So, looks like the ps3 is completely hacked.

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Minjin

Platinum Member
Jan 18, 2003
2,208
1
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So can I. I'll be spending $80 in Jan, then $140 in Feb on two games alone. Plus $100 if you count the PS Move I will be buying between now and Feb, and the gun attachment for KZ2.

What I don't pay for are games that I don't know if I will like, and there are no demo for. I call it try before you buy. And I've gladly done it, like with Mass Effect.
Since you seem willing to spend the money, how about spending it on a rental subscription? $20 a month gets you a blockbuster subscription that gives you 3 out a time. Most people probably don't play a game for longer than a month so even if it was only one out at a time, you're still saving money.
 

Ross Ridge

Senior member
Dec 21, 2009
830
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To restore OtherOS, you have to allow the system to run unsigned code from within the PS3 interface, there is no other way around it. Once it was removed from the firmware, my understanding is that they have to use an unsigned launcher to run it. If they enable the ability to run unsigned code at the main interface, they have opened the door for piracy. There's no other way to do it.

No, they could keep Sony's keys a secret and create a launcher that could launch OtherOS and only OtherOS. They can use their own truly secure keys if necessary to prevent the their launcher from running any software they don't allow.

Of course in the end it won't matter. Even if they're comitted to not allowing piracy, even if they go so far stop everything and destroy all thier work, the cat is out of the bag. Someone else will find the keys and do the work necessary to allow piracy (and cheating) on the PlayStation 3. That is, assuming what they've been saying is actually true.
 

Minjin

Platinum Member
Jan 18, 2003
2,208
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and cheating? how does piracy correlate to cheating?
Allow people to run their own software and you allow aim bots or wall hacks or even just a modified version of the original software that gives you an advantage.
 

RedRooster

Diamond Member
Sep 14, 2000
6,596
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Basically what the PC gaming world turned into. Just chaos.
Hopefully it won't be that bad though, it would ruin PSN. I pray for Sony.
 

herkulease

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2001
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I wonder if sony using the same value instead of a random value to generate keys is something they figure "its so stupid it might just work" type deal.
 

Dumac

Diamond Member
Dec 31, 2005
9,391
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Ugh, this shit pisses me off.

1% of the population will use this for something positive, while the other 99% will pirate or cheat to high hell
 

Tristicus

Diamond Member
Feb 2, 2008
8,107
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www.wallpapereuphoria.com
Since you seem willing to spend the money, how about spending it on a rental subscription? $20 a month gets you a blockbuster subscription that gives you 3 out a time. Most people probably don't play a game for longer than a month so even if it was only one out at a time, you're still saving money.

Because Blockbuster is shitty, and I'd still have to spend money on what would be a demo for me because devs won't release them. Plus I spend money on Netflix, and I don't even find that completely worth it. And if it is worth spending my money on, I buy it. I played BF:BC2 for a month, maybe, put it down, picked it back up and have put 50 hours into it (give or take) the past two or three weeks. I keep games for a long long time, never sell my old copies (rarely). I still even have Motorstorm and Resistance FoM (first) from when I first got my PS3, just because I don't sell games. Until devs start releasing demos for games I'm iffy about, as long as they are multi-platform (IE PC and PS3), I'll try before I buy. If not, I grab it used or bargain bin it down the road.


Basically, if you want me to buy your game, give me a good reason (a demo). Otherwise, if it is something I've never heard of before/played, I'll pass. Splatterhouse for instance.
 
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VulgarDisplay

Diamond Member
Apr 3, 2009
6,188
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Someone should use this to get keyboard/mouse support for all games on the PS3. They do that and they're onto something.
 

Ross Ridge

Senior member
Dec 21, 2009
830
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Someone should use this to get keyboard/mouse support for all games on the PS3. They do that and they're onto something.

Unlike on the Xbox 360, Sony allows any PlayStation 3 game to support mice if they want. There's nothing in the hardware or firmware that prevents a game using a mouse, it's just that most game developers don't bother to add support for one. You have either have to hack in mouse support into every game individually, a very, very difficult task, or create a generic mouse to joystick emulator (like existing hardware devices), which wouldn't really be proper mouse support.
 

Narmer

Diamond Member
Aug 27, 2006
5,292
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So, wasn't there supposed to be some type of update to this thread or the hackers were supposed to released something the next day? It's been a couple of days now...
 

RavenSEAL

Diamond Member
Jan 4, 2010
8,661
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So, wasn't there supposed to be some type of update to this thread or the hackers were supposed to released something the next day? It's been a couple of days now...

They said they're "cleaning up" their tools and they won't be released until later this month. Check their twitter.
 

