so I go the brake shop...

[overst33r]

I sign up for the 100 dollar fee to have my pads and drums replaced and resurface everything because my car is shaking when i brake. the guy then proceeds to tell me that my rear cylinders are leaking. All he did was pull back the rubber casing and the fluid comes leaking out, i have been driving the car in that condition for 10K and i took the wheels off myself the day before and everything was dry.

He then tells me it would cost another 230 bucks to replace all four of them in addition to replacing the calipers and some other stuff which i declined. He made me sign a disclaimer that i am aware of the leak and i didnt want to fix it. I was going to decline the entire service and go somewhere else, but he said he cannot do that because he has already started machining the rotors. I hate it when you come in to have one thing done and they end up more than tripling the amount it costs due to "safety issues". I understand if my car was in horrible condition, but it is not, i had an inspection done a few months ago and something like that just doesnt happen all of a sudden. Also now that i have the disclaimer signed who knows what he can do to my car and just blame it on the leaks...

/rant

 

[stinkycheese]

What was he going to do if you refused to sign the disclaimer? Stop machining the rotors? Fix the cylinders and force you to pay? He probably could have just written down somewhere that he told you about the leaks. I would bet he's trying to cover up something, like damaging one of the casings when he pulled it back. Sounds like a shady place to me.

 

[overst33r]

Originally posted by: stinkycheese
What was he going to do if you refused to sign the disclaimer? Stop machining the rotors? Fix the cylinders and force you to pay? He probably could have just written down somewhere that he told you about the leaks. I would bet he's trying to cover up something, like damaging one of the casings when he pulled it back. Sounds like a shady place to me.

i told him i did not want to do anything after he gave me the estimate and he then told me that i would either have to do at least the resurfacing and changing of the cylinders OR i would have to sign a disclaimer...so i had no choice, but to sign the disclaimer so he could just change the pads and shoes and machine the rotors and drums...the place is Just Brakes, i definitely will not be going there anymore. If i notice ANYTHING out of the ordinary i will go back and demand a refund...

 

[chairbornrangerx]

I would NEVER go to a brake shop reguardless... befriend a mechanic or something who won't screw you over. I always do my own brakes, they are actually easy even drums aren't bad. You should learn how to fix your own brakes.

 

[overst33r]

Originally posted by: chairbornrangerx
I would NEVER go to a brake shop reguardless... befriend a mechanic or something who won't screw you over. I always do my own brakes, they are actually easy even drums aren't bad. You should learn how to fix your own brakes.

that is next on my list believe me. i just feel sorry for other people that are too busy to do their own brakes.

 

[runzwithsizorz]

I used to do all my own brake work, now I'm just lazy, however, the shop doesn't know that, *I know*, and that I have examined the brakes before taking it in. If the cylinders WERE leaking you would have noticed a loss of fluid, braking, AND the tell tale linking fluid on the insides of the drums. A visual of the rotors would tell you if they really needed turning;(I have a mic, there are tolerable limits), Looking at them after the the fact won't help, for many have squirt bottles with old fluid for just that reason. The calipers??? what did you do, drive the car without pads??? Then theres the master cylinder, save this for last for theres no way to tell unless you disassemble,-- " disassemble=dead, dead=disassemble, FIVE is alive, noooooo disassemble". The disclaimer is standard practice, and may be required by law; " ok lady, but if you drive away AND YOU DIE!!!!, we're not responsible",(gets em every time).
This scam is almost as old as I am, but not quite, in my day we just put our feet down through the floorboard.

 

[j00fek]

another reason to do your own car repairs

 

[chuckywang]

I don't have a torque wrench, so I can't do my own brakes.

 

[chuckywang]

Also, you should get your rotors replaced, not machined. Machining your rotors will only make them warp faster.

 

[Scarpozzi]

Originally posted by: chuckywang
I don't have a torque wrench, so I can't do my own brakes.

Since when do you need a torque wrench?

