So AMD underrates their processors...

[TecHNooB]

Ok, wth does that mean? I built a new computer recently and not knowing much about computers I didn't understand why and AMD 3500+ ran at 2.2 ghz while a Pentium 4 ran at 3.2 ghz at around the same price. People were telling me how AMD underrates their systems. So does that mean that it's running at 2.2ghz and below a certain 'safe point' and that I can overclock it a little bit without risk? Or is the 2.2 ghz on the AMD equivalent to 3.2 ghz on a pentium without me having to touch it. I've also been told the AMD is already overclocked.

 

[coomar]

a 3500+ is roughly equivalent to a 3.5 ghz P4, in HT tasks, it would be equivalent to 3.0-3.2 P4

you should be able to overclock it fairly easily to 2.5-2.6ghz depending on the motherboard used

 

[TecHNooB]

that's 3500 without touching the thing right?

 

[Corporate Thug]

right

 

[AkumaX]

Originally posted by: TecHNooB
that's 3500 without touching the thing right?

yeah, a "3500+" = 2.2ghz on socket939 and 2.4ghz on socket754

 

[DrMrLordX]

I believe you're mistaken, AkumaX. The socket754 processors that run 2.4ghz at stock are the 3400+(512mb l2) and 3700+(1mb l2)

 

[Lithan]

It's as simple as this. MHZ is a meaningless number. It's like Degrees. Take 100 degree's. Fahrenheit that's a nice, perhaps a bit on the cool side for my tastes, hottub. Celsius, that's boiling alive.

AMD outperform P4's by a huge margin when run at the same MHZ.

 

[Brunnis]

Originally posted by: TecHNooB
I've also been told the AMD is already overclocked.

That would be incorrect. There's no such thing as overclocked from factory. Overclocking is running the CPU outside of the manufacturers specifications. As you can see, this makes overclocking from the factory impossible per definition.

 

[mwmorph]

here
P4 3.2 =base pefromance.
AMD 2.2ghz S939 cpu at a 3500+ rating means it will be competitive at 2.2ghx versus a 3.5ghz pentium 4. in gaming, the amd would rape almost all p4s at 2.2ghz stock. in some other programs that use the hhyperthreading of the pentium 4, the amd will be somewhat slower.

 

[Topweasel]

Originally posted by: Brunnis

Originally posted by: TecHNooB
I've also been told the AMD is already overclocked.

That would be incorrect. There's no such thing as overclocked from factory. Overclocking is running the CPU outside of the manufacturers specifications. As you can see, this makes overclocking from the factory impossible per definition.

Cept there will alway be the old P3 1.13GHz that got recalled because it failed Overclocking Stability tests.

 

[lifeguard1999]

Originally posted by: Topweasel

Originally posted by: Brunnis

Originally posted by: TecHNooB
I've also been told the AMD is already overclocked.

That would be incorrect. There's no such thing as overclocked from factory. Overclocking is running the CPU outside of the manufacturers specifications. As you can see, this makes overclocking from the factory impossible per definition.

Cept there will alway be the old P3 1.13GHz that got recalled because it failed Overclocking Stability tests.

QFT

 

[Aenslead]

what does "QFT" mean?

 

[Topweasel]

Originally posted by: Aenslead
what does "QFT" mean?

Quoted for truth.

 

[theMan]

it can also mean Quit Fvcking Talking

anyway, at the factory, they make cpus of the same core, and then they test them, and the ones that can go fast become 3500s and the ones that go slower become 3000s. so, if they take one that should be a 3200 and make it a 3000 running at 1.8ghz, overclocking it to 2.0ghz would be easy.