Narmer

Diamond Member
Aug 27, 2006
5,292
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They said they're "cleaning up" their tools and they won't be released until later this month. Check their twitter.
If this is as big of a deal as people say it is, my guess is Sony got to them. Carrot and stick.
 

mugs

Lifer
Apr 29, 2003
48,920
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I haven't been buying many new games lately, but I love coming back here for a dose of RavenSEAL fanboyism.
 

BD2003

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
16,815
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Stuff as a result of this hack has been trickling out for the past few days. It remains to be seen how long it'll take to port homebrew from the old jailbreak method to the new, but already some backups are working that weren't beforehand. I'm sure everyone is racing to beat each other, so the next couple of days should see some solid homebrew releases I bet.

The cat is entirely out of the bag at this point though, eith every possible security key posted all over the place. No amount of money or legal action, not even a nuclear strike can stop this hack at this point, end of story.
 

Tristicus

Diamond Member
Feb 2, 2008
8,107
5
61
www.wallpapereuphoria.com
It would be awesome for Geohot to work for a company and try to make a system that couldn't be cracked like the PS3 (except actual security, if in fact the smug guys in the conference were right). Very surprised Apple didn't hire him actually.
 

Ross Ridge

Senior member
Dec 21, 2009
830
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What's kind of sad is that anyone knowledgable about crytology and the ECDSA algorithim used by Sony should've noticed immediately that their implementation wasn't working right. The parameters, R, n, K, and Da, geohot gives in the link above are what you need to your own signing. The "n" parameter is a constant based on the ecliptic curve used and doesn't need to be a secret. The "K" parameter is the now infamous random number that should've changed everytime something was signed. "Da" is the private key that's supposed to be kept secret but was easily discovered because "K" never changed.

"R" however, is part of the signature. It's not supposed to be a secret, it's used to verify the executable (or whatever) was actually signed by Sony, not any one else, and not modified in anyway. It's also not supposed to be a constant, each signature should have its own unique "R" value, but becase "K" never changes, neither does "R". Just by looking at the signatures their implentation generated, and seeing how half the signature is always the same, they could've seen that something was wrong. Ironically if they hadn't gone to the additional and unnecessary step of encrypting the signature in the executable it would've been blindingly obvious even to third-party developers who knew little about cryptology. This could've been caught and fixed before the PlayStation 3 was ever released to the public, if Sony had just been dumb and not also stupidly paranoid.

The prahase "Epic Fail" gets way over used, but this time...

(As for the rest of the constants, the "pub" parameter is probably Sony's now uninteresting ECDSA public key. "erk" and "riv" are the secret parameters of the AES encryption method used to encrypt executables.)
 

jrphoenix

Golden Member
Feb 29, 2004
1,295
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I the cracking of the PS3 may usher in 2 things for the future of gaming.

1. A PS pay service (like xbox live) for gaming... so they can brick your system when you go online to play pirated games. They may brick away w/o a pay service but, who knows?

2. The future for MS & PS is a steam like service. Buy games digitally only. The industry, other than gamestop, will be all for this.
 

BD2003

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
16,815
1
81
I the cracking of the PS3 may usher in 2 things for the future of gaming.

1. A PS pay service (like xbox live) for gaming... so they can brick your system when you go online to play pirated games. They may brick away w/o a pay service but, who knows?

2. The future for MS & PS is a steam like service. Buy games digitally only. The industry, other than gamestop, will be all for this.

No company has ever tried anything as daring as remotely bricking a piece of technology that was used in ways they didn't intend. I seriously doubt any of them want to be the first. No one has even stepped up to the level that MS has with it's XBL banning, but that's just them refusing to provide you with a paid service...to completely render useless something YOU own....I honestly doubt that's legal anywhere.

Surely digital distribution is going to be huge, but that's got it's own set of problems and its hardly the cure to piracy - see the apple app store, wiiware, etc - all digital only, all rampant with piracy.

The only thing I'm 100% sure of is that whatever crazy scheme the industry will come up with, hackers will always find a way around. Their track record is damn near perfect.
 

JD50

Lifer
Sep 4, 2005
11,750
2,335
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I haven't been buying many new games lately, but I love coming back here for a dose of RavenSEAL fanboyism.

IIRC he's only 17 and still in high school. Surprising I know, he acts much younger.

Sorry RavenSEAL, hackers always win. And by hackers I don't mean crackers, which is what a lot of people are actually talking about.
 

chalmers

Platinum Member
Mar 14, 2008
2,565
0
76
IIRC he's only 17 and still in high school. Surprising I know, he acts much younger.

Sorry RavenSEAL, hackers always win. And by hackers I don't mean crackers, which is what a lot of people are actually talking about.

If he's 17 then that means the primetime of his gaming life has been this generation of consoles only (lmao), rendering his opinions basically worthless to me.