You can buy rotors through Autozone if you need them. The rest of the stuff may take 2 people if you have to bleed the brakes....it's pretty easy to do that stuff if you know what you're doing.

 

[funboy6942]

Originally posted by: j00fek
another reason to do your own car repairs

QFT only like the 400 billionth time. And brakes, tune ups, oil changes are the most done to a car that is the easiest to do yourself, and cheapest, that shop rip people off of the most on.

This should be something that is taught to everyone in school how to do along with changing, rotating, and plugging a tire. Its pretty much all the same stuff for every single car so it would come in handy in EVERY persons life, unlike for most social studies, History, or algebra. It would save you more money over your life time doing thoes simple repairs yourself then most of the classes studied in school would.

I mean great you added up all the apples in your shopping cart, what money did that save you? You did a oil change yourself for under $10 when it used to cost you $35 at Jiffy lube. What did that save you? Now times that every 6 months or 3-5K miles . Then times that over the 50 years your well enough to crawl under your car and do a oil change on your own.

And thats just what you saved on a oil change, not including brakes, tune ups, tire repair/rotations, and tow truck costs to come put your spare on

You could have a very nice savings to invest if you stop with the mentality that, I can pay someone to do that, then bitch you wanna save money and invest
Or you bitch the shop you went to screwed you or tired to screw you because you didnt want to do it or learn to do it yourself and not get fvcked up the ass anymore

 

[AMCRambler]

Originally posted by: Scarpozzi

Originally posted by: chuckywang
I don't have a torque wrench, so I can't do my own brakes.

Since when do you need a torque wrench?

You can buy rotors through Autozone if you need them. The rest of the stuff may take 2 people if you have to bleed the brakes....it's pretty easy to do that stuff if you know what you're doing.

Yeah you really don't need a torque wrench to do your brakes. A good set of sockets, maybe a couple hex head sockets, a pair of pliers and a c-clamp is all I need.

1) unscrew cap on master cylinder
2) take wheel off
3) remove caliper slides
4) pull caliper off
5) remove old pads
6) compress caliper piston with c-clamp
6) put new pads in place and reinstall caliper with slide pins
7) profit

Over simplified perhaps, byt that's really all that's involved in changing your pads.

 

[j00fek]

Originally posted by: chuckywang
I don't have a torque wrench, so I can't do my own brakes.

your not serious are you?

 

[Sphexi]

Classic BS, never let them tell you what you need repaired, unless you know about it ahead of time, or get a second opinion. I went to a Midas once to get my brakes down when I was in college, they came back and said that the parking brake was broken, the cable was twisted. I already knew about it, didn't care since it was a standard and I never used the PB. Guy told me I couldn't drive out of there without it, as it was part of the state inspection and having it broken meant that I was "breaking the law". Being a college student I said go ahead and fix it, God forbid I break the law. Charged me an extra $100 for it, and it STILL didn't work afterwards. I went back, said it was still broken, they found some other reason for it to not work, said I"d have to pay for that too.

At that point I told them to shove it, take my car down, and I drove out of there.

 

[Vette73]

Yep never go to a place that has the "$XXX special service...".


When I ran my shop I would give a real estimate and I had some people always say well that place says its only $100... I always told them if they think they can get a good brake job for that price go for it. I had 1 person leave my shop and go to one. Next time I saw him he said there was more wrong with his car and I must have missed it. :roll: Mind you all this "missed" stuff cost over $500.

 

[spaceman]

they always pull some random part out of their ass.
you should'a done what every red blooded american should do.
punch him right in the fvcking head.

 

[KrillBee]

Originally posted by: Sphexi

MIDAS is the worst, they charged my $40 to pull the codes off of my car (they told me they were going to diagnose each code too, to determine the cause, but they didnt)

Autozone pulls the codes for free, while midas charges 40 bucks, what a rip.

