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So what was the rule of thumb for missing packages?

Ricemarine

Ricemarine

Lifer
I'm a bit unsure for the right way to handle this incident as the wrong move could result in me losing my money.

Anyhow:
- Ordered a $120 textbook from one of those textbook sellers mid December
- Sent me a tracking # (book shipped via Newgistics, USPS-based company).
- USPS said they delivered the package on Dec 28th (package has delivery confirmation).
- Came back to my apartment on the 30th to see there's no package.

What I've done so far:
- Contacted the website's customer support who contacted the seller.
- The seller is still providing the tracking # which states the package was delivered.
- Contacted the manager who states she doesn't know anything about the package.

Since it's USPS and we're not sure about insurance, it would seem filing a missing shipment would be out of my favor in terms of getting my money back. The odd thing is... IF the mailman did deliver the package to my address, the only people that would swipe a package are those on my floor (3rd). I doubt any of my neighbors would stand up and say they have our package if they swiped it. There's no other reason for them to come on the 3rd floor unless they live there or if someone else was hosting a party.

So... what's the safest way of ensuring that I get the textbook or my money back?

Update:
- Went to PO, the mailman that delivered the package said he delivered it to my door.
- Emailed the customer support of the website, they said I'm SOL and to file a missing package claim.

Boo.
 
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Have you asked any of your neighbors if they grabbed it? Someone might have noticed you weren't home and grabbed it for you, then forgot about it.
 
Unless it was sent insured, I think you've little or no luck getting help or $ from the USPS. Best you can do USPS-wise is to ask if the regular mailman remembers delivering that day. Was so-called delivery about the same time he usually delivers the mail? Other than that you can dispute non-receipt of textbook to your credit card company and dispute the charge.
 
That is the problem with DC.

Shippers can use it to cover themselves; all it is is for the USPS to state that they had it in their hands at the destination and planned on delivering it.

The package can be scanned at the PO and claimed delivered - you have no way to prove otherwise.

I find that using insurance forces a signature and the cost is only a $1 or so more.
 
DC does not guarantee that the package was delivered, nor is it any sort of insurance. The seller is still on the hook for either getting you a book, or refunding the money.
 
Have you gone to the post office yet? Have them look into it and talk to the carrier that works in your area. Could be they left it with a neighbor or office.
 
alrocky said:
Unless it was sent insured, I think you've little or no luck getting help or $ from the USPS. Best you can do USPS-wise is to ask if the regular mailman remembers delivering that day. Was so-called delivery about the same time he usually delivers the mail? Other than that you can dispute non-receipt of textbook to your credit card company and dispute the charge.
Click to expand...

Even if insured, if left at the address provided...it was delivered.

You need to fall back on renter's or homeowners insurance at that point.

If you are in an apartment, see if packages can be sent to the office. If not get a PO Box.
 
If not insured the OP is most likely SOL. If insured the OP/sender can file a claim for non-receipt and possibly be reimbursed. If sent Insured requiring Signature, he can claim his signature not on form and claim reimbursement. However, it probably was not insured and the OP is SOL. Think his best bet is file a claim with his CC company. He could raise a stink and FWIW write a letter to the local PostMaster.
 
bhanson said:
The package was delivered to the buyer's front door.
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No, the package was Scanned as Delivered. We don't know where it was delivered.

OP should state if the time it was scanned is around the time he usually receives mail. He should contact P.O. and ask if Regular was on duty and if he recalls package. (Yeah, he probably doesn't recall.)
 
alrocky said:
No, the package was Scanned as Delivered. We don't know where it was delivered.

OP should state if the time it was scanned is around the time he usually receives mail. He should contact P.O. and ask if Regular was on duty and if he recalls package. (Yeah, he probably doesn't recall.)
Click to expand...

Delivery to the indicated address is implicit.

It is the buyer's responsibility to pick up the package and if it is stolen fault is most certainly not on the seller. If the buyer is not willing to assume risk for a package being stolen after delivery then they should request signature confirmation or be there close to when it arrives.
 
alrocky said:
NO it's not implicit. It could have been mis-delivered. Scanning a package adds no credence that it was correctly delivered.

The rest of your post is also mis-guided.
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The package could have been delivered somewhere else. The USPS guy could have stolen the package and scanned it as delivered. With signature confirmation the package could have still been delivered somewhere else. None of these scenarios are very likely but a package getting lifted after sitting outside for two days sure does.

I'm not even sure what point you're trying to make. We both agree that the OP is SOL. You say my post is mis-guided but you don't specify what.

Btw. 0.999... = 1. While the percentage of successfully delivered packages is most certainly not this high, it's high enough that you can safely assume your package will get to its intended destination.

Under your description there is almost zero point in getting delivery confirmation.
 
bhanson said:
Btw. 0.999... = 1. While the percentage of successfully delivered packages is most certainly not this high, it's high enough that you can safely assume your package will get to its intended destination.
Click to expand...

I have fallen into the percentage that did not have successful delivery before. I ordered a couple of (thankfully extremely cheap books) from Buy.com and had them sent to my office. We have one of the USPS outdoor cluster boxes, which happens to have a camera pointed right at it, as well as cameras covering the entire parking lot and all building entrances. I go to look up the status on the books one day, and it says delivered at like 8:30am that day. Problem is, the mailman doesn't come until 3pm. Just for kicks, I check the video for the entire day (it was only about noon by this point), and of course the mailman hadn't come yet. I called Buy.com at about 1pm, and they pointed to the delivery confirmation and said it was delivered, even though I told them I had video that showed it wasn't and could get the statement of the mailman to corroborate, but of course they couldn't care less. I caught him the next day and asked him about the package, and he didn't remember seeing or delivering it.

