the second mic. Note that Apple's advertised Siri use cases are also always at arms length, not held up to your ear.

http://www.appleinsider.com/article...e_earsmart_noise_reduction_tech_for_siri.html

Also, the proximity sensor on the iPhone 4S is different. It's also now active all the time so that Siri's 'Raise to speak' option works.

http://www.slashgear.com/iphone-4s-proximity-sensor-is-designed-for-siri-09194401/

Additionally, while I can't find the article for the life of me now, in an interview with Dag Kittlaus, the creator of Siri, he noted that there were a lot of shortcuts he had to take to get the app to run on the iPhone, pre iPhone 4S. All the interviews I can find in Google now seem to relate to news of him leaving Apple and his new startup (fuck, if I got $200m, I'd be out too).

So the dual-core processor in the 4S probably has something to do with it as well.

In my experience with Siri on the iPhone 4, it works, but not as WELL as it does on my wife's iPhone 4S. But it does work. Sometimes I could set the two side-by-side and say what I wanted and the 4S would pick it up but the 4 would require a repeat a time or two. But I also speak very fast and there's not a whole lot of voice recognition software that can keep up with me consistently anyways.

Could Siri be tweaked by Apple to compensate for the hardware difference? Probably.

And the biggest issue, IMO, is that the exclusion of Siri means the iPhone 4 (and 3GS) aren't getting Navigation, since Apple's Navigation implementation is very Siri-reliant.

 

[NikolaeVarius]

It's because they want you to upgrade.

My Droid X used Google Now Just fine, and that phone is over two years old.

 

[WelshBloke]

...
And the biggest issue, IMO, is that the exclusion of Siri means the iPhone 4 (and 3GS) aren't getting Navigation, since Apple's Navigation implementation is very Siri-reliant.

I don't get this either. Unless you can only use Siri in iNav I'm not seeing the rationale for excluding the iPhone4.

Presumably you will be able to use keyboard input on the iPhone 4s so why not allow the same on the iPhone 4?

 

[Oyeve]

Apple wanted its users to get the 4s. There is really no rationale to why the 4 didnt get siri. Its more than capable as the JB community has proven.

 

[Red Storm]

Aside from the hardware reasons that bearxor mentioned, if you recall the biggest selling point of the 4S (definitely the most marketed) was Siri. If the 4 got Siri as well... why upgrade?

 

[Phokus]

So they could ripoff iphone 4 users into giving them a shoddy reason to upgrade to the 4S.

 

[IHAVEAQUESTION]

One of the reasons why I am hesitant toward iPhone 5.

Used to be a fan of iPhone...

 

[bearxor]

I don't get this either. Unless you can only use Siri in iNav I'm not seeing the rationale for excluding the iPhone4.

Presumably you will be able to use keyboard input on the iPhone 4s so why not allow the same on the iPhone 4?

Not an expert, but my understanding is that the Nav uses the Siri subsystem for things like the turn by turn direction or being able to ask it to change routes and a few other things. So basically, no Siri means they'd either have to leave voice control and prompts (things like "Turn left in a half mile" or whatever) or create a separately maintained voice system just for navigation use on the iPhone 3GS/4. Or license it from somewhere or something. Sure doesn't seem like it would be terribly difficult to license it from TomTom since they're providing the data anyways.

 

[bearxor]

Aside from the hardware reasons that bearxor mentioned, if you recall the biggest selling point of the 4S (definitely the most marketed) was Siri. If the 4 got Siri as well... why upgrade?

I'd say Siri being exclusive to the 4S is like 30% hardware, 50% marketing and 20% laziness on Apple's part.

 

[Phokus]

I just don't see any hardware reason why SIRI could only be on the 4S and not the 4. Actually i don't see why it couldn't have been on the 3G either.

I'm using a shitty Motorola Triumph phone with a hacked on gingerbread ROM that's in beta stage and google voice search works fine on it.

It's just Apple being incredibly greedy because they know the vast majority of Apple fans won't revolt and will take it like good obedient/loyal apple consumers that they are.

 

[Eug]

Mostly marketing.

P.S. Does anyone here actually use Siri? I have Google's Voice Search on my Nexus 7 and by most accounts it's much better than Siri, but I find it pretty much a waste of time at home. I don't have the 4S, but everyone I know with the 4S doesn't use Siri.

The only time I can see myself using Siri or Voice Search is in the car.

 

[ControlD]

Mostly marketing.

P.S. Does anyone here actually use Siri? I have Google's Voice Search on my Nexus 7 and by most accounts it's much better than Siri, but I find it pretty much a waste of time at home. I don't have the 4S, but everyone I know with the 4S doesn't use Siri.

The only time I can see myself using Siri or Voice Search is in the car.

I used Siri a little bit the first week I had my 4S but I have it turned off now. The one place I wanted to use Siri (and in fact a good part of the reason I got the 4S in the first place) is in the car. I though being able to respond to text messages while in the car would be neat. What I found was any appreciable road/background noise, which my car has plenty of, renders Siri completely useless. I think my success rate with Siri getting any given word correct in such cases is less than 50%. If Apple spec'd new hardware on the 4S to accomodate Siri I think they need to go back to the drawing board.

 

[Phokus]

I used Siri a little bit the first week I had my 4S but I have it turned off now. The one place I wanted to use Siri (and in fact a good part of the reason I got the 4S in the first place) is in the car. I though being able to respond to text messages while in the car would be neat. What I found was any appreciable road/background noise, which my car has plenty of, renders Siri completely useless. I think my success rate with Siri getting any given word correct in such cases is less than 50%. If Apple spec'd new hardware on the 4S to accomodate Siri I think they need to go back to the drawing board.