 

[redhatlinux]

Must correct the statement about 'outside the specs'. It should be 'outside the tested specs'. You, as the consumer pay for the testing. AMD has shipped processors that will exceed the tested specs for decades. Any one remember the slot A processors. When the case was opened, the chip inside was frequently rated and tested at a higher speed. Dresden makes great CPU's and most of them perform faster than the tested speed. Its very true that megaherz is a misleading indicator of processor speed. Intel processors do very little work per clock cycle. They have a massively long pipe line. AMD does much more work per cycle, with a much shorter pipe. The big penalty on Intel is flushing the pipe and the trace cache when a branch prediction or other situation occurs. Its kinda like a factory production line that has built a lot of cars only to find out that they all needed power mirrors and power seats right at the end of the line. They must all go back to the start and be rebuilt.

 

[lifeguard1999]

Originally posted by: theman
it can also mean Quit Fvcking Talking

anyway, at the factory, they make cpus of the same core, and then they test them, and the ones that can go fast become 3500s and the ones that go slower become 3000s. so, if they take one that should be a 3200 and make it a 3000 running at 1.8ghz, overclocking it to 2.0ghz would be easy.

QFT in this case meant "Quoted for truth." The P3 1.13GHz would be the exception that proves the Brunnis' rule "Overclocking is running the CPU outside of the manufacturers specifications.".

In general, theman is right. The process he describes is called "binning". The problem is that sometimes more cpus of the same core end up passing the 3500 test, but OEMs need more 3000's since they are cheaper and are in more demand. So they sell some 3500s as 3000s. That makes for a nice CPU that can o/c well.

ATI has that problem right now. They have more R420, R423, and R480 chips than they need, especially with the R520 right around the corner. So they take three different chips and put them in one card - the X800GT/GTO. Adventuresome people can then o/c the card very well, or even unlock addition pixel pipes to go from a 12 pipeline card to a 16 pipeline card.

 

[jiffylube1024]

Originally posted by: TecHNooB
Ok, wth does that mean? I built a new computer recently and not knowing much about computers I didn't understand why and AMD 3500+ ran at 2.2 ghz while a Pentium 4 ran at 3.2 ghz at around the same price. People were telling me how AMD underrates their systems.

AMD does underrate their system slightly for 2 reasons. #1 is that they're not the market leader, so they have to be extremely competitive (read: faster) at each speed stepping.

So does that mean that it's running at 2.2ghz and below a certain 'safe point' and that I can overclock it a little bit without risk?

No it means exactly what you guessed - that at 2.2 Ghz, it's already about equal to a P4 at 3.2 Ghz.

I've also been told the AMD is already overclocked.

This comment makes no sense - it can't be overclocked at stock speed. But what you were thinking was correct - there is quite a bit of overclocking headroom in these chips, and they can often get another 200+ MHz with little problems on stock cooling.

 

[Geomagick]

The naming system on AMD chips is to help the consumer. Read 3500 is a bigger and therefore faster number than 3000.

It would actually make a lot of sense not to even mention in a PC's literature what MHz the CPU runs at.

However for the enthusiast market, which is a tiny proportion of PC sales albeit a growing market the MHz rating and feature set become more important.

As for overclocking, I'd get to grips with a new system first before trying to enhance it. Remember overclocking in the vast majority of instances will invalidate the warranty and can damage your PC. Trust me on that one I've done it.

 

[sluthy]

Yeah, for instance a A64 3800+ (single core) and a A64 X2 3800+ (dual core) have different clock speeds (and cache sizes). So each core is slower, but working together they're about the same. Hence they're both equivalent to a 3.8GHz P4 supposedly.

 

[Acanthus]

Originally posted by: Topweasel

Originally posted by: Brunnis

Originally posted by: TecHNooB
I've also been told the AMD is already overclocked.

That would be incorrect. There's no such thing as overclocked from factory. Overclocking is running the CPU outside of the manufacturers specifications. As you can see, this makes overclocking from the factory impossible per definition.

Cept there will alway be the old P3 1.13GHz that got recalled because it failed Overclocking Stability tests.

They clocked it too high at the factory, that doesnt mean it was "overclocked".

Overclocking is running the cpu beyond its rated speed. Intel literally set the speed too high for the architecture to maintain stability in certain situations (like putting a server with it in a hot room).