 

[runzwithsizorz]

Originally posted by: funboy42


QFT only like the 400 billionth time. And brakes,*** tune ups,***

{Yo; Fanboy, looked under a hood reacently? we're not talking points, plugs, rotors, condensers, and a 2 barrel carb here anymore son;(takes me 5 minutes just to get to my air cleaner!) }
***oil changes***

{if I bring in my own oil & filter I can get the job done for less than $15, plus I don't have to worry about the old oil disposal, and my driveway is spotless}

***This should be something that is taught to everyone in school***

News flash, Fanboy; auto shop, wood shop, drivers ed, etc, have all gone by the wayside, (them nasty budget cuts and all). Besides, I can afford to have someone else do the work, makes me glad I stayed in school and learned all that other stuff.

 

[ViviTheMage]

I need to do my brakes soon...but I have a '00 Jetta 1.8T so I have to bring it to the shop to get them done, they have a special tool thats about 100$ or so to spin them back and place the new pads in....not just a C Clamp.

 

[funboy6942]

Originally posted by: runzwithsizorz

Originally posted by: funboy42


QFT only like the 400 billionth time. And brakes,*** tune ups,***

{Yo; Fanboy, looked under a hood reacently? we're not talking points, plugs, rotors, condensers, and a 2 barrel carb here anymore son;(takes me 5 minutes just to get to my air cleaner!) }
***oil changes***

{if I bring in my own oil & filter I can get the job done for less than $15, plus I don't have to worry about the old oil disposal, and my driveway is spotless}

***This should be something that is taught to everyone in school***

News flash, Fanboy; auto shop, wood shop, drivers ed, etc, have all gone by the wayside, (them nasty budget cuts and all). Besides, I can afford to have someone else do the work, makes me glad I stayed in school and learned all that other stuff.

Well you sorta proved my point on the tune up, it should be easier then back in the bay because most of them have coils on lugs. And yes I have looked. You move the stupid plastic cover that makes people freak put and get overwhelmed when they open their hood and it should be no more then removing a bolt to take off the coil, remove the plug, reverse order, done.

Not all do what you do for an oil change

And you have me there on the school, why I should open one one and teach the basics since its not done anymore for thoes who want to learn.

Shouldnt matter if you went to school or not and get paid big bucks. Whats your time worth in being stranded on the side of the road waiting on AAA to come put your spare on?whats your money worth when the shop is selling you repairs that dont need to be done, or they dont even do them at all because you "went to school" to pay that "stupid" person who is ripping you off of your money Whos stupid at that point because your not smart enough to know what they are talking about or what to look for if what they charged you for was actually done? Its their word saying it has to be daone (and most of the time like 75% of the time it didnt need to be done) and your "hard earned" money you gave away for nothing

If your so smart in going to school to learn you should be smart enough to atleast educate yourself in understanding what needs to be done so you can understand what is being told to you and that the work got done because you know what to look for. No one says you have to go into that field. Just get a education in it so you wont get taken if you decide to go have you car worked on. People brag about how smart they were to go get the education to go pay someone to work on their cars but bitch because they were not smart enough to go learn enough about their own cars to not get fvcked out of the hard earned money they spend all the time studying to make. That to me is stupid. Wouldnt catch me bragging about how smart I was to go to school to pay someone to work on something I have no clue on so they can screw me out of my money. Why you go to school then, so you can afford to pay for the times you get screwed at the shops?

 

[funboy6942]

Originally posted by: ViviTheMage
I need to do my brakes soon...but I have a '00 Jetta 1.8T so I have to bring it to the shop to get them done, they have a special tool thats about 100$ or so to spin them back and place the new pads in....not just a C Clamp.

DOOD that part is not $100, more like $15-25 at any regular auto part store. You think your Jetta is the only one that needs to have the rear calipers spun in? I know off the top of my head that some Cadillacs, and hondas, and acuras need to as well as many others. My brother called me a few months ago because he was doing hi swon brakes and couldnt press the rear calipers in. I told them then if they cant be pressed in they are turned in. He turned them in by hind without buying a tool.