That's HILARIOUS. When i use google voice with google navigation in my car, it works perfectly, even with lots of ambient noise with my windows rolled down. And i have a really shitty phone too (motorola triumph).

 

[ControlD]

That's HILARIOUS. When i use google voice with google navigation in my car, it works perfectly, even with lots of ambient noise with my windows rolled down. And i have a really shitty phone too (motorola triumph).

To be fair, I probably haven't given Siri much of a chance to see if I can improve the experice. For whatever reason I just don't get good enough recognition to trust using it for messaging without first checking how accurate it is which sort of defeats the purpose. Maybe I just have a strange voice, not sure.

 

[finbarqs]

I think there was a hack to get siri on the regular 4. But anyways, I turned Siri off. She's a joke and annoying. Especially when I'm trying to listen to messages, she'll just pop out of no where and wonder what I want. Then she'll do something completely opposite of what I want.

Siri needs to die. Google voice is where it's at. Maybe iOS has a better implementation of Siri, but Google Voice is just the better "Siri"

 

[bearxor]

Google Now doesn't work reliably for me either on a GNex, but as I said, I tend to start talking fast and it messes most things up. If I deliberatley slow my speech down then just about everything works fine.

 

[TuxDave]

I think there was a hack to get siri on the regular 4. But anyways, I turned Siri off. She's a joke and annoying. Especially when I'm trying to listen to messages, she'll just pop out of no where and wonder what I want. Then she'll do something completely opposite of what I want.

Siri needs to die. Google voice is where it's at. Maybe iOS has a better implementation of Siri, but Google Voice is just the better "Siri"

How the hell does that happen (unless your chin is smooshing the home button while you listen to messages).

 

[TuxDave]

I used Siri a little bit the first week I had my 4S but I have it turned off now. The one place I wanted to use Siri (and in fact a good part of the reason I got the 4S in the first place) is in the car. I though being able to respond to text messages while in the car would be neat. What I found was any appreciable road/background noise, which my car has plenty of, renders Siri completely useless. I think my success rate with Siri getting any given word correct in such cases is less than 50%. If Apple spec'd new hardware on the 4S to accomodate Siri I think they need to go back to the drawing board.

Just a quick question, when you're using Siri in the car, are you speaking towards the bottom or the top of the phone? I've used Siri in my car to initiate phone calls (which go through my car's bluetooth in case anyone is wondering) and used it to read my text message for me when I get one. It works pretty well and my highways definitely SUCK.

 

[pm]

Back when the 4S first came out, I hacked Siri onto a iPhone 4 and it worked fine. There was an issue with the "raise and talk" thing, but just holding the button worked fine and the accuracy was fine.

My thinking is that there were a few minor technical reasons to put Siri on just the 4S, but the main reason was to drive sales of the 4S.

I found Siri useful for geographical reminders - like as I'm driving off, I see the back gate is open and I set myself a reminder to close it when I Get back home. So setting reminders and appointments, that was handy.

But my main complaint with Siri is that with the iPhone 4, you could use the the voice commands without an internet connection "play playlist my top-rated", "play songs by Adele", "call home", etc. But once they added Siri, voice commands always required an internet connection. And a lot of places, I'd ride my bike and the connection would be non-existant or flaky.

My other issue with Siri is that I'd love to use it when I'm in the car and I'm driving down the road and I could say "Siri, what's the capital of Kazakstan" and to have the phone come back with "the capital of Kazakstan is Astana", or "what's 42 pounds in kilograms?" and just have it say "19.05 kilograms". Instead, the phone would go to a webpage with the answer. I want the computer on the Starship Enterprise, not a speech-to-text-to-Google web page app. It seemed to me that they were so close and they just dropped the ball right at the end - just read the first result back using text-to-speech... done. If it's not right, then oh well, but that would be so much better than the current set up where you have to look at the phone for the answer.

I didn't think that Google's voice commands were all that much better than Siri. I saw them mostly on par, with Siri having a bit more attitude (which was amusing) and better at setting appointments/reminders and Google Voice commands have a bit better accuracy. I didn't see that either was immensely better than the other.

 

[finbarqs]

How the hell does that happen (unless your chin is smooshing the home button while you listen to messages).

I listen to my messages the same exact way as I am talking on the phone, unless it's on speaker. But I've a feeling it's the proximity sensor that initiated Siri, so you don't have a choice, but to turn her off. And her getting my commands wrong is probably because my car isn't quiet enough.

But I think google voice is where it's at. It needs a trendy name too like, Stan or something. Then it would kind of work if I said "Stan just raped Siri".

 

[ControlD]

Just a quick question, when you're using Siri in the car, are you speaking towards the bottom or the top of the phone? I've used Siri in my car to initiate phone calls (which go through my car's bluetooth in case anyone is wondering) and used it to read my text message for me when I get one. It works pretty well and my highways definitely SUCK.

That is a good question. At the time I was testing it out I was probably speaking more into the bottom on the phone than the top. Now that I have a car mount for my phone I suppose I would be speaking more towards the top of the phone (it would be sitting in lansdcape orientation with the top of the phone pointed towards the driver's side).

You mention that you use Siri to read your text messages to you, do you also have Siri compose text messages in response? That is where most of my issues are. The resulting text I get is usually so far off as to not be usable. For placing calls I think Siri works quite well.

 

[Sloper]

Siri is barely reliable on the 4S.

Having it on the 4 with its substandard microphone and proximity sensor would trash Siri's reputation as being reliable even more.

Apple cares about its image and brand above all else. So even though old gen hardware is capable of running new technology, unless it works as great Apple chooses to forgo it.

Yeah, and also marketing/product differentiation is a major part of it.