I ended up being out like $10, but it was also the last time I ever ordered from Buy.com
 
Oceanas said:
I have fallen into the percentage that did not have successful delivery before. I ordered a couple of (thankfully extremely cheap books) from Buy.com and had them sent to my office. We have one of the USPS outdoor cluster boxes, which happens to have a camera pointed right at it, as well as cameras covering the entire parking lot and all building entrances. I go to look up the status on the books one day, and it says delivered at like 8:30am that day. Problem is, the mailman doesn't come until 3pm. Just for kicks, I check the video for the entire day (it was only about noon by this point), and of course the mailman hadn't come yet. I called Buy.com at about 1pm, and they pointed to the delivery confirmation and said it was delivered, even though I told them I had video that showed it wasn't and could get the statement of the mailman to corroborate, but of course they couldn't care less. I caught him the next day and asked him about the package, and he didn't remember seeing or delivering it.

I ended up being out like $10, but it was also the last time I ever ordered from Buy.com
Click to expand...

I don't see how it is the fault of Buy.com. In fact, I don't know if any vendor would send you another set of books or refund your money.

If you sold something on FS/FT or Ebay and the buyer claimed the package never showed up despite a positive delivery confirmation, would you replace the item?
 
bhanson said:
I don't see how it is the fault of Buy.com. In fact, I don't know if any vendor would send you another set of books or refund your money.

If you sold something on FS/FT or Ebay and the buyer claimed the package never showed up despite a positive delivery confirmation, would you replace the item?
Click to expand...

If you just shipped with DC, you'd be an idiot. Shipping with insurance would protect you, as a seller, in the event that the package was not actually delivered.
 
bhanson said:
I don't see how it is the fault of Buy.com. In fact, I don't know if any vendor would send you another set of books or refund your money.
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If I pay for an item, it's the seller's responsibility to get it to me. If, like in my case, I have absolute proof it's not been delivered, absolutely it is their problem to make right. The mistake could have been with USPS, but it could just as easily have been that Buy.com put the wrong address on the shipping label. I paid to have a set of books delivered to me and they weren't. The problem was either with USPS or Buy.com, but not with me. I did everything correctly on my end. There is a reason that insurance is for the shipper, not the receiver.

The books happened to be a personal purchase, but I order all IT related supplies and equipment for my company. More than once, I've had computers shipped via FedEx and UPS show up online as delivered, including a copy of a signature of someone that doesn't work for my company. All it took to get the problem fixed was a call to the supplier. Sometimes they would ship a new item immediately while they were tracking down the original package, other times they would track down the original package in a day or two. They've never said "Oh sorry, it says delivered so you are SOL." If they did, I'd be calling up American Express and getting a chargeback all day long.

bhanson said:
If you sold something on FS/FT or Ebay and the buyer claimed the package never showed up despite a positive delivery confirmation, would you replace the item?
Click to expand...
I deal only with Craigslist to avoid this problem. If I did though, I would purchase insurance for every package, as it's there to protect me, not the buyer. I would certainly try and track down the package as much as possible by contacting USPS and let them know I have what appears to be a lost package, contact the Postmaster at the delivery Post Office and try to see what they can do to help, then file an insurance claim and replace the package if it can't be found.
 
bhanson said:
The package could have been delivered somewhere else. The USPS guy could have stolen the package and scanned it as delivered. With signature confirmation the package could have still been delivered somewhere else. None of these scenarios are very likely but a package getting lifted after sitting outside for two days sure does.

I'm not even sure what point you're trying to make. We both agree that the OP is SOL. You say my post is mis-guided but you don't specify what.

Under your description there is almost zero point in getting delivery confirmation.
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Your first paragraph is correct. The point is that your previous post #13 is just dead wrong. And I do not agree with your last statement. Your post #15 is misguided in that the P.O. has some liability in leaving a package outside of the mailbox. Collecting on that is another matter. And yes the OP is most likely SOL.
bhanson said:
I don't see how it is the fault of Buy.com. In fact, I don't know if any vendor would send you another set of books or refund your money.
Click to expand...
He was agreeing with me that a Scanned Delivery Confirmation does not demonstrate IMPLICT truth or accuracy of correct delivery.
 
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alrocky said:
Your first paragraph is correct. The point is that your previous post #13 is just dead wrong. And I do not agree with your last statement. Your post #15 is misguided in that the P.O. has some liability in leaving a package outside of the mailbox. Collecting on that is another matter. And yes the OP is most likely SOL.

He was agreeing with me that a Scanned Delivery Confirmation does not demonstrate IMPLICT truth or accuracy of correct delivery.
Click to expand...

I guess I could have phrased post #13 as:

The package was probably delivered to the buyer's front door.

To me that qualifies as getting the package to the buyer fulfilling the seller's portion of the agreement.
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This is more technically accurate since I do not know with 100% confidence the package was delivered. Since the package was most likely delivered I didn't feel the need to be that specific.

I personally don't feel the PO has any liability for a package left at the doorstep. It is unreasonable for the PO to be at the mercy of the receiving person being home with the exception of explicit signature confirmation.

Delivery confirmation does indeed imply the package was delivered to the correct location.

im·ply Verb /imˈplī/
Strongly suggest the truth or existence of (something not expressly stated)
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A scanned delivery confirmation strongly suggests that the package was delivered to the correct location (most packages are). Therefore a scanned delivery confirmation implies that the package was delivered to the correct location.

A scanned delivery confirmation does not confirm accurate delivery, but it certainly does imply it. Use of imply does not require 100% accuracy.
 
I once had package tracking say "Delivered, left on front porch" with my real address. Got home. nothing. As I am on the phone with UPS...my neighbor 2 houses down said there was a package left for me on her back patio.

Tracking info: "Delivered to 220 mystreet left on front porch"
Real Life info: Delivered to 224 mystreet left on back patio
 
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