Again, shops and dealerships scaring the piss out of you making you think is sooo hard you must bring it in.

At any auto part store they will sell you for $10 a manual that shows and tells you with words and pictures step by step how to do almost any repair on your car. Plus you buy the tools your buddys will pay you to do their brakes for them and you can start making the bucks off your friends and they know they can trust you to do it right

$58 shipped for starters

 

[ViviTheMage]

Originally posted by: funboy42

Originally posted by: ViviTheMage
I need to do my brakes soon...but I have a '00 Jetta 1.8T so I have to bring it to the shop to get them done, they have a special tool thats about 100$ or so to spin them back and place the new pads in....not just a C Clamp.

DOOD that part is not $100, more like $15-25 at any regular auto part store. You think your Jetta is the only one that needs to have the rear calipers spun in? I know off the top of my head that some Cadillacs, and hondas, and acuras need to as well as many others. My brother called me a few months ago because he was doing hi swon brakes and couldnt press the rear calipers in. I told them then if they cant be pressed in they are turned in. He turned them in by hind without buying a tool.

Again, shops and dealerships scaring the piss out of you making you think is sooo hard you must bring it in.

At any auto part store they will sell you for $10 a manual that shows and tells you with words and pictures step by step how to do almost any repair on your car. Plus you buy the tools your buddys will pay you to do their brakes for them and you can start making the bucks off your friends and they know they can trust you to do it right

$58 shipped for starters

My friend is a pontiac mechanic and he has dome hundreds of brakes (front and back). We could not spin the roters for the life of us. So I had to get a tow to the dealership and the tower actually snapped off my caliper (WTF? HOW) and I had to replace a whole caliper plus all 4 brake pads. That was a nasty bill, at a 105$ an hour mechanic -_-.

Is the front different? I just need to do the front two.

 

[funboy6942]

Originally posted by: ViviTheMage

Originally posted by: funboy42

Originally posted by: ViviTheMage
I need to do my brakes soon...but I have a '00 Jetta 1.8T so I have to bring it to the shop to get them done, they have a special tool thats about 100$ or so to spin them back and place the new pads in....not just a C Clamp.

DOOD that part is not $100, more like $15-25 at any regular auto part store. You think your Jetta is the only one that needs to have the rear calipers spun in? I know off the top of my head that some Cadillacs, and hondas, and acuras need to as well as many others. My brother called me a few months ago because he was doing hi swon brakes and couldnt press the rear calipers in. I told them then if they cant be pressed in they are turned in. He turned them in by hind without buying a tool.

Again, shops and dealerships scaring the piss out of you making you think is sooo hard you must bring it in.

At any auto part store they will sell you for $10 a manual that shows and tells you with words and pictures step by step how to do almost any repair on your car. Plus you buy the tools your buddys will pay you to do their brakes for them and you can start making the bucks off your friends and they know they can trust you to do it right

$58 shipped for starters

My friend is a pontiac mechanic and he has dome hundreds of brakes (front and back). We could not spin the roters for the life of us. So I had to get a tow to the dealership and the tower actually snapped off my caliper (WTF? HOW) and I had to replace a whole caliper plus all 4 brake pads. That was a nasty bill, at a 105$ an hour mechanic -_-.

Is the front different? I just need to do the front two.

Sounds like to me your caliper and rotor were stuck together by rust. This happens if you go through high standing water and let the car sit for a couple days. Or if you just let the car sit for month, the moisture and rain will let the brake parts start to rust and will bond together. I have seen it happen and if it is a steel wheel I usually get out my BFH (Big Fvcking Hammer) and while some one tows or tries to move the car I smack the piss out of the wheel in hopes to "jar" the rust free and make the wheel move. At that point your most likely going to have to replace the pads and rotors to be on the safe side.

Dont recommend smacking the Wheel with a BFE if they are made of anything else other then steel and you want to whack it as close to the hub as you can. Your friend being a mechanic should know thins but even in the mechanic world there is a book smart mechanic that knows only what he is tought and a street smart that has come into it once or twice without being told what to do.

If I had my choice between the two to hire for my own shop, I pick the street smart one. I had to many kids come right out of trade school mess up to many cars. Example:
I hired a new kids right out of school. I was working for Ford. Had to replace something real easy, an emblem on the side of a F150. He ruined the fender by removing it with a couble of screw drivers and a breaker bar. Had to fire him. He had scratches up and down the damn fender and I handed him the heat gun with the new emblem when I gave him the job to go do.

But sounds like rust or something got wedged in there that locked up the wheel. I would of hit it with the hammer or taken the weel off and removed the 2 lousy bolts that held the caliper on, removed it, noticed the brake pads were rusted to the rotor, bought you a new rotor and pads, and fixed it fo ryou in less then 30 minutes. Not a nice friend, IMO, who is supposed to be a mechanic and know it would take less time to do all that them to go inside, call a tow, wait for the tow, get it tow, pay someone else to do what your friend knows to do

 

[ViviTheMage]

The thing is the car never sat still for more then 1 day.

The wheels came off fine, everything else started to come off, it was just getting the caliper to slide back in was the problem (c clamp didn't work)....the rotor was fine actually. I ended up having to replace that caliper because on the tow to the shop the piston fell out... (big wtf to me to this day)...it bleed brake fluid all the way (12 miles or so).

What tool should I use when putting back the piston in the rears? (is the front the same, pistin spins back?)

btw how accurate is this DIY ?

http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2768260

I heard you also need :
rear brake caliper piston compression tool

 

[funboy6942]

Best I know, I havent been doing mechanics on new cars since 98, the fronts were pushed in and some of the backs that had calipers were pushed or spun back in. Some you can use a tool some just a big par of channel lock plyers. I dont have the full workings on the what was going on with the front. It could of been the caliper came apart, the piston could of been pushed all the way out of the sleve and that why it couldnt get pushed back in, there are to many variables. As far as leaking if the piston was pushed all the way out sure its going to leak all the fluid out because the pistons not in the sleve to hold the fluid in

I have never used a c-clamp myself on any of MY OWN cars. When I dont a job I just change it all. Pads and rotors, so I remove one pad, wedge my big ass screw driver between the old pad and rotor and push the caliper back in that way. If I screw up the rotor it doesnt matter to me because Im replacing it anyway and this way once its back in I just remove the bolts lift the caliper take off the rotor, slde the new one on, pop in the new pads, put on the bolts, then the tire, pump the pedal, start the car, pump the pedal some more, check for leaks, done. 10-15 per side tops.

If your car was towed to the shop with the caliper off the pressure from the fluid will also push the piston out of the caliper. But for your wheel not to move it is going to be stuck/rusted brake parts, something wedged into the cooling fins of the rotor wedging itself against the caliper, or a front wheel bearing gone bad. Since you didnt mention replacing a hub bearing I say rust over night, something got wedged in there, or the caliper came apart in a pressured positions locking itself to the rotor.

Feel free to pm me if you have further question, we/I done hijacked this thread enough

As for the DIY thread you linked, its a good start. He forgot one of the most important things after the brake job is complete, before you crack open another beer, PUMP THE BRAKE PEDAL!!!!!! Do this before you start the car. The first few times you pump it the pedal will go to the floor before the calipers push out and meet the rotors again. If not and you just hop in start the car and roll, you hit that pedal and OPPS you have no brakes till you finally pump the piss out if and by that time you done hit what ever. But for the most part its ok. Dont want to let your caliper hang like he did, the hose could tear, want to hang it some how if you need to set it aside for any amount of time. And not all real caliper cars will the back get pushed in like the fronts. You got pushing and it wont go in, dont force it. It needs to be turned in of the caliper is frozen and needs to be relpaced. Also I dont know of these extra things in blue hes talking about losening. Most of the time its kist 2 bolts with either a standard or metric head or a